Hi guys, Herrberg here. Swedish guy. Long time no see.

I used to hang around here a few years ago, then I lost interest, but the latest few days made me think I should drop by and give you a report from jurrup. Europe.

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

That is not the issue here. Yep, we needed that alarm bell. Thanks for that. It's still not the issue.

What I wanted to talk to you about is that I have friends, family, acquaintances, who rooted for the US. Who thought USA had a role to play in the grand scheme of things, for a better destiny everybody in the long run.

Today, after the lunatic ravings of Trump, Vance, and Kennedy... that trust is gone. Take over Canada? Take over Greenland? From allies? And to claim that Ukraine started the war, that Zelensky is a dictator, that...

Finnish diplomats claim they have been told to sign blank sheets of papers within three weeks "or else".

The US is no longer a trustworthy ally. You alienate your allies and suck the brick of a dictator who poisons politicial opponents.

This is so pathetic I have no words for it. I know many maga-minded people in Sweden and they have all, with no exception at all, reached the point where they have nothing except contempt for the US anymore.

I have never seen a country waste its power base and shed its alliances this efficiently. But hey, russian national TV shows root for you. You've got new friends now.

We didn’t all vote for that dumb bastard.

quote:

Originally posted by LongDistanceOperator:
We didn’t all vote for that dumb bastard.

No, but enough did to make sure that one cannot rely on the US. When the US chooses sides, the US chooses Putin over Zelensky - and calls Zelensky a dictator.

There is no ally left that would rely on the US now.

I don’t blame our allies. It is a shitty situation. The signs were all there. Half our country has its head up its ass. I’m sure that number will drop. Too late, unfortunately.

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

“All we ever expected in return was a place to bury our war dead.”

America first is in fact tough love.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Absolutely no conflict there between us. You're absolutely right.

Still remains the issue that the US sucks Putin's dick nowadays. When given the choice, the US choose dictatorship over democracies.

And the lunatic ideas about Canada, Greenland, Panama... has nothing to do with the freeloading.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

“All we ever expected in return was a place to bury our war dead.”

America first is in fact tough love.

It's America alone Steve, and its shameful.

My family is full of MAGA assholes who are in uniform. They can't believe the military will be cut 8% and we are leaving NATO.

Well you voted for this morons. He's not doing anything he didn't say he'd do.

America is the laughing stock of the world, especially in Russia that just saw the US in full surrender monkey mode.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

Sweden, for example, has had a military contingent in Afghanistan between 2001-2021. Because the US, a friendly country, was attacked. I have several friends and acquaintances who have spent time there in boots, one has been wounded.

Doesn't people in the US know there were allies from European countries there for them when they were needed?

quote:

Originally posted by HerrBerg:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

Sweden, for example, has had a military contingent in Afghanistan between 2001-2021. Because the US, a friendly country, was attacked. I have several friends and acquaintances who have spent time there in boots, one has been wounded.

Doesn't people in the US know there were allies from European countries there for them when they were needed?

I do and it pains me to see our country abandon our friends and allies. This will haunt America for generations to come.

quote:

Originally posted by HerrBerg:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

Sweden, for example, has had a military contingent in Afghanistan between 2001-2021. Because the US, a friendly country, was attacked. I have several friends and acquaintances who have spent time there in boots, one has been wounded.

Doesn't people in the US know there were allies from European countries there for them when they were needed?

You sound like a reasonable man. I'll just say this. I don't care for the hyperbole Trump uses sometimes myself. However. We are bound to mutual defense by not only NATO, but by common decency. If ANYONE in here actually believes that America would not come to the aid of an Allie, you're mistaken. we always have and always will.

Looks to me like many of you are forgetting how Biden was very soft and slow on his weapons shipments and approvals for Israel, yet set aside sections on Iran immediately. That oil money Iran has now, allowed for Hamas and Hezbola to get re-armed, No Iran money, no October 7th, direct ties, period.

Is Trump wrong demanding that NATO countries pay their 2%? Is Trump wrong for thinking of raising it to 5%?

How many Carriers, Battleships, Nuclear Subs, Fighter wings, B52's B2's do all these other countries use to project power across the globe when needed? I'll say again, I don't like Trumps style AT TIMES. But his America first policy is late coming and necessary.

