I grew up kind of poor. All my life I have dreamed of having a nice piece of property where I could hunt and fish and play, do my own thing without having to get anybody's permission. Now that I have been able to achieve that with a couple of nice places (we're only talking about a few hundred acres here) I find it can be a headache. When you have a nice piece of property the leeches just come out of the woodwork. And they have attitudes, they figure you owe them the right to fish/hunt/shoot/ride their four-wheelers over your place. I try to be diplomatic but you just don't get taken seriously. Now I am buying a nice house on 100 acres, this will be my family's home. We haven't even closed on the place yet and I am getting approached by complete strangers who feel like they have a right to use the place as they will. I was always taught by my parents to respect others' property and stay on my own side of the line, and I expect others to do the same. When you tell people that you're the bad guy. Then you have those who don't bother to ask and just flat-out trespass. I would like to hear from some of you folks who own places on how you deal with it. I am not a selfish guy, I do have friends over to enjoy the place with me, but in the main I work hard and value my free time and my privacy. I know I won't get much sympathy from some who are not as fortunate as I have been. I feel like after working hard all my life I should be able to enjoy a little peace and quiet on my own place. Rant *OFF*, thanks for reading.

I don't think you owe ANYBODY access to your property. Who cares if they get disappointed when you politely say "No."

Post the signs, and enforce them with a field camera and an AK47.

Thanks, Cane Corso. Hey those seem like awesome dogs. I have never seen one in person but I have run across them on a couple of websites while reading about protection dogs. We may get one eventually.

Let them get upset.Its your place and you decide who gets in or not,its that simple.
Post fences and tell the ones that you let in that they have to ask you for permission.

Yes MMM, Cane Corsos are indeed the best dogs (along with Dogos Argentinos) especially for someone like you who has a nice piece of property and needs to deter trespassers. They are very good and gentle with children and have a very strong "stay close to home" protective instinct.

They are also outstanding "catch and seize" dogs for wild hogs and small game like coyotes or wolves. VERY good at tracking with their giant noses, too. You'll be hearing them sniffing constantly in search of game.

As I posted a while back here on AR, mine has "flushed" out a couple of illegal immigrants hiding under brush that use the open space behind my house to cross over from Mexico.

I have only one now, but, my retirement dream is to have a hundred acres and breed them.

As someone who owns and has owned quite a bit of rural property most of my life, I can give you some free advice......

First, the best word in your vocabulary is "No". Don't "try to be diplomatic". You're not in the diplomacy business. Don't quibble, don't explain, just say "no". If you don't get used to using it, you're going to have the type of problems you're experiencing. If you feel like being diplomatic, simply say, something like "I worked hard to buy this place, I work hard to maintain it, and I prefer to enjoy it in private." If they say anything, tell them to go buy their own. That's diplomatic.

When you do invite/allow someone onto your property, BE VERY SPECIFIC as to what they can and can't do, and ESPECIALLY whether they can bring a friend....if they can, SPECIFY how many. Otherwise, you're going to invite a good buddy from work to hunt or fish on your place and he'll show up with 4 of his closest friends, which you may not even know. Finally, make it very clear if this is a one time invitation or not. Otherwise, they'll be there when you don't want them to be.

As to uninvited trespassers, be sure you have your property legally posted which varies greatly from state to state. Discuss with your local Sheriff in advance your desire to not have trespassers roaming on your property and get his advice on how best to enforce the law. Usually, and it would depend on the circumstances, I would give a verbal warning the first time, after that, I would prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. Sometimes you run into local DAs who prefer not to prosecute simple trespassing, in which case you'll have to force them into it by publicity, etc.

Finally, you need to keep in mind this dictum, if you own rural property and are not using it, someone will be.

Thanks Gatogordo, good advice, especially your last line. I bought some beautiful hunting and fishing property a few years ago from a man whose health had not permitted him to hunt for several years. Well it took us awhile to get all the freeloaders cleared out (we think). Some of them were kind of resentful. We ran several people out, some more than once. Another time we drove out there and as we were pulling up to our gate there was a guy coming down the road toward us on a fourwheeler with a rifle slung across his back. When he saw us turn in he stopped short, watched a minute, then slowly turned around and went back where he came from. Then word gets around (small town) that I'm buying a new home, and I am approached through acquaintances by people I don't even know about coming out there. It just never ends. I have known people who have had hunting camps burned. You're right, have to get firm and tough or it won't go away. It gives you a small idea of what people who win the lottery must go through.

