Defense Minister Yoav Gallant and army generals dispute the narrative advocated for some, really just one person, on this site.

https://apple.news/ABpRwZjP7RLuQ9RQ6-_8g7A

"Although most surveys show Israelis still broadly support the war,"

So for the dullards here,( me,) can you clarify your point?

I'd of thought disagreement and dissention would have been assumed in a free nation like Israel.

If I'm the one you're referring to I think what I've been advocating is letting the sovereign nation of Israel pursue the course it deems appropriate. If Israel's ally the USA would prefer a course correction for Israel I believe it inappropriate to force that course correction in the middle of a war with our sworn enemy, Islamic Terrorists. The reduction in aid in future endeavors rather than, "gosh it's Thursday and we've changed our mind!".

Simply put, if Israel thinks it best to not invade Rafa, or if Israel thinks it inappropriate to place a military junta in charge of Gaza well okey dokey then. Yes, I still find the youthful attorney from Kentucky that thinks he spur of the moment knows better troubling.

NitanHitler is doing to the Palestinians what his name sake, Adolf Hitler, did to the Jews!

Zionism is nothing but a modern version of Nazism!

My point is an Israel only solution is not supported by the generals and Defense Minister.

That the method and ultimate goal of the war as prosecuted by Netanyahu does not have support by well informed, military leaders in the government.

My opinion is informed by the Defense Minister.

I am sorry my success is upsetting to you.

I am referring to all those who advocate for Israel destroying, Palestine. That Israel should be the only state between the river and the sea.

The fact that this contingent thinks it knows better than some ISF generals and the Defense Minster should give pause.

Tge war is necessary. The Hamas force around Rafah has to be eliminated.

Yes, I am against Netanyahu for reasons already given.

The one person is Dr. Easter with his advocacy for destruction of Palestine and a two state existence.

What is Tge war. Shit, I wish you would proofread your word salad… If you are indeed a lawyer, do you proofread your court submissions? What a frigging joke…

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
My point is an Israel only solution is not supported by the generals and Defense Minister. Not surprising, dissent seems natural and common.

That the method and ultimate goal of the war as prosecuted by Netanyahu does not have support by well informed, military leaders in the government. And ok, again, dissent seems natural, it seems from your article some agree with N.

My opinion is informed by the Defense Minister. Who doesn't have a majority im guessing?

I am sorry my success is upsetting to you. You have to be kidding.

I am referring to all those who advocate for Israel destroying, Palestine. That Israel should be the only state between the river and the sea. I haven't seen that.

The fact that this contingent thinks it knows better than some ISF generals and the Defense Minster should give pause. I certainly don't.

Tge war is necessary. The Hamas force around Rafah has to be eliminated. Bingo!

Yes, I am against Netanyahu for reasons already given. Glad you don't get a vote.

The one person is Dr. Easter with his advocacy for destruction of Palestine and a two state existence.

I haven't seen that.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
NitanHitler is doing to the Palestinians what his name sake, Adolf Hitler, did to the Jews!

Zionism is nothing but a modern version of Nazism!

Best of luck with that whopper.

November 2nd, 1917

Dear Lord Rothschild,

I have much pleasure in conveying to you, on behalf of His Majesty's Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet.

"His Majesty's Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."

I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation.

Yours sincerely,

Arthur James Balfour

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
November 2nd, 1917

Dear Lord Rothschild,

I have much pleasure in conveying to you, on behalf of His Majesty's Government, the following declaration of sympathy with Jewish Zionist aspirations which has been submitted to, and approved by, the Cabinet.

"His Majesty's Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country."

I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation.

Yours sincerely,

Arthur James Balfour

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik...ael_(united_monarchy)

So you're saying,....

Time for the slaughter in Gaza to stop. The actions by Hamas in October were reprehensible. But the continued slaughter in Gaza is no less reprehensible. At some point retaliation and retribution crosses the line to genocide.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Time for the slaughter in Gaza to stop. The actions by Hamas in October were reprehensible. But the continued slaughter in Gaza is no less reprehensible. At some point retaliation and retribution crosses the line to genocide.

I am totally against violence directed against innocent civilians.

No matter who is the culprit.

Sadly, Israel under the leadership of Zionism has been nothing short of non stop crimes against humanity.

You in the West have been kept ignorant of the daily abuses of human rights.

Continuous bulldozing of Palestnian homes, to make way for illegal colonies.

quote:

You in the West have been kept ignorant of the daily abuses of human rights.

We are well aware of it Saeed, some just choose to ignore it or say that it’s justified due to the actions of Hamas.

