quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I don't know what all the hoopla is about!

Practically every country in the world does it.

Certainly better than allowing ILLEGAL immigrants in, and providing them with all sorts of support which they cannot afford.

These people bring money into the country, provide services and employment for others, and stay within the law!

It is is WIN WIN situation.

But, you lot are all concerned about stupid party politics!

It's a win, win if you happen to be very wealthy. If you are a hard-working person who has no wealth and wishes to immigrate to America, you are more or less fucked under our immigration laws. That is not what I consider to be American values. I can see how you might not agree since you were born into unimaginable wealth, that is not the case for most Americans. It is not just the idea of citizenship for 5 million that I find obnoxious, it is that combined with the general anti-immigration stance of conservatives today. They don't want more foreigners here and they refuse to reform our immigration laws. It is the combination of the two that I find disturbing. I am in no way shape or form in favor of illegal immigration, but I believe that there needs to be reform in our system.

Actually, there are visas offered for people of all walks of life to come and work, in every country, including the US.

Visas to come into a country for residency are expensive.

For those coming to work as employees, the employers pay.

For those will to invest in the country, they [sy.

So what is the problem??

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I don't know what all the hoopla is about!

Practically every country in the world does it.

Certainly better than allowing ILLEGAL immigrants in, and providing them with all sorts of support which they cannot afford.

These people bring money into the country, provide services and employment for others, and stay within the law!

It is is WIN WIN situation.

But, you lot are all concerned about stupid party politics!

It's a win, win if you happen to be very wealthy. If you are a hard-working person who has no wealth and wishes to immigrate to America, you are more or less fucked under our immigration laws. That is not what I consider to be American values. I can see how you might not agree since you were born into unimaginable wealth, that is not the case for most Americans. It is not just the idea of citizenship for 5 million that I find obnoxious, it is that combined with the general anti-immigration stance of conservatives today. They don't want more foreigners here and they refuse to reform our immigration laws. It is the combination of the two that I find disturbing. I am in no way shape or form in favor of illegal immigration, but I believe that there needs to be reform in our system.

Actually, there are visas offered for people of all walks of life to come and work, in every country, including the US.

Visas to come into a country for residency are expensive.

For those coming to work as employees, the employers pay.

For those will to invest in the country, they [sy.

So what is the problem??

The problem is that we make it very hard for working class people to immigrate here. I have zero issue with welcoming the investment class to America but I also feel that blue collar workers should have a shot at the American dream. If we do not have robust immigration then we end up in a situation like Japan or South Korea, neither of which have enough babies being born to maintain their population. First Japan had the "lost decade", the it became "the lost generation", the economy has struggled for years there. We need immigration and it should be an option for anyone willing to work hard and become successful, not just those that are already wealthy.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:


I don't think the American dream should just be for the wealthy.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
How many young people do you know that are willing to do unskilled labor Ann? We have a shortage of farm workers, construction laborers as well as tech workers. Reform welfare again, I'm fine with that but we still need immigrants and there should be a viable path for blue collar workers to come and build a good life in America, the same way out ancestors did, legally and with lots of sweat equity.

I don't think the American dream should just be for the wealthy.

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
I don't either but you keep ignoring that these illegals are not being paid standard wages. They will work for cheap. They are no doubt paid cash to help hide them and that also means they are not contributing to our payroll tax system. Trust me, I hate taxes but it is what it is for now. Our welfare rats do not have to work.

When the citizenry is back to work making their dream come true then I think we can look at the unskilled immigrant laborer.

BTW- you did not read what I wrote. I am not in favor of just letting rich people come in and buy their way to residency without bringing business and adding things like jobs and paying taxes like the rest of us. Stop cherry picking.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:


I don't think the American dream should just be for the wealthy.

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
Why do you call construction workers un-skilled, Steve? They make good money in these parts.
Not that I havnt seen some un-skilled ones, they dont keep a job long!!