All you guys are really forgetting how this globe looks to America for projection of power, when needed.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by HerrBerg:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

Sweden, for example, has had a military contingent in Afghanistan between 2001-2021. Because the US, a friendly country, was attacked. I have several friends and acquaintances who have spent time there in boots, one has been wounded.

Doesn't people in the US know there were allies from European countries there for them when they were needed?

You sound like a reasonable man. I'll just say this. I don't care for the hyperbole Trump uses sometimes myself. However. We are bound to mutual defense by not only NATO, but by common decency. If ANYONE in here actually believes that America would not come to the aid of an Allie, you're mistaken. we always have and always will.

Looks to me like many of you are forgetting how Biden was very soft and slow on his weapons shipments and approvals for Israel, yet set aside sections on Iran immediately. That oil money Iran has now, allowed for Hamas and Hezbola to get re-armed, No Iran money, no October 7th, direct ties, period.

Is Trump wrong demanding that NATO countries pay their 2%? Is Trump wrong for thinking of raising it to 5%?

How many Carriers, Battleships, Nuclear Subs, Fighter wings, B52's B2's do all these other countries use to project power across the globe when needed? I'll say again, I don't like Trumps style AT TIMES. But his America first policy is late coming and necessary.

All you guys are really forgetting how this globe looks to America for projection of power, when needed.

We currently are spending about 3% of GDP for NATO. Trump wants to raise it to 5% while downsizing the DOD budget? How is that even remotely possible?

I meant to do some quick research on military sizes across the globe. Went down a rabbit hole. Some surprising numbers here. I just wanted to get an idea of what percentage of Global defense America puts on its own back. Point being, all these other countries that hate us, are under the blanket of security that these enormous forces provide. I mean no animosity, just presenting facts.

American Navy;

Interssting, didn't know. https://www.msc.usff.navy.mil/...USNavyShips-2025.pdf

https://www.visualcapitalist.c...carriers-by-country/

https://www.globalfirepower.com/navy-destroyers.php

Airforces around the globe;

https://bestdiplomats.org/coun...-largest-air-forces/

Ground forces. Wow.

https://www.visualcapitalist.c...gest-armies-in-2024/

Nuclear arsenal

https://www.google.com/imgres?...BHTB8MU8Q9QF6BAgAEAg

Subs

https://worldpopulationreview....ubmarines-by-country

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by HerrBerg:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

Sweden, for example, has had a military contingent in Afghanistan between 2001-2021. Because the US, a friendly country, was attacked. I have several friends and acquaintances who have spent time there in boots, one has been wounded.

Doesn't people in the US know there were allies from European countries there for them when they were needed?

You sound like a reasonable man. I'll just say this. I don't care for the hyperbole Trump uses sometimes myself. However. We are bound to mutual defense by not only NATO, but by common decency. If ANYONE in here actually believes that America would not come to the aid of an Allie, you're mistaken. we always have and always will.

Looks to me like many of you are forgetting how Biden was very soft and slow on his weapons shipments and approvals for Israel, yet set aside sections on Iran immediately. That oil money Iran has now, allowed for Hamas and Hezbola to get re-armed, No Iran money, no October 7th, direct ties, period.

Is Trump wrong demanding that NATO countries pay their 2%? Is Trump wrong for thinking of raising it to 5%?

How many Carriers, Battleships, Nuclear Subs, Fighter wings, B52's B2's do all these other countries use to project power across the globe when needed? I'll say again, I don't like Trumps style AT TIMES. But his America first policy is late coming and necessary.

All you guys are really forgetting how this globe looks to America for projection of power, when needed.

We currently are spending about 3% of GDP for NATO. Trump wants to raise it to 5% while downsizing the DOD budget? How is that even remotely possible?

Waste Fraud and Abuse.

You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

My post doesn't defend Trump actions ANYWHERE. I actually said 2-3 times I don't like his approach.

My post is just to remind the world how much American capitol in blood, and steel is used to keep the global peace. That is all.

The world is and will be a safer place with Trump as President. My example of Iranian oil money funding October 7 is a solid example. No money, no attack.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

My post doesn't defend Trump actions ANYWHERE. I actually said 2-3 times I don't like his approach.

