Definition of Reasonable:

a :being in accordance with reason a reasonable theory.

b :not extreme or excessive, reasonable requests.

c :moderate, fair a reasonable chance.

Definition of Moderation:

: avoiding extremes of behavior or expression : observing reasonable limits

: calm, temperate

: tending toward the mean or average

: to lessen the intensity or extremeness of

Those are the Merriam-Webster definitions of Reasonable and Moderation.

What is the individual definition of Reasonable Moderation by the members of AR as they should pertain to the Accurate Reloading Forums?

Should we simply Moderate ourselves as individuals and make our own decisions as individuals whether or not to reply to a comment and what direction that reply should take and how it should be worded.

What about making insulting or offensive comments or calling people names or making totally false claims about another member?

quote:

Grenadier want to discuss this, Reasonable Moderation on AR?

Randall, I really appreciate that you would like to discuss this with me. I really do. I think some sort of moderation is needed and AR is suffering without it. But an in depth discussion of moderation on AR is not mine to discuss. I suggest you take it up with the management via PM and/or email.

Best regards.

We already know where discussing it with Saeed and Don is going to go.

But what about the concept of members making an effort to start the dialog among themselves and showing an interest in at least trying to address the problems, instead of expecting the PTB's to try and control the actions of so many.

For things to change and get this site headed more into the direction you and some others would like to see it headed, it is going to take input across the board from the members.

Whether you want to agree to it or not, the site got the way it is, simply because Saeed and Don got tired of expecting Adults to be able to have REASONABLE discussions on the various topics that come up on AR.

In all reality, AR, including the Crater, got into the shape it is in due to the members, that includes me and you!

It was a group effort that got things into the shape they are and it will take a group effort to either correct the problem or kill the site.

Gentlemen,please forgive me for an intrusion onto your "pissing match".You are both talking trash to one another + nothing is being done except to increase your blood pressure.Give it a rest;for everyone.

quote:

Gentlemen,please forgive me for an intrusion onto your "pissing match".You are both talking trash to one another + nothing is being done except to increase your blood pressure.Give it a rest;for everyone.

This really isn't a pissing match. AR has morphed into something that is not accomplishing anything other than causing good knowledgeable people to leave the site, and not just the Crater, and preventing very much civil dialog on practically any subject to take place.

Take your comment quoted above, there have been a total of 4 comments made counting my OP and where can you point to any hostility or animosity?

Do you like the direction the whole AR site has taken over the past year or so?

Look around, even the most reasonable topics get turned into arguments over basically minutiae.

I have been guilty of helping things get into the shape they are in, but I am not the sole fly in the ointment.

Have you ever thought to yourself, "Why Does "X" have to post so much" while at the same time thinking "What Does It Really Matter"?

Honestly, I feel that the only way to address what has happened to the site, is instead of expecting Saeed and Don to babysit us, is for the members to figure out why it has became so difficult to simply "Talk" to each other.

Randle,I agree. I enjoy decent conversations with like minded + not like minded members here;however I have a problem with the total argumentative tone that seems to prevail,especially on the polo. forum. So I just rarely go there.No it should be the members themselves that act in a civilized manner + not put Saeed or Don in a referees position.We are pretty free here on this site,not like others I could mention. One in particular I was on I posted a comment by Pres. Harry Truman who we all remember as 'Give en hell Harry.'Well they changed it to 'Give en heck Harry'.Kinda ruins the whole thing by caving to P.C.

Believe me when I state that I have been to willing to use profanity toward other members in discussions on AR whether there was any provocation or not, and the only thing it accomplished was NOTHING.

I just simply feel that if the members begins showing some self restraint in the discussions that take place Saeed and Don might be willing to re-establish a certain amount of moderation.

Among the things I would like to see changed on the Member's level is the "Concern" some seem to have in regards to the number of posts/responses other members make. All of us live and operate under differing circumstances/parameters. I would love to see the post counts listed for members when they make a post/response done away with.

I am sure the administration has a good reason to have it set up that way but on every site like this one that I have been on all it does is cause problems.

It would be great if each member could simply make their posts/responses without being attacked in some manner or insulted, simply because they view situations differently.

It would just be refreshing to see discussions on AR, across the board and not just in the Crater without degenerating into meaningless

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting: ...causing good knowledgeable people to leave the site...

You should be happy at how influential you are, I mean really people are just following the advice you give in your signature.

quote:

If you're so irritated, have you considered leaving?