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
An unskilled worker will be taken on, but they had better learn, and show progress to keep the job. No union construction around here, you advance and earn pay keeping with experience and drive. Even hot tar roofer needs to show they can be sent in charge of a job at some point. never understood why anyone would join a union to be held back.

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
Why do you call construction workers un-skilled, Steve? They make good money in these parts.
Not that I havnt seen some un-skilled ones, they dont keep a job long!!

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
An unskilled worker will be taken on, but they had better learn, and show progress to keep the job never understood why anyone would join a union to be held back.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
Why do you call construction workers un-skilled, Steve? They make good money in these parts.
Not that I havnt seen some un-skilled ones, they dont keep a job long!!

Because he's an over educated elitist ......liberal

I would like to see him,sit for a master electrician license....heck, even a journeyman license....

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

Steve, then what about the large welfare class of citizens who do not work? That is why I am opposed to so much immigration. There are too many 'dependents' on the taxpayers as it is. Nothing is done about that so why are we wanting other non skilled poor people to take their places? The only benefit is those who like them because they can undercut wages. Until we can solve our own problem as mentioned then no to unskilled laborers.

I'm ambivalent about the rich people for now. I don't know enough about the plan. I know it is practiced world wide. What I would be opposed to is letting wealthy in just because they can afford it. IMO they should only be brought in if they were bringing business/jobs and such benefit the citizens here. In other words, they must to be able to legitimately invest in the success of this country.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
It’s my understanding that this has existed for some time- in the form of you have x amount to invest in a business or company here.

I’m not sure what the number is, but it’s my understanding that most nations have this.

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
Could be Steve.
I usually hear about the bullshit of protecting poor work ethics, from members with more to offer, and passed over.
Not something I would ever want to be a part of.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
Could be Steve.
I usually hear about the bullshit of protecting poor work ethics, from members with more to offer, and passed over.
Not something I would ever want to be a part of.

I made some really, really good money on union jobs installing telecom equipment in NYC. Hard to beat as a young kid, working summers doing it paid to me through community college.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
Could be Steve.
I usually hear about the bullshit of protecting poor work ethics, from members with more to offer, and passed over.
Not something I would ever want to be a part of.

I made some really, really good money on union jobs installing telecom equipment in NYC. Hard to beat as a young kid, working summers doing it paid to me through community college.

i made GREAT money with a union painter's card in the 80s .. because it was a SCAM to protect members over scabs -- i got a new buick and paid for my actual college in ONE summers work ... the college where i earned my first degree -- what degree did you leave "community" college with? mine was bio-chem ... yours? is that where you got your economics "degree"

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
Well, not that I am surprised, you partied too hard and dropped out of the Academics, at the first school - the droll part is "peaking" in your late teens, early 20, and still reliving those memories ~40+ years later? Graduated with good grades, put myself through school, and had a great time doing it too. Shame you have to repeat the lie that I dropped out due to poor academic performance, that only happened in that tiny little mind of yours. In reality I attended several schools, all in good standing, just like many others in America. Do you tell lies like that because you are insecure? You certainly seem insecure and defensive, especially when you are proved to be incorrect. Thin skinned as they say. Unlike you, I have yet to peak, I'm still cranking out great work and have some interesting projects in the works.

Though, by your talk, it appears you find traveling to europe in the 80s to be an important fact in your life, you do know you can go back just about anytime you want -- I have been to Europe many times since my first trip, but backpacking in my college years with a shapely brunette was a truly wonderful experience, Prague in the summer of 94 cannot be recreated, awesome times. Europe is still great, but it has changed. I will continue to visit there and other places throughout the world, I have always loved to travel.

you ask do i love my job, but i'll answer that with the time concurrent with the conversation -- Frankly, i usually liked painting and sandblasting, industrial construction, and being the jackleg mechanic - but what I LOVED was being a co-owner of the business - emerged from college with zero unsecured debt, said buick, and 1/2 of my first house paid off - Do I love my job today? oh yeah - i work with amazing people doing great work, in a cool culture -- i am blessed

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
*I* didn't say why you dropped out, just that you went to college, stopped taking classes, and didn't get a degree.. that is dropping out...