Neither side is blameless, the attacking of Israelis by Hamas is just as much a crime as settlers attacking Palestinians.

We need to get Hamas and those who support them and Netanyahu and those who support him out in the Sinai somewhere behind a high fence, equip them all with bayonets and entrenching tools and let the adults work out a solution for the Israeli and Palestinian People.

quote:

Originally posted by nute:

quote:

You in the West have been kept ignorant of the daily abuses of human rights.

We are well aware of it Saeed, some just choose to ignore it or say that it’s justified due to the actions of Hamas.

Neither side is blameless, the attacking of Israelis by Hamas is just as much a crime as settlers attacking Palestinians.

Hamas did not exist when Palestine was taken over.

The New Nazis, the Zionists, have been expanding like cancer.

Destroying Palestinian homes, kicking them out to virtual concentration camps, and building illegal colonies for imported Zionists!

Do you think any normal people would stand and watch what NitanHitler is doing??

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Time for the slaughter in Gaza to stop. The actions by Hamas in October were reprehensible. But the continued slaughter in Gaza is no less reprehensible. At some point retaliation and retribution crosses the line to genocide.

Yet as Lloyd Austin said…there is no hint of genocide in this war.

There is some disagreement about the issue:

https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1147976

Maybe. But I would say that a strong statement like that from our Secretary of Defense (very informed person) is likely closer to the truth.

And, for the most part, the UN is a total joke.

The pictures and videos present a strong case for genocide being committed. Much of the world has seen enough to determine the Gaza offensive should end. I believe the Secretary of State commented on the matter just this week.

https://www.foxnews.com/world/...-israel-yet-get-gaza

Getting hung up on the definition of genocide seems pretty pointless. What is clear is that thousands of innocent civilians have been killed by the IDF, mostly women and children. It needs to stop and Netanyahu doesn't have a plan for that....or really, a plan for anything other than continuing to kill innocent men, women and children.

Plans come in stages.

Stage 1: kill all of Hamas and most importantly the leader…just like we killed OBL and get the hostages.

Stage 2 comes “after” stage 1.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Maybe. But I would say that a strong statement like that from our Secretary of Defense (very informed person) is likely closer to the truth.

And, for the most part, the UN is a total joke.

Your Secretary of State is a paper tiger!

Non stop statements and the arms are flowing to the Nazis!

Those Nazis would never have gotten where they are now without your support.

America is a SLAVE to the New Nazis!

quote:

Your Secretary of State is a paper tiger!

He is no tiger at all. Just a moron.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Plans come in stages.

Stage 1: kill all of Hamas and most importantly the leader…just like we killed OBL and get the hostages.

Stage 2 comes “after” stage 1.

All Israel is doing right now is creating more recruits for Hamas. Your ignorance of history is showing.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Plans come in stages.

Stage 1: kill all of Hamas and most importantly the leader…just like we killed OBL and get the hostages.

Stage 2 comes “after” stage 1.

All Israel is doing right now is creating more recruits for Hamas. Your ignorance of history is showing.

Very difficult to think straight with your head up Trump’s arse!

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Time for the slaughter in Gaza to stop. The actions by Hamas in October were reprehensible. But the continued slaughter in Gaza is no less reprehensible. At some point retaliation and retribution crosses the line to genocide.

Yet as Lloyd Austin said…there is no hint of genocide in this war.

Not genocide exactly, but it looks a lot like ethnic cleansing, from here.
I understand that our news is heavily managed, and I have no access to first-person accounts.

Bibi may have a tiger by the ears here, needs to become a hero to stave off his corruption trial.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
NitanHitler is doing to the Palestinians what his name sake, Adolf Hitler, did to the Jews!

Zionism is nothing but a modern version of Nazism!

I note you never criticize the Palestinians for starting the war. October 7 was a foolish, suicidal action.

Now they're reaping what they sowed. Idiots, to let their children be killed.

Blame Hamas for using their own people as human shields.

I do feel sympathy for the innocent children, who did not elect Hamas to represent them. I think the war has gone on long enough. Netanbutthead's declarations that they'll continue until Hamas is destroyed are not realistic.

I expect Hamas is only gaining in numbers from Palestinians who have lost loved ones.

Also, America has every right to assert its own interests, which don't include expansion of Israeli territory or the extermination of the Palestinians.

Pull funding and arms, if Israel continues to injure American interests.

What about the extermination of Hamas including its leadership and the release of hostages?

Are those American interests?

As I said, destruction of Hamas is not a realistic goal.

All the killing hasn't freed the hostages. How about trying diplomacy?

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Plans come in stages.

Stage 1: kill all of Hamas and most importantly the leader…just like we killed OBL and get the hostages.