My post is just to remind the world how much American capitol in blood, and steel is used to keep the global peace. That is all.

The world is and will be a safer place with Trump as President. My example of Iranian oil money funding October 7 is a solid example. No money, no attack.

No, you are providing rational and cover for Trump's shitty behavior. There is no justification for embracing Russia, none whatsoever for his betrayal of our friends.



The world is most definitely not a safer place with his dumbass America Alone policy in place. You fail to recognize that we no longer have allies.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

My post doesn't defend Trump actions ANYWHERE. I actually said 2-3 times I don't like his approach.

My post is just to remind the world how much American capitol in blood, and steel is used to keep the global peace. That is all.

The world is and will be a safer place with Trump as President. My example of Iranian oil money funding October 7 is a solid example. No money, no attack.

No, you are providing rational and cover for Trump's shitty behavior. There is no justification for embracing Russia, none whatsoever for his betrayal of our friends.



The world is most definitely not a safer place with his dumbass America Alone policy in place. You fail to recognize that we no longer have allies.

Disagree. I've said my piece.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

the allies have to pay more but needs to find a different alliance that the actual one with usa, as they are more keen to set up something with putin that is not our friend so usa is starting to be away from our friends and i doubt contrary to the statement of steve ahrenberg that usa will come to help anyone ... despite singatures as we have seen with ukraine ...

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by HerrBerg:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

Sweden, for example, has had a military contingent in Afghanistan between 2001-2021. Because the US, a friendly country, was attacked. I have several friends and acquaintances who have spent time there in boots, one has been wounded.

Doesn't people in the US know there were allies from European countries there for them when they were needed?

You sound like a reasonable man. I'll just say this. I don't care for the hyperbole Trump uses sometimes myself. However. We are bound to mutual defense by not only NATO, but by common decency. If ANYONE in here actually believes that America would not come to the aid of an Allie, you're mistaken. we always have and always will.

Looks to me like many of you are forgetting how Biden was very soft and slow on his weapons shipments and approvals for Israel, yet set aside sections on Iran immediately. That oil money Iran has now, allowed for Hamas and Hezbola to get re-armed, No Iran money, no October 7th, direct ties, period.

Is Trump wrong demanding that NATO countries pay their 2%? Is Trump wrong for thinking of raising it to 5%?

How many Carriers, Battleships, Nuclear Subs, Fighter wings, B52's B2's do all these other countries use to project power across the globe when needed? I'll say again, I don't like Trumps style AT TIMES. But his America first policy is late coming and necessary.

All you guys are really forgetting how this globe looks to America for projection of power, when needed.

We currently are spending about 3% of GDP for NATO. Trump wants to raise it to 5% while downsizing the DOD budget? How is that even remotely possible?

Waste Fraud and Abuse.

So 5% of a downsized DOD budget. That should get us back to 3% of current budget!

quote:

Originally posted by medved:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

the allies have to pay more but needs to find a different alliance that the actual one with usa, as they are more keen to set up something with putin that is not our friend so usa is starting to be away from our friends and i doubt contrary to the statement of steve ahrenberg that usa will come to help anyone ... despite singatures as we have seen with ukraine ...

The Trump supporters have no shame left. I could not be more disgusted by Trump's betrayal of our friends. This is what they discount, the loss of our defense alliances and trade partners. Isolationism and imperialism will not be winning us any friends. The single worst and largest, change in USA foreign policy during the post war period. Worse than Vietnam, worse than Iraq and Afghanistan.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by medved:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

the allies have to pay more but needs to find a different alliance that the actual one with usa, as they are more keen to set up something with putin that is not our friend so usa is starting to be away from our friends and i doubt contrary to the statement of steve ahrenberg that usa will come to help anyone ... despite singatures as we have seen with ukraine ...

The Trump supporters have no shame left. I could not be more disgusted by Trump's betrayal of our friends. This is what they discount, the loss of our defense alliances and trade partners. Isolationism and imperialism will not be winning us any friends. The single worst and largest, change in USA foreign policy during the post war period.

you can feel it from the canadian population and as you have seen the politicians being politicians are starting to follow our will and are way less maga friendly ...

speech of trump towards canada is exactly what putin as stated before even the crimea invasion and we are seeing where it lead and many here are supporting that and they are wondering why they will not feel welcomed lol ...