Odd how you are so sensitive about the academics, though .. especially after you wrapped so hard over a mason's helper being semi skilled

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
*I* didn't say why you dropped out, just that you went to college, stopped taking classes, and didn't get a degree.. that is dropping out...

Odd how you are so sensitive about the academics, though .. especially after you wrapped so hard over a mason's helper being semi skilled

I have a degree, I have told you that several times. Why do you continue to lie?

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
*I* didn't say why you dropped out, just that you went to college, stopped taking classes, and didn't get a degree.. that is dropping out...

Odd how you are so sensitive about the academics, though .. especially after you wrapped so hard over a mason's helper being semi skilled

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
I have an AA, in nothing, literally. An AA in Liberal Arts. I earned it, paid for and achieved it in just over two years from a single school, HCC in St. Pete Florida. I went to CU, had great grades but stopped going to pursue a very successful career in the telecom industry, I was killing it in my 20's but did not enjoy the work. I made enough to buy a house and go to TSJC for gunsmithing, I left after 3 semesters to open a shop on my own when the opportunity presented itself and have been gainfully employed building custom guns and doing restoration since then. When I was accepted into the ACGG I was the second youngest person to achieve professional status. I'm booked up for the foreseeable future with repeat clients.

8th grade class canceled again today? Poor thing.....

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
I have an AA, in nothing, literally. An AA in Liberal Arts. I earned it, paid for and achieved it in just over two years from a single school, HCC in St. Pete Florida. I went to CU, had great grades but stopped going to pursue a very successful career in the telecom industry, I was killing it in my 20's but did not enjoy the work. I made enough to buy a house and go to TSJC for gunsmithing, I left after 3 semesters to open a shop on my own when the opportunity presented itself and have been gainfully employed building custom guns and doing restoration since then. When I was accepted into the ACGG I was the second youngest person to achieve professional status. I'm booked up for the foreseeable future with repeat clients.

8th grade class canceled again today? Poor thing.....

M
An AA. So basically a glorified certification.

How many total schools did you attend but “dropped out of”?

Is it 4 or 4?

It’s hard to keep track of your vagabond ways.

Congrats on being accepted into the ACGC as they hold a very high standard. And the 2nd youngest is equally impressive. No idea who the youngest is.


You do something I can’t do. I can do my basic day to day Gun plumbing and some parts swapping, but actuall metalwork, stick work and tuning is beyond me. I’ll stick to
My day job and pay professionals like you.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Failure is rewarded America!

Can you imagine a career criminal supports, multi bankrupt, draft dodger, gets to rule you stupid lot!!

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
I have an AA, in nothing, literally. An AA in Liberal Arts. I earned it, paid for and achieved it in just over two years from a single school, HCC in St. Pete Florida. I went to CU, had great grades but stopped going to pursue a very successful career in the telecom industry, I was killing it in my 20's but did not enjoy the work. I made enough to buy a house and go to TSJC for gunsmithing, I left after 3 semesters to open a shop on my own when the opportunity presented itself and have been gainfully employed building custom guns and doing restoration since then. When I was accepted into the ACGG I was the second youngest person to achieve professional status. I'm booked up for the foreseeable future with repeat clients.

8th grade class canceled again today? Poor thing.....

M
An AA. So basically a glorified certification.

How many total schools did you attend but “dropped out of”?

Is it 4 or 4?

It’s hard to keep track of your vagabond ways.

Congrats on being accepted into the ACGC as they hold a very high standard. And the 2nd youngest is equally impressive. No idea who the youngest is.


You do something I can’t do. I can do my basic day to day Gun plumbing and some parts swapping, but actuall metalwork, stick work and tuning is beyond me. I’ll stick to
My day job and pay professionals like you.