One of the funnier instances that happened to me is when a guy tried to run me off my own property while I was squirrel hunting on it. I had just recently purchased the place, the idiot told me he had it leased for hunting (he didn't, no lease or agreement in effect with previous owner). I told him that I owned it now, that he had 10 minutes to get his ass of my place and, that that really high end aluminum construction deer stand I had found didn't need to be there by the next weekend or I'd sell it for scrap. He disappeared like smoke and the deer stand was gone by the next day.......

Hillbilly types are everywhere ... even here in Urban Paradise. Post some "Bio Hazard" "Dangerous Waste" "Contaminated Wildlife and Vegetation" signs.

Man, that top pic of the Cane Corso looks like something from "The Omen" right outta the gates of hell......we need more of those along the border!

Land ? there are some serious problems that you may get into. Check out the subject of "adverse possession " That's one way you can lose your land. Regularly inspect your land , not just during hunting season, for things like illegal use -marijuana etc.
Say NO and take photos ,get id's ,call conservation officer .

I've had that same "buy land urge" ever since my two sets of grandparents sold their land in Indiana.

I've always been mad at my dad for not buying some land he could will to me. Now that I'm in a financial position to do it, I'm struggling with the same concerns I read here. It's hard to protect a piece of land in Texas or New Mexico when you are living on the other side of the world.

I may never get that 100 to 300 acres I've been dreaming about for forty years, and maybe it doesn't matter. I want a homestead that can stay in the family, unfortunately I don't see the opportunities for the next few generations to make the money I have. My place would probably go on the block the day after I die.

Kensco:

It's not nearly as grim as you think. The main problem with any rural property (all these comments refer to US only) and absentee owndership is if there is a house or houses on it which, of course, require maintenance, furnishing, etc if they are to be used and, can be objects of theft or vandalism.

OTOH if you buy non-improved property to use when you retire there is a very easy out to keeping watch/contol over it, lease it out for hunting or agricultural use. It is also pretty easy to get any neighbors you have to keep an eye on it for you. They don't like vandals or trespassers either.

Due to the current economy, land prices in Texas are basically flat in my observation, BUT they could break lower if things get worse or if you can find a seller who is in dire need of cash. In short, instead of saying "I may never" you should be looking hard in an area you would like to retire in or own land.

Everyone has their own requirements, but if someone buys high sight index E Tx pine timber land at a decent price in today's market, then they have a wonderful long term investment which can be lived on or hunted as well as providing excellent returns on your money.

But, it's each person's money, so they should do what they think works best for them. Frankly, I've lived in cities and I've lived in the country. Cities are fun when you're younger OR TO VISIT, and the country is fun forever. JMNSHO.

We're looking in the San Saba to Austin corridor.

Beautiful area but mostly pretty expensive for rural real estate. I'd stay out of Travis County (Austin) unless you have a really strong reason to be there because of regulations and taxes. I don't have anything down there but I love some of the exposed rocks etc and views that you get in that area.

You probably already know about this, but every now and then there is a nice place/buy in.........Texas real estate magazine.........reading it will also give you a good feel for prices after you sort the wheat from the chaff (I don't see how some of those guys ever sell anything at the prices they list) plus it has many realtors sites on it that you can contact. Many people don't know this, but you can hire a realtor to act for you as a buyer as well as a seller.

Texas Farm & Ranch is another magazine I pick up every year or so. There are gorgeous places, but I get the feeling most aren't really for sale at those prices, just publicized for bragging rights. Some are there year after year.

The closer I get to retirement, the more likely I'm going to end-up somewhere like Horseshoe Bay. I wouldn't mind that if I could still wander off to "my" place, and just kick rocks, or watch a few deer doing their thing.

A few years back I owned 1987 acres of Ozark hills with the headwaters of the Eleven Points river running through it. It is a paradise for turkey and deer hunting. It is about two hours drive from where I live.

Over the 23 years I owned it I put it in the tree farm program, proformed TSI (Timber Stand Improvement), planted wildlife food plots, bought a dozer and dug 7 ponds,planted Christmas trees, put in many hours on my tractor brush hogging the open areas, repaired and replaced fences and gates, fixed up the old farmhouse, bought 4 wheeler to patrol the place etc.etc.etc.

My brother, friends, clients and sons enjoyed many days of hunting on the place. They always asked before coming and I always tried to schedule them so there would not be any conflicts. They seemed to appreciate it.