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

You might want this apologist moron to move in with you in stockholm. Ill pay the one way airfare, bit you gotta keep him!

quote:

Originally posted by medved:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

the allies have to pay more but needs to find a different alliance that the actual one with usa, as they are more keen to set up something with putin that is not our friend so usa is starting to be away from our friends and i doubt contrary to the statement of steve ahrenberg that usa will come to help anyone ... despite singatures as we have seen with ukraine ...

The ONLY reason the Ukraine even exists is because of the USA!

If it where left up to Europe then the Russians would have rolled up all the former combo of countries.

Europe, get after it! Us uncouth, crude Americans are tired of wasting our blood and treasure on you.

quote:

Originally posted by medved:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
You trying to justify Trump's betrayal of our allies is an embarrassment Steve, completely contrary to 80 years of US and GOP foreign policy. Is there nothing that the orange turd does that you will not support? Just pathetic. Not a shred of ethics remain?

the allies have to pay more but needs to find a different alliance that the actual one with usa, as they are more keen to set up something with putin that is not our friend so usa is starting to be away from our friends and i doubt contrary to the statement of steve ahrenberg that usa will come to help anyone ... despite singatures as we have seen with ukraine ...

Jump right on that one pard!

Sure....we are Putin's buddies....you spend too much time watching "The View"..... Justine has sure set y'all canuckistanians up for success!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by HerrBerg:

quote:

Originally posted by LongDistanceOperator:
We didn’t all vote for that dumb bastard.

No, but enough did to make sure that one cannot rely on the US. When the US chooses sides, the US chooses Putin over Zelensky - and calls Zelensky a dictator.

There is no ally left that would rely on the US now.

Y'all will come screaming Mama the minute you are in trouble....as,has been proven at least TWICE.......

Funny, I was thinking of paying your way to Russia on the same terms.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
Funny, I was thinking of paying your way to Russia on the same terms.

Bear hunt or moose hunt? I'm not sure kamchatka is safe for Americans now?????

Screw you you headless elitist moron.....

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Comrade Yakob, you conveniently left out that when we needed our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were there for us. Your blind allegiance to the OJ and Putin are an embarrassment to actual Americans. You are a traitor comrade.

You might want this apologist moron to move in with you in stockholm. Ill pay the one way airfare, bit you gotta keep him!

You are the Putin apologist Yakob, a traitor to your country and to our former allies, but you stand firm with the orange turd and Russia. What a pathetic excuse for an American you are Yakob.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:
I meant to do some quick research on military sizes across the globe. Went down a rabbit hole. Some surprising numbers here. I just wanted to get an idea of what percentage of Global defense America puts on its own back. Point being, all these other countries that hate us, are under the blanket of security that these enormous forces provide. I mean no animosity, just presenting facts.

American Navy;

Interssting, didn't know. https://www.msc.usff.navy.mil/...USNavyShips-2025.pdf

https://www.visualcapitalist.c...carriers-by-country/

https://www.globalfirepower.com/navy-destroyers.php

Airforces around the globe;

https://bestdiplomats.org/coun...-largest-air-forces/

Ground forces. Wow.

https://www.visualcapitalist.c...gest-armies-in-2024/

Nuclear arsenal

https://www.google.com/imgres?...BHTB8MU8Q9QF6BAgAEAg

Subs

https://worldpopulationreview....ubmarines-by-country

Nobody hates the US, unless you count in the arab/persian world, North Korea, and such. There is just no love anymore. No trust. Mere disgust.

And it has nothing to do with people here being pissed about the US not paying for our home insurance. Because nobody are. There is no debate about that here. That was fucked up and we know it too.

The issue is how the US abandoned Ukraine, spewing out an insane set of lies, sucked Putin's dick (when the other option was to stand up for freedom against thugs and dictators), and proved to the world that there is nothing to rely on from the US side anymore.

Be sure that not only russia, but also China, is taking notes. As do North Korea, India, and any emerging local powers. The US won't stand up for their allies.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Yeah, we understand that we have been freeloading on the US when it comes to military expenditures. We understand the resentment from the US about Europe not wanting to do the heavy lifting in the core purposes of nations. We've handed out free lunches when the US has built our security and we have spat on the US for not giving out free lunches as we have. Of course, there has been general consensus that it is generally an bad idea to have strong german armed forces, but still...