Read my post, you struggle with reading comprehension I see.

I attended three schools total, got a degree from one and left the other to to advance my career. Worked out well.

I'm a professional member of the ACGG as a metalsmith, I do pretty good woodwork as well. Plenty of pictures out there of my work, on this site and one others. I turn down over 95% of the jobs offered to me and now am at a point in my career where I can pick and chose what I want do and how much I want to work. I'm a known quantity with nothing to hide, you can google me up and call a landline that reaches my desk.


Who the fuck are you?

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
I have an AA, in nothing, literally. An AA in Liberal Arts. I earned it, paid for and achieved it in just over two years from a single school, HCC in St. Pete Florida. I went to CU, had great grades but stopped going to pursue a very successful career in the telecom industry, I was killing it in my 20's but did not enjoy the work. I made enough to buy a house and go to TSJC for gunsmithing, I left after 3 semesters to open a shop on my own when the opportunity presented itself and have been gainfully employed building custom guns and doing restoration since then. When I was accepted into the ACGG I was the second youngest person to achieve professional status. I'm booked up for the foreseeable future with repeat clients.

8th grade class canceled again today? Poor thing.....

M
An AA. So basically a glorified certification.

How many total schools did you attend but “dropped out of”?

Is it 4 or 4?

It’s hard to keep track of your vagabond ways.

Congrats on being accepted into the ACGC as they hold a very high standard. And the 2nd youngest is equally impressive. No idea who the youngest is.


You do something I can’t do. I can do my basic day to day Gun plumbing and some parts swapping, but actuall metalwork, stick work and tuning is beyond me. I’ll stick to
My day job and pay professionals like you.

Read my post, you struggle with reading comprehension I see.

I attended three schools total, got a degree from one and left the other to to advance my career. Worked out well.

I'm a professional member of the ACGG as a metalsmith, I do pretty good woodwork as well. Plenty of pictures out there of my work, on this site and one others. I turn down over 95% of the jobs offered to me and now am at a point in my career where I can pick and chose what I want do and how much I want to work. I'm a known quantity with nothing to hide, you can google me up and call a landline that reaches my desk.


Who the fuck are you?

Another misguided overall who couldn’t complete anything and after 2 “colleges” came away with the educational equivalent of a participation trophy.


I already acknowledged your ACGG achievement and I honestly wish I had those skills. Instead I pay those who do.

Who am I?

2 degrees fem a 4 year school (neither of them are useful -TBH) and I am a recognized SME in my field.

What field.

None of your business as I don’t feel like being cyberstalked by your liberal loonies.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
I have an AA, in nothing, literally. An AA in Liberal Arts. I earned it, paid for and achieved it in just over two years from a single school, HCC in St. Pete Florida. I went to CU, had great grades but stopped going to pursue a very successful career in the telecom industry, I was killing it in my 20's but did not enjoy the work. I made enough to buy a house and go to TSJC for gunsmithing, I left after 3 semesters to open a shop on my own when the opportunity presented itself and have been gainfully employed building custom guns and doing restoration since then. When I was accepted into the ACGG I was the second youngest person to achieve professional status. I'm booked up for the foreseeable future with repeat clients.

8th grade class canceled again today? Poor thing.....

M
An AA. So basically a glorified certification.

How many total schools did you attend but “dropped out of”?

Is it 4 or 4?

It’s hard to keep track of your vagabond ways.

Congrats on being accepted into the ACGC as they hold a very high standard. And the 2nd youngest is equally impressive. No idea who the youngest is.


You do something I can’t do. I can do my basic day to day Gun plumbing and some parts swapping, but actuall metalwork, stick work and tuning is beyond me. I’ll stick to
My day job and pay professionals like you.

Read my post, you struggle with reading comprehension I see.

I attended three schools total, got a degree from one and left the other to to advance my career. Worked out well.

