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trump had a bad day in court Login/Join 
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Lost his Motion to Dismiss in the Georgia election interference case.

https://www.washingtonpost.com...georgia-free-speech/

Lost his Motion to Dismiss in relation to his theft of classified documents.

https://www.washingtonpost.com...dential-records-act/

Dogcat, you better send him some more money. He's gonna need it for legal fees you gullible boob.


-Every damn thing is your own fault if you are any good.

 
Posts: 15094 | Registered: 20 September 2012Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
What is the minimum time it could take to toss one of his appeals?


To be fair, Motions to Dismiss in federal court are pretty much routinely filed and denied. Preserving error.

It will be an appellate issue if trump gets convicted in either case.

Tony, to answer your question.....years....any ruling on the appeal of those rulings probably occurs after his trials and assuming there is a finding of guilt.

And, it will be a multi-year process.

Exactly what trump relies upon.


-Every damn thing is your own fault if you are any good.

 
Posts: 15094 | Registered: 20 September 2012Reply With Quote
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His day wasn't bad enough.... barf
 
Posts: 15880 | Location: Iowa | Registered: 10 April 2007Reply With Quote
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Well done Mr Kirschner!

https://youtu.be/OQqsYgTXMkQ


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
What is the minimum time it could take to toss one of his appeals?


To be fair, Motions to Dismiss in federal court are pretty much routinely filed and denied. Preserving error.

It will be an appellate issue if trump gets convicted in either case.

Tony, to answer your question.....years....any ruling on the appeal of those rulings probably occurs after his trials and assuming there is a finding of guilt.

And, it will be a multi-year process.

Exactly what trump relies upon.


The real issue in Florida Federal District Court remains unresolved. Will this neophyte give President Trump a jury instruction on a defense he has no legal right to? She still has not ruled on 8 pending motions to dismiss. It is clear to me this case will not be tried before the election.
 
Posts: 10902 | Location: Somewhere above Tennessee and below Kentucky  | Registered: 31 July 2016Reply With Quote
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I've never seen a judge request jury instructions before even setting the case for trial. Bizarre.


-Every damn thing is your own fault if you are any good.

 
Posts: 15094 | Registered: 20 September 2012Reply With Quote
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Correct, just weird.

You have to present evidence to obtain a jury instruction.

You do lot just get a certain jury instruction because you ask or want it.
 
Posts: 10902 | Location: Somewhere above Tennessee and below Kentucky  | Registered: 31 July 2016Reply With Quote
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So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


No idea. But, as noted above....in 35 years of trial practice, I've never seen a judge request jury instructions from the parties when the trial is still months, if not years, away. Typically, you file proposed jury instructions within a week to 30 days before trial. And, then the parties argue about which instructions/questions are appropriate during the charge conference after the parties have put on their evidence. It's odd.


-Every damn thing is your own fault if you are any good.

 
Posts: 15094 | Registered: 20 September 2012Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


No idea. But, as noted above....in 35 years of trial practice, I've never seen a judge request jury instructions from the parties when the trial is still months, if not years, away. Typically, you file proposed jury instructions within a week to 30 days before trial. And, then the parties argue about which instructions/questions are appropriate during the charge conference after the parties have put on their evidence. It's odd.


Do you think she is being coached?


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


No idea. But, as noted above....in 35 years of trial practice, I've never seen a judge request jury instructions from the parties when the trial is still months, if not years, away. Typically, you file proposed jury instructions within a week to 30 days before trial. And, then the parties argue about which instructions/questions are appropriate during the charge conference after the parties have put on their evidence. It's odd.


Do you think she is being coached?


No, I don't think she is being coached. Not even sure what you mean by that.....All I am saying is that a federal judge asking for proposed jury instructions from the parties in a case that has not even been set for trial is extremely unusual in my experience. Unheard of, in fact. But, just my experience.


-Every damn thing is your own fault if you are any good.

 
Posts: 15094 | Registered: 20 September 2012Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


No idea. But, as noted above....in 35 years of trial practice, I've never seen a judge request jury instructions from the parties when the trial is still months, if not years, away. Typically, you file proposed jury instructions within a week to 30 days before trial. And, then the parties argue about which instructions/questions are appropriate during the charge conference after the parties have put on their evidence. It's odd.


Do you think she is being coached?


No, I don't think she is being coached. Not even sure what you mean by that.....All I am saying is that a federal judge asking for proposed jury instructions from the parties in a case that has not even been set for trial is extremely unusual in my experience. Unheard of, in fact. But, just my experience.


Did you watch the video with Glenn Kirschner that I linked earlier? It seems that even tho it doesn't apply he makes it sound like she could still choose to apply the PRA to the case with a jury instruction that he be found not guilty under the PRA. Don't know if that was part of the plan all along or someone is directing her thinking in that direction.


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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I wonder how much favoritism she'd show if he wasn't a candidate for office


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


The Federalist Society she's a member of. They are trying hard to give Trump every advantage without quite breaking the line that would give Smith a clear appealable issue. She does mostly paperless orders for that very reason. The Presidential Records Act, Trump's primary defense, has nothing to do with the espionage charges he's facing, but she won't officially acknowledge that.

Once a jury is seated she has lots more leeway to tilt the scales after double jeopardy will attach.

Don't make the mistake of assuming she's another stupid MAGAt like MTG or Boebert; by all accounts she's very smart, just out of her depth conducting an espionage case with so little trial experience. Her experience is doing Law on paper, not in a courtroom.