Why don't you stop wasting Saeed's bandwidth and take this to private messages?

George

I don't think people are leaving AR. Sure, postings are less frequent in the guns/ammo/hunting forums but that is to be expected.

When internet forums first started there was a big rush but eventually things level out as w can only discuss certain topics so many times.

I have been here since 1998...with some banning interruptions and to me many names here are still the same.

GeorgeS above I think has been here from 2000 when the forum layout changed. Like others such as Ray Atkinson he was mainly HuntAmerica. Like myself George no longer posts nearly as much on the Big Bores forum nd I would bet that is not because he is posting regularly on some other forum.

You blokes are going on about nothing.

Even before that, Mike. I believe I was the 23rd person to register in 1998-1999, then we lost all the statistics in a data base crash.

After all these years, there are hardly any new roads left to explore.

George

quote:

Originally posted by GeorgeS:

After all these years, there are hardly any new roads left to explore.

Perhaps not so new to us but still new to many, especially those younger than us. If all the topics are too well talked about here why doesn't it seem they are too well talked about for other hunting and shooting websites? You know, the ones that are not seeing the dive in traffic AR is.

We have a corps of die hard regulars here. Many, perhaps most, of whom are posting less and visiting less. And I don't think AR is adding as many new hunters and shooters to the ranks as it once did, or at least as many who hang around and participate much.

Mike, the previous level of moderation must not have been overly oppressive or excessive because here you remain, in spite of previous bannings.

quote:

Originally posted by Grenadier:

Perhaps not so new to us but still new to many, especially those younger than us. If all the topics are too well talked about here it why doesn't it seem they are too well talked about for other hunting and shooting websites? We have a corps of die hard regulars here. Many, perhaps most, of whom are posting less and visiting less. But I don't think AR is adding as many new hunters and shooters to the ranks as it once did, or at least many that hang around and participate much.

[/QUOTE]

I would bet that compared to years ago a very high percentage of new members to AR (and other gun forums) would already be on other gun forums.

Another issue is types of guns and calibres owned. AR was and still is a big bore type forum. In fact you would be left with the impression that there is a 375 or 404 behind every second bush Blokes with smaller bore high velocity stuff and up to 30/378 etc. tend to own and be interested in sporting and hunting configuration rifles and as you would know there are now plenty of forums that specialise in the "tactical" style of guns in either the "big case capacity smaller bore" or the "small capacity smaller bore".

As far as moderation/censorship in my experience that has killed many gun sites and the same applies in Australia. In fact the biggest (and biggest by a huger margin) guns/hunting forum in Australia is also the least censored, actually very similar to AR and also with an extremely active political forum.

With the guns/hinting forums on AR the Big Bores is the one I look at the most often and I can tell you it is very tame compared to years ago....very tame The others I look at although not as often are Medium Bores and Africa and they are also very tame.

As to the Political Forum, it would not matter how much it was moderated the simple fact is only a small percentage of members are up to or interested in the debates. The Political forum on the big Australian gun forum is the same as AR in the sense that anyone who goes there is not likely to be worried because someone tells them to go fuck themselves

Every internet site goes thru these slow periods, that will not change.

On thing that needs to change but won't are the PERSONAL GRUDGES that have developed among the membership, simply due to differences in viewpoints on the various issues.

That includes the attitudes of MODERATORS!

This is nothing more than an internet Forum/Chat Room/Bulletin Board, however a person chooses to refer to it, but developing a HATRED toward someone you will probably never have a face to face interaction with, does not help anything.

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
That includes the attitudes of MODERATORS!.

If you don't like the attitudes of the moderators, have you considered leaving?

George

After all these years the most abuse I ever have received and from the most quarters was when I confessed to wanting to shag Kelly Anne Conway.

Man it was brutal, they even shut down the PF for a few days!

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
After all these years the most abuse I ever have received and from the most quarters was when I confessed to wanting to shag Kelly Anne Conway.

And rightly so. Conway is a woman who acted 100% professionally while being the first of her gender to run a winning campaign for President.

She has never presented a sexualized persona; objectifying her the way you did was disrespectful. You deserved to be called out for it.

George

quote:

Originally posted by GeorgeS:

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
After all these years the most abuse I ever have received and from the most quarters was when I confessed to wanting to shag Kelly Anne Conway.

And rightly so. Conway is a woman who acted 100% professionally while being the first of her gender to run a winning campaign for President.