As for me, I found that most of my time was spent working on the place and running over to where I heard a shot to see what trespassers had killed.

I occasionally had a morning to hunt by myself and eventually it dawned on me that out of that entire property there was three areas of about 60 acres each that all the game was killed in.

One day my uncle and I were driving along an old logging road back to the camp house. It was turkey season and the day was extremely windy. As we crested a hill shotgun bbs splattered my truck. I stopped and jumped out behind the open door as my uncle (also a veteran) did the same on the other side.

A trespasser jumped up and started to run off. I yelled and he stopped, turned and raised his shotgun. I raised mine. He turned and ran but I was already in fire mode. We did not find any blood and no one seemed to turn up missing. I reported it to the police but no one ever was found to be wounded.

This event started me thinking. Would I want my two sons to have to spend their life defending this property? Would one of them eventually get shot doing it? Do I really want this to be passed on to the family?

My decision was agonizing. I had spent years acquiring neighboring lands and eventually paying them off. Land prices were going up each year. Yet I could not get it out of my mind that one of my sons or their sons would be in a firefight eventually as a result of trying to run off a trespasser.

Also it was obvious that I had to spend every deer and turkey season chasing down gunshots where the neighbors slipped over the fence.

Then there was the property taxes, repair costs, electric bill, gas to run over there every weekend. There was attorney costs too.

One day it suddenly hit me that my yearly costs were $17,000 per year. For that amount, I thought, I could hunt Africa every year and not have to defend and repair a property.

Along with that I realized that over the entire acreage there was only the three pockets of good hunting areas where most everything was killed.

I sold the property for twice what I paid for it soon afterward. Now I travel to Alaska, Africa, Australia and Canada and it costs about the same as all the property expenses.

I also purchased an 80 acre plot within a 10 minute drive of my house that is a good hunting area. I have virtually no expense and the hunting is as good as I need.

The only difference is that I dont invite clients and friends. Its only for me and the boys. I find that 80 acres is plenty. You can dig a pond, set out some food plots, set some stands etc. and have some very reliable hunting.

I have used the money that I used to pay for taxes and upkeep for hunting trips each year to Africa etc. and my experience is richer for it.

So for me the best idea is to find a small acreage loaded with wildlife rather than a big acreage with just a few small hotspots on it. Then use the money you would have spent on the big property to hunt other places in the world.

Palmer, thanks for sharing your experience, that's the kind of story I hate to see but I can certainly understand your decision. I can't stand the idea of giving in to parasite scum but I can see where you get to a point where that's better than letting it eat you alive looking out for your rights. It really is a crying shame, I guess if land ownership is such a headache for regular guys then big corporations or megamillionaires who can afford to have the place policed by full-time caretakers will end up with it all.

wait until you find the first small patch of marijuana plants growing off in a hard to get to corner of your place. There will be ten more you haven't found yet.

Rich

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
wait until you find the first small patch of marijuana plants growing off in a hard to get to corner of your place. There will be ten more you haven't found yet.

Rich

Helps feed the deer. They love it.

A quick question, diversion of thread topic, concerning a post made within the thread: "adverse use / ownership" causing the legal title holder to have the property taken off them,

Here in the UK, various local government and charity bodies are proposing unoccupied, and /or under utilized properties will be taken off the legal owners and used for social housing purposes.

People who work away from home on long rotations, like oil & heavy construction on 3:1 work-leave rotas, are getting a bit nervous. As are holiday home owners.

Do you have something similar to this in the States?

It is a bitch if the area you live has no work and you must travel, yet could not afford or would not want / be able to re-locate to be near the job (short contracts, Middle East etc).

Not really, the only thing similar that I can think of would be local city or county condemnation proceedings for owning a hazard, such as a truly dilapidated house that is a hazard or health risk. One example would be an old building that is partially burnt and the owner, for economic or other reasons, can't or won't repair it. The controlling agency would then condemn it, notifying the owner that they have a certain period of time to fix it or, usually, the city will demolish it, at the owner's expense in some locales.

The "adverse possesion" mentioned above is mostly a red herring put forward by those who don't own much property in the US and very, very rarely occurs for any large piece of property. It takes a long time or some fairly obvious procedures (such a living on the property and paying the taxes) in most states to establish a claim of adverse possession. One of the absolute last things I would worry about as a land owner.

I own 151 acres of very desireable rural property that is bordered on one side by a small river. It is extremely good deer hunting property, as well as moderately good for duck and ruffed grouse hunting. Every now and then it also holds wild turkeys.