"If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump
 
Posts: 9574 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: 09 December 2007Reply With Quote
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Paperless orders do not exist in KY. I can prove that statement w caselaw.

For a fed judge to engage in “paperless orders” is unheard of and insanity. Such practice prevents appellate review in a meaningful manner. That is why they are not permitted in Ky courts.

I do not think she is being coached. I think she is a neophyte that is trying to hide a prejudice for the Defendant.

Note, I use the word prejudice and not bias. There is a difference.

Bias is I like my hamburger medium-rare.

Prejudice is you better not bring me a hamburger over 125 degrees, or I will throw it at you and refuse to try it.
 
Posts: 10902 | Location: Somewhere above Tennessee and below Kentucky  | Registered: 31 July 2016Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Jefffive:
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


The Federalist Society she's a member of. They are trying hard to give Trump every advantage without quite breaking the line that would give Smith a clear appealable issue. She does mostly paperless orders for that very reason. The Presidential Records Act, Trump's primary defense, has nothing to do with the espionage charges he's facing, but she won't officially acknowledge that.

Once a jury is seated she has lots more leeway to tilt the scales after double jeopardy will attach.

Don't make the mistake of assuming she's another stupid MAGAt like MTG or Boebert; by all accounts she's very smart, just out of her depth conducting an espionage case with so little trial experience. Her experience is doing Law on paper, not in a courtroom.


TY for the response.


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
I've never seen a judge request jury instructions before even setting the case for trial. Bizarre.


That was also my experience. But I can envision cases where that would happen.

Summary judgment motion practice pretrial can determine jury instructions. I had judges order me to file summary (full or partial) judgment motions. Theoretically, nothing prohibits a party or court to call a partial summary judgment motion a "Motion to Determine Jury Instructions."
 
Posts: 6121 | Location: Coeur d' Alene, Idaho, USA | Registered: 08 March 2013Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by LHeym500:
Paperless orders do not exist in KY. I can prove that statement w caselaw.

For a fed judge to engage in “paperless orders” is unheard of and insanity. Such practice prevents appellate review in a meaningful manner. That is why they are not permitted in Ky courts.

I do not think she is being coached. I think she is a neophyte that is trying to hide a prejudice for the Defendant.

Note, I use the word prejudice and not bias. There is a difference.

Bias is I like my hamburger medium-rare.

Prejudice is you better not bring me a hamburger over 125 degrees, or I will throw it at you and refuse to try it.


You're not saying that oral orders made in a court proceeding are unenforceable, are you? What about trial rulings on objections, admissibility of evidence, etc.? Must they all be reduced to writing?

Since trial proceedings are recorded and transcribed for appeal, what's the beef?

Speaking of beef, you're courting E. coli with your medium-rare hamburgers.
 
Posts: 6121 | Location: Coeur d' Alene, Idaho, USA | Registered: 08 March 2013Reply With Quote
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A Trial Court can only speak through its written orders.

An oral order that is not render into writing does not exist. If an oral pronouncement does not match the written order, the conflict is resolved by the written order.

“Circuit courts speak only through written orders entered upon the official record.” Oakley v. Oakley, 391 S.W.3d 377, 378 (Ky. App. 2012).

There is no such thing as a paperless order in Ky state courts. The reason is paperless, oral orders wo findings of fact and application of controlling law applied rendered in writing does not permit meaningful review.

Thus, there is no such thing as a “paperless order.”
 
Posts: 10902 | Location: Somewhere above Tennessee and below Kentucky  | Registered: 31 July 2016Reply With Quote
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Jefffive:
quote:
Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:
So who in all likelihood is advising Cannon on how to conduct this mess? Assume that she isn't competent to scheme this by herself.


The Federalist Society she's a member of. They are trying hard to give Trump every advantage without quite breaking the line that would give Smith a clear appealable issue. She does mostly paperless orders for that very reason. The Presidential Records Act, Trump's primary defense, has nothing to do with the espionage charges he's facing, but she won't officially acknowledge that.

Once a jury is seated she has lots more leeway to tilt the scales after double jeopardy will attach.

Don't make the mistake of assuming she's another stupid MAGAt like MTG or Boebert; by all accounts she's very smart, just out of her depth conducting an espionage case with so little trial experience. Her experience is doing Law on paper, not in a courtroom.


What do you think that Smith is lacking in order to successfully file and win a recusal motion?


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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He needs to show prejudice.

I mean there are the obvious ones like illegal conduct from the bench or conflict of interest.

Misapplying or not correctly following caselaw is not grounds, in and of itself, for removal.
 
Posts: 10902 | Location: Somewhere above Tennessee and below Kentucky  | Registered: 31 July 2016Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by LHeym500:


Misapplying or not correctly following caselaw is not grounds, in and of itself, for removal.


He could have that rectified upon appeal, no?

Can anyone simply ask her to show where in the PRA it says that trump is allowed to keep Government classified records; declassified or not?


Give me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a house full of buffalo shit.
 
Posts: 1199 | Location: IOWA | Registered: 27 October 2018Reply With Quote
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Appeal or in an extreme case a Writ of Mandamus to the Court of Appeals that has jurisdiction over the district.


Your second question is Jack Smith’s argument in a sentence framed as a question.

I pulled off a Writ of Mandamus once in state court.
 
Posts: 10902 | Location: Somewhere above Tennessee and below Kentucky  | Registered: 31 July 2016Reply With Quote
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