She has never presented a sexualized persona; objectifying her the way you did was disrespectful. You deserved to be called out for it.

George

Oh come on... I was hardly disrespectful and I think most understood it was meant to be an admittedly salty running joke intended to defuse the sometimes ludicrously over wrought tension that just occasionally pops up around here...

Besides, she looks like Patrick Stewart in drag...

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
Besides, she looks like Patrick Stewart in drag...

Then we await your "Patrick Stewart in drag: would you?" thread.



Gotcha!
George

quote:

If you don't like the attitudes of the moderators, have you considered leaving?

No, and if for no other reason than to keep YOU pissed off!!!!!!!!!!

I am fairly sure that if you had final say, I would have been banned LONG ago.

Luckily some of the PTB's on here have a better sense of FAIRNESS.

I am sure that you are a really a good person and I have read enough of your posts/comments on various subjects to know that you are a knowledgeable person.

The only thing I find fault with is that you openly display your prejudice against people that do not agree totally with your beliefs!

Randall,

I don't think you should be banned, and don't believe I ever said so.

Do I think you a fool for continuing to post as many obnoxious comments as you do? Yes, but I believe you're doing so with the intent of causing a stir.

Don't be surprised if that diminishes you in the eyes of others.

Fortunately for you, Saeed is kind enough to provide a forum where people can prove how foolish they are, 24/7/365.

George

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:


No, and if for no other reason than to keep YOU pissed off!!!!!!!!!!

You won't be able to piss off George, believe me!!! He has seen it all.

AR was really wild in the early 2000s, especially Big Bores and often the African forum.

If my memory is working George was a moderator on HuntAmerica when HA was the big time forum and it could get really wild.

George, do you remember all that stuff we had on HA with the Rem 700 and Jack Belk etc. From memory a woman rode into camp with a loaded Rem 700 in 243 and let the safety catch off and the gun fired and killed her kid who was behind a trailer.

HA was also the big Political Forum and ARs started in 2000 when AR moved to the bulletin board format.

The other day George I did a search on Big Bores for Mike375 just to see what mischief I been up to Actually it is interesting to go back to the early pages on Big Bores forum.

quote:

Do I think you a fool for continuing to post as many obnoxious comments as you do? Yes, but I believe you're doing so with the intent of causing a stir.

That is not, nor ever has been my intention.

I simply express my opinion on subjects. Is that really any different than you, other than I have a different view point than you???

Is my not simply AGREEING with something another member posts being obnoxious?

You have had your experiences, I have had mine, are you saying that what I have experienced is either a lie or totally immaterial?

Don't know how many years you have been hunting, but this makes 50 for me, and while I have not hunted Africa, I have done some hunting here in America and not just in Texas.

Really wished I could apologize for not measuring up to your standards as a Hunter, but I did not notice that to be a requirement for participating on here.

Mike,

I remember a wild and wooly HA and the bullshit posted by several of the people who now (dis)grace this forum.
The site owner would denigrate companies up until the time he sold them a sponsorship, at which point he would delete all his derogatory posts. That was the final straw for me.

Jack Belk was a good resource; then, he became a hired gun for the tort lawyers.

You and I certainly had our battles back in the day.


Randall, read your own posts sometime. It's not a matter of disagreeing; it's a matter of being disagreeable.

For your edification, next year will mark my fortieth year of hunting.
I don't recall making any derogatory comments about your hunting methods or experience. Can you point out where I might have done so, or are you just trying to deflect?


George

quote:

That is not, nor ever has been my intention.

quote:

For your edification, next year will mark my fortieth year of hunting.
I don't recall making any derogatory comments about your hunting methods or experience. Can you point out where I might have done so, or are you just trying to deflect?

And I have been hunting for 50.

To the best of my knowledge, you have never responded, negatively or positively concerning ANY post/response/comments I have made about hunting/guns or bullets.

Can YOU point out where I have EVER contested you on your comments/posts/responses on those subjects??? If you can PLEASE do so!

The problem as I see it concerns my views on politics! Did you vote for Trump? I did!

Is it that you find me obnoxious because I am a "Free Thinker" and don't follow the flock?

Or is it because I am willing to disagree with people because I do view issues differently?

You and I were NOT raised up under the same circumstances, nor did we attend schools in the same geographic region or develop the same beliefs about our individual importance in the overall scheme of things.