I'm a professional member of the ACGG as a metalsmith, I do pretty good woodwork as well. Plenty of pictures out there of my work, on this site and one others. I turn down over 95% of the jobs offered to me and now am at a point in my career where I can pick and chose what I want do and how much I want to work. I'm a known quantity with nothing to hide, you can google me up and call a landline that reaches my desk.


Who the fuck are you?

Another misguided overall who couldn’t complete anything and after 2 “colleges” came away with the educational equivalent of a participation trophy.


I already acknowledged your ACGG achievement and I honestly wish I had those skills. Instead I pay those who do.

Who am I?

2 degrees fem a 4 year school (neither of them are useful -TBH) and I am a recognized SME in my field.

What field.

None of your business as I don’t feel like being cyberstalked by your liberal loonies.

In other words, you are a troll slinging mud from the cheap seats.

Pretty much what I figured.....

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
I still have a question, Steve, as you forgot to mention where you studied and earned your economics/ business advanced degrees?

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Jayhawker2022:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
I have an AA, in nothing, literally. An AA in Liberal Arts. I earned it, paid for and achieved it in just over two years from a single school, HCC in St. Pete Florida. I went to CU, had great grades but stopped going to pursue a very successful career in the telecom industry, I was killing it in my 20's but did not enjoy the work. I made enough to buy a house and go to TSJC for gunsmithing, I left after 3 semesters to open a shop on my own when the opportunity presented itself and have been gainfully employed building custom guns and doing restoration since then. When I was accepted into the ACGG I was the second youngest person to achieve professional status. I'm booked up for the foreseeable future with repeat clients.

8th grade class canceled again today? Poor thing.....

M
An AA. So basically a glorified certification.

How many total schools did you attend but “dropped out of”?

Is it 4 or 4?

It’s hard to keep track of your vagabond ways.

Congrats on being accepted into the ACGC as they hold a very high standard. And the 2nd youngest is equally impressive. No idea who the youngest is.


You do something I can’t do. I can do my basic day to day Gun plumbing and some parts swapping, but actuall metalwork, stick work and tuning is beyond me. I’ll stick to
My day job and pay professionals like you.

Read my post, you struggle with reading comprehension I see.

I attended three schools total, got a degree from one and left the other to to advance my career. Worked out well.

I'm a professional member of the ACGG as a metalsmith, I do pretty good woodwork as well. Plenty of pictures out there of my work, on this site and one others. I turn down over 95% of the jobs offered to me and now am at a point in my career where I can pick and chose what I want do and how much I want to work. I'm a known quantity with nothing to hide, you can google me up and call a landline that reaches my desk.


Who the fuck are you?

Another misguided overall who couldn’t complete anything and after 2 “colleges” came away with the educational equivalent of a participation trophy.


I already acknowledged your ACGG achievement and I honestly wish I had those skills. Instead I pay those who do.

Who am I?

2 degrees fem a 4 year school (neither of them are useful -TBH) and I am a recognized SME in my field.

What field.

None of your business as I don’t feel like being cyberstalked by your liberal loonies.

In other words, you are a troll slinging mud from the cheap seats.

Pretty much what I figured.....

Ahhhh Stevie my little bitch boy.


Can’t handle the heat of being called out as someone who couldn’t even finish something as simple as a college degree.

Better go take a few bong hits and calm your man Tits down.

Stick you your electors “I turn down 95% of customers”.

Fuxk me what an emerita well I was going to say TOOL, but tools have a use.

You don’t.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
I still have a question, Steve, as you forgot to mention where you studied and earned your economics/ business advanced degrees?

Never said I did Jeffe, just that I took an economic class in school.

Must be humiliating to be proved wrong consistently on a public forum by someone with so much less education than you have. I am glad to see that you were finally able to comprehend that a tariff is tax after watching the cartoon Mike posted. It sure was kind of him to help you out like that.