You and the rest of Europe ought to be sitting back and wondering if your free loading might have caused this.

I am one of the Americans that's fed up with paying the lions share for the defense of Europe. While you are buying energy from and enriching Putin at the same we pay for your defense while going into !massive debt. Yes, I know, you aren't the only reason we are in debt...but a significant chunk for sure.

We've played world police for a long time. Sent many of our young people to die to save others. The US government hasnt always done the best, but we the people, have done our best! And we are paying for it. Our tax dollars, our children's blood.

Lots of us are tired of it! We have plenty we need to take care of here.

You guys handle it for a while, we will give out our free lunches and second guess everything you do and bitch about how your politicians handle everything.

Go get em furriner!!! Have at it!!! We know you superior Europeans will handle it.

Actually, if it wasn’t for you warmongering idiots, the rest of the world would be living in peace!

The most belligerent country on the face of the earth.

You create wars, so you get arse beaten.

Again and again and again!

Credit where credit is due Saeed, the UAE ius doing a hell of a job making a mess in Sudan. It is not as though you have an actual armed force that matters, you and your good friends the Russians are certainly responsible for much pain and suffering though.

The Sudanese sure are not laughing.

https://apnews.com/article/sud...eb114d94e230fc43ab65

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
Credit where credit is due Saeed, the UAE ius doing a hell of a job making a mess in Sudan. It is not as though you have an actual armed force that matters, you and your good friends the Russians are certainly responsible for much pain and suffering though.

The Sudanese sure are not laughing.

https://apnews.com/article/sud...eb114d94e230fc43ab65

We are assisting our brothers against foreign invaders.

YOU!

And as usual , your arse is being shredded to pieces!

Just normal for America!

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
Credit where credit is due Saeed, the UAE ius doing a hell of a job making a mess in Sudan. It is not as though you have an actual armed force that matters, you and your good friends the Russians are certainly responsible for much pain and suffering though.

The Sudanese sure are not laughing.

https://apnews.com/article/sud...eb114d94e230fc43ab65

We are assisting our brothers against foreign invaders.

YOU!

And as usual , your arse is being shredded to pieces!

Just normal for America!

I believe that it is YOU and your Russian friends that are losing in Sudan. No surprise there, how many weeks did you last in Yemen? Was 5 or 6 weeks before you fled in defeat?

Well, the disgust from Sweden about the US has some validity… but that from the #1 Nazi trading partner (iron/nickel during WWII)?

I’m disgusted with Trump’s kowtowing to Russia, but face it, until Putin is gone, the war in Ukraine will continue, unless Ukraine makes some concessions. Even at this point I am unwilling to countenance US troops in Ukraine. I know that’s not the question here, but that’s probably the only way to get that war resolved if Ukrainian territorial integrity with prewar borders is going to happen.

European demands for globalism have resulted in a bit of a pushback to their leaders and policies in the US. How long did you expect us to wearily foot the bill while you admit you are not carrying your share… but not making any effort to change that?

I’m in agreement that appeasing Putin is not a good idea.

But that Europe has been lecturing us on proper behavior is certainly part of why you are seeing this political swing in the US. I agree it’s cutting our nose off to spite our face, but still.

Your leadership has shown no willingness to help contain China.

Neither side is blameless here, and the strong US thread of isolationism is something that is growing as economic times get worse relatively here.

I had a discussion with Lane not so long ago to the effect that Europeans he deals with are intrigued by Trump and his antics, have nothing but positive things to day about him and are not falling about the place laughing at his ludicrous comments.

I can only echo the OP’s comments.

Trump has not made the world a safer place, he is doing the opposite.
Trump has weakened the wests traditional alliance structure.
Trump is empowering Putin and doing nothing to limit his warmongering.
Trump is turning his back on a sovereign nation who want freedom and democracy and are willing to fight for it but they need the tools to do so.

Frankly, if a NATO country was attacked by Russia next week, I’m only 50/50 on Trump honoring the US commitment to the alliance. I’m not sure about Hungry either, but the rest of the European allies and Canada I’m 100% certain would step up.