I came to that property later in life as well.

My policy is to share that property with someone. Not everybody. Not even close.

But I recall all of the times that I asked, and continue to ask, other landowners to hunt on their land, and the many times that they said yes. I also recall the many times they said no, but were very nice about it.

So, one or two a year that come and properly ask to hunt, and ask where they can hunt, are graciously allowed to hunt. I tell them where they must be and explain it in terms of safety.

Hell, I have even helped guys drag deer off of that property.

One thing that I try to do is spread the wealth so to speak. I write down who I let hunt there, and generally don't let any one person get too comfortable with it to the point where they actually expect to hunt there. If possible, somebody different gets the nod each year.

If it weren't for vandals, thieves and trespassers, owning rural property would be heaven. It's not the other local landowners you need to be concerned with, but the guy who buys a postage stamp sized lot and thinks he's entitled to all the rights and privileges of your property without paying the taxes. And no one ever bothers to even ask permission.

A case in point: It was mid July and I was hunting groundhogs in a harvested wheat field late one weekday afternoon. I had my crosshairs on the chuck, but his head was going up and down as he was eating and then having a look around for trouble. So a certain amount of time was necessary to bag him.

He was about 125 yards away. There was another 250 yards from him to the tree line at the end of the field. Just as I was about to squeeze the trigger of my 22-250 Rem, I spotted something in the shadows of that tree line that seemed out of place. Almost directly in line with the chuck. It was hard to tell at first because the brilliant sunshine made the shadows look solid black. But from hunting that field all my life I sensed that something was not as it should be and I let down the hammer of my Browning 1885 single shot rifle.

I readjusted the parallax on my Bausch & Lomb Balvar scope from 125 yards to 400 yards to get a clear sight picture and then scanned the tree line. I was aghast! There was a guy sitting on a folding stool painting a picture on an easel. Once I composed myself after thinking what could have happened had I pulled the trigger, I got in my truck and accosted him. He said he had been there on quite a few occasions before and didn't think he was hurting anything. When I told him he could have been killed, he acted nonplused.

Another time a motorcycle rider made a sweeping U turn and upset his chopper on a big rock at the side of one of my fields that borders a highway. The SOB sued me cause his knee was injured! He was 30' off the road and into my property.

I could go on with these types of stories. Land ownership can be a blessing but it is fraught with eternal vigilance.

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo

The "adverse possesion" mentioned above is mostly a red herring put forward by those who don't own much property in the US and very, very rarely occurs for any large piece of property. It takes a long time or some fairly obvious procedures (such a living on the property and paying the taxes) in most states to establish a claim of adverse possession. One of the absolute last things I would worry about as a land owner.

I agree. I was a land surveyor and I have seen adverse possesion work exactly 1 time. To claim adverse possesion, SIGNIFICANT improvements have to be made by the plaintiff. the one case I saw that won was a homeowner next to a cemetary who had serious erosion problems with a creek that ran along the back of his property. He spent a considerable amount money installing gabion walls in the creek and for all his trouble and expenses, recieved about 25' of the cemetary's prpperty.

When I hunted I found I could help the owner during the spring, summer and fall with chores. Never met a farmer, rancher that couldn't use a spare set of hands.
Now days I like to prowl the woods, etc. with my camera. Still help the land owner, last time was filling ruts with stones, in his farm road.
If I spot anything unusal I report back to the owner.
Been turned down a few times. That's OK it's their land. All that I've met appreciate me asking, even if they turned me down.

Jim

Just say no! You don't have to explain. One thought, you could tell all of the folks that will suddenly become your friends that the place is under lease and only you and your family can hunt there. (whether it is or not)

I lease 1500 acres for the Missouri firearms deer season along with 14 others and it ticks me off to no end year after year I see trespassers.

I too have always thought it would be nice to own a couple hundred acres and a small lake but I know it would come with an ass load of work and headache.

Post your land and good luck in trying to enjoy it without people causing you grief.

I've got 42 wooded acres with a 5 acre lake in the city limits near lots of Corps of Engineers land. I've counted as many as 11 deer under my corn feeder at one time. No hunting in the city limits, Good thing that I've always liked bow hunting more than gun hunting.
Jeff

It's awfully hard to keep a straight face when you reply to a trespasser that tells you he has permission from the landowner by saying, "I AM the landowner". The look on their faces is precious!