Turkey has dropped its objection to Swedish membership.

The Baltic is now a NATO sea with Sweden and Finland both joining as a direct result of Putin's I want to stop NATO expansion "special military operation".

The announcement seems timed to coincide with todays NATO summit at which the future relationship between Ukraine and NATO is to be discussed.

It looks likely that Ukraine will be given commitments for future equipment and training plus (possibly) some indication of a path for membership. In 2008 Ukraine was given a yes, well probably, not sure when, we'll think about it by NATO, so another shot himself in the foot moment for Vlad.

Im sure Saeed will have a different view

I am all for it.

If the whole world world was in one military bloc, even better.

No wars.

But, I can assure you this is not going to solve much.

The real enemy today, China, is taking over other parts of the world.

And the West cannot do shit about it.

South America and Africa hate the West.

They all have seen how trustworthy you are.

I haven't traveled much in Africa so I cannot comment, but I didn't see any anti western feeling in S America last time I was there.

You are right about China though. We need to stop outsourcing our manufacturing to China, they just steal the IP anyway.

I meet quite a few African visitors here.

They are claiming they are being blackmailed by both government and non government organizations from Europe.

All because they oppose gay marriage!

They have lost many aid programs to this, which to them, is utterly ridiculous!

They say it is against their whole society structure.

It is no different than trying to convert them religiously!

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I meet quite a few African visitors here.

They are claiming they are being blackmailed by both government and non government organizations from Europe.

All because they oppose gay marriage!

They have lost many aid programs to this, which to them, is utterly ridiculous!

They say it is against their whole society structure.

It is no different than trying to convert them religiously!

If true, that deserves it’s own post. That is beyond that pale!

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I meet quite a few African visitors here.

They are claiming they are being blackmailed by both government and non government organizations from Europe.

All because they oppose gay marriage!

They have lost many aid programs to this, which to them, is utterly ridiculous!

They say it is against their whole society structure.

It is no different than trying to convert them religiously!

So the choice is effectively change your laws outlawing being gay or don’t receive western aid money?

How is that blackmail, no one is forcing then to accept western aid. If it’s against their principals just turn it down. Or is the the corrupt government officials who object because they won’t then be able to afford a new Benz each year?

quote:

Originally posted by nute:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I meet quite a few African visitors here.

They are claiming they are being blackmailed by both government and non government organizations from Europe.

All because they oppose gay marriage!

They have lost many aid programs to this, which to them, is utterly ridiculous!

They say it is against their whole society structure.

It is no different than trying to convert them religiously!

So the choice is effectively change your laws outlawing being gay or don’t receive western aid money?

How is that blackmail, no one is forcing then to accept western aid. If it’s against their principals just turn it down. Or is the the corrupt government officials who object because they won’t then be able to afford a new Benz each year?

The West, in their stupid crusade to change the world to suit the freaks.

Remember the FIFA WORLD CUP and the rainbow armband?

Glad Qatar told them to FO!

I loved it when England insisted on wearing it.

FIFA told them they will get yellow cards, and two matches later go home!

Might have saved the FA a few bob to go home early!

It was like the Germans demanding HUMAN RIGHTS!

Asked one here if he remembers the gas chambers?

Where were human rights then!

He shut up.

I agree there is a hypocrisy.
We live in a western world where tolerance and acceptance of others lifestyles and religions is preached.
I agree with that but it seems my understanding of tolerance and acceptance does not fit the new meaning of those words.
As Saeed says it is very much a new religion of confirming too the tolerance and acceptance of "My" way of thinking or else.
Any nation formed in a manor historically, culturally and with its own set of beliefs, should be able to govern and make its rules according to those beliefs. True tolerance does not come from threats or forced actions.
If the aid is going to improve lives then it should be given. If social conditions are imposed then its not really aid.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed


It was like the Germans demanding HUMAN RIGHTS!

Asked one here if he remembers the gas chambers?

Where were human rights then!

He shut up.

That is the past though, and we should never forget for sure. But its silly to bring it up today on modern germans who have learned and changed. Today Germany is a country that does everything it can to respect others rights and humanity.
We cant exclude them from the modern conversation because of something that happened in our grand parents day. Like any modern day nation they are part of the conversation and solution.

the hypocrisy is everywhere. By far the most intolerant and hypocritical people as a rule I have every met are people from the middle east and from Africa followed very closely by Chinese. They are also the ones that scream the loudest about how bad Europeans and Americas are!

Oh, the Hypocrisy!!