Stage 2 comes “after” stage 1.

All Israel is doing right now is creating more recruits for Hamas. Your ignorance of history is showing.

Precisely, support for Hamas in the West Bank was circa 12% before all this started, now its 40%+. Support for Hamas has been waining, even in Gaza, and this reaction is exactly what they wanted to happen to drive their support back up.

Every one of those 34,000+ dead people and the 100k+ injured and maimed have brothers, sons, fathers, cousins ... and they don't all live nice and neatly in Gaza.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by nute:

quote:

You in the West have been kept ignorant of the daily abuses of human rights.

We are well aware of it Saeed, some just choose to ignore it or say that it’s justified due to the actions of Hamas.

Neither side is blameless, the attacking of Israelis by Hamas is just as much a crime as settlers attacking Palestinians.

Hamas did not exist when Palestine was taken over.

The New Nazis, the Zionists, have been expanding like cancer.

Destroying Palestinian homes, kicking them out to virtual concentration camps, and building illegal colonies for imported Zionists!

Do you think any normal people would stand and watch what NitanHitler is doing??

..and those settlements are on land taken by Israel when she was attacked, and Israels behaviour toward the Palestinians is justified as a response to rockets and terrorism, today by Hamas, yesterday by the PLO etc.

Each side uses the past actions of the other as justification for their actions, tit for tat. Neither are blameless.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
As I said, destruction of Hamas is not a realistic goal.

All the killing hasn't freed the hostages. How about trying diplomacy?

Diplomacy with terrorists? Diplomacy like we used so successfully in Afghanistan?

I know I don't have the answers, but we do know using western ideals, procedures and values on the eastern/ Caliphate type folks doesn't work right?

I mentioned it recently and if I remember right our military base in Syria was recently attacked by Iranian forces working within Iraq.

The USA based in Syria attacked by Iran from Iraq.

How's that for diplomacy?!?!?!?!

Afghanistan is a good analogy. We fought them for twenty years, and all that happened was their numbers grew.

It will be the same in Palestine.

Israel does not have clean hands. I oppose any more military support until they come to the table with someone representing the Palestinian people.

If Israel wishes to continue the killing to avenge October 7, let them go it alone. Their sugar daddy needs to cut the apron strings.

There will never be a peaceful 2 state solution…never.

If I were Israel…I would carry on while I was on a roll. The US will need Israel in the future as an ally in the region.

I will also pressure my Senators and Representatives to continue to support them.

There can be a more secure solution through 2 states. There will never be perfect peace, but there can be a state that does not sponsor attacks on Israel that is not allied to Iran.

Its a shit sandwich! There is no acceptable solution. Nute's summation is correct.
I feel really sorry for the Palestinian population. But I look at how the palestinian supporters in my country are behaving and what they are saying. Plus the real open increase in anti semitism. If I were Israeli I would probably be doing the same.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
There can be a more secure solution through 2 states. There will never be perfect peace, but there can be a state that does not sponsor attacks on Israel that is not allied to Iran.

If wishes were fishes we’d have a big fry.

Could…but never will.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
NitanHitler is doing to the Palestinians what his name sake, Adolf Hitler, did to the Jews!

Zionism is nothing but a modern version of Nazism!

I note you never criticize the Palestinians for starting the war. October 7 was a foolish, suicidal action.

Now they're reaping what they sowed. Idiots, to let their children be killed.

Blame Hamas for using their own people as human shields.

I do feel sympathy for the innocent children, who did not elect Hamas to represent them. I think the war has gone on long enough. Netanbutthead's declarations that they'll continue until Hamas is destroyed are not realistic.

I expect Hamas is only gaining in numbers from Palestinians who have lost loved ones.

Staring the war?

Their bloody country!

Taken over by the New Naziz!

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
There can be a more secure solution through 2 states. There will never be perfect peace, but there can be a state that does not sponsor attacks on Israel that is not allied to Iran.

If wishes were fishes we’d have a big fry.

Could…but never will.

Well, the existing arrangement is working so smoothly why would any intelligent person entertain the notion of trying something different.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
There can be a more secure solution through 2 states. There will never be perfect peace, but there can be a state that does not sponsor attacks on Israel that is not allied to Iran.

You may be right, but somehow I doubt that the 2 state solution is empirically a more secure solution, as the second part of your quote so far has not been the history of the Palestinian groups.

The right 2 state solution undoubtedly is... but looking at the international winds blowing at the UN, I suspect the opposite is what will happen if the 2 state solution is brokered by the UN... or the Biden WH. Any internationally accepted deal will be a prelude to another attempt to remove Israel.