You seem to believe that my responses/comments/post are thought out and calculated, they aren't! I simply respond to how I view the issue and how I believe I am or will be affected.

xgrunt, I agree with some of what you say, but not all, and you served for my right to do that, Yes or No?

Care to honestly answer that?

quote:

Originally posted by GeorgeS:

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
Besides, she looks like Patrick Stewart in drag...

Then we await your "Patrick Stewart in drag: would you?" thread.



Gotcha!
George

Congrats dude, that was the joke...

I did post the very same on a thread but some humourless so-and-so seems to have deleted the KellyAnne thread altogether!

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
We already know where discussing it with Saeed and Don is going to go.

But what about the concept of members making an effort to start the dialog among themselves and showing an interest in at least trying to address the problems, instead of expecting the PTB's to try and control the actions of so many.

For things to change and get this site headed more into the direction you and some others would like to see it headed, it is going to take input across the board from the members.

Whether you want to agree to it or not, the site got the way it is, simply because Saeed and Don got tired of expecting Adults to be able to have REASONABLE discussions on the various topics that come up on AR.

In all reality, AR, including the Crater, got into the shape it is in due to the members, that includes me and you!

It was a group effort that got things into the shape they are and it will take a group effort to either correct the problem or kill the site.

To me, The Crater looks like it's doing exactly what it was intended to do. It contains contagion that would otherwise affect other parts of AR.

I've drifted off into other parts of AR that are more interesting, now and then looking at The Crater to see what's new (mostly nothing much).

We are consenting adults; the results are up to us and I'll say that Saeed and Don doing it right, or close to it.

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:


I did post the very same on a thread but some humourless so-and-so seems to have deleted the KellyAnne thread altogether!

I think that they were trying to save you the embarrassment when everyone realized that you had a thing for Beavis...

Ah, Mr Hinn...

How goes it my fellow fancier of the ropey birds of the right, have you put a hunt report up yet?

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
Ah, Mr Hinn...

How goes it my fellow fancier of the ropey birds of the right, have you put a hunt report up yet?

I have sworn off cross dressers, yep my Scotland trip is in the Euro Forum. But I may have to move it soon if May and Boris get their way...

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Hinn:

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
Ah, Mr Hinn...

How goes it my fellow fancier of the ropey birds of the right, have you put a hunt report up yet?

I have sworn off cross dressers, yep my Scotland trip is in the Euro Forum. But I may have to move it soon if May and Boris get their way...

I eagerly await the English airgun pigeon shooting forum on ar

Mike

quote:

To me, The Crater looks like it's doing exactly what it was intended to do. It contains contagion that would otherwise affect other parts of AR.

That sums it up pretty well, and from what I have seen, few of the folks that regularly post in the Crater, respond in the same way in other topic areas as they do in the Crater.

There might be some "Bleed Over", but from what I have witnessed, the hostilities that crop up in other topic areas are based on long term grudges between members that have never gotten along.

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Hinn:

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
Ah, Mr Hinn...

How goes it my fellow fancier of the ropey birds of the right, have you put a hunt report up yet?

I have sworn off cross dressers, yep my Scotland trip is in the Euro Forum. But I may have to move it soon if May and Boris get their way...

Quite right too, ruuuuuuuuuuuulllllllllllleeeee Britannia! Britannia rules the waves! Britons shal never be slaves!

I saw it, very nice report and I was very impressed with the tweed and deerstalker combo; thank you guys for keeping our traditions alive.

Have you completely sworn off Ann Coulter then? ten pints, bit of a squint, low lighting and a bag for your head in case the one on hers falls off, I reckon the jobs do-able.

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Hinn:

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
Ah, Mr Hinn...

How goes it my fellow fancier of the ropey birds of the right, have you put a hunt report up yet?

I have sworn off cross dressers, yep my Scotland trip is in the Euro Forum. But I may have to move it soon if May and Boris get their way...

I eagerly await the English airgun pigeon shooting forum on ar

Mike

Look...

This is the second comment-in-passing about the English and airguns, have you got something you're trying to say Mike?!


That's right, I'm callin' you out pard'ner!

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Hinn:

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:
Ah, Mr Hinn...

How goes it my fellow fancier of the ropey birds of the right, have you put a hunt report up yet?

I have sworn off cross dressers, yep my Scotland trip is in the Euro Forum. But I may have to move it soon if May and Boris get their way...

I eagerly await the English airgun pigeon shooting forum on ar

Mike

Look...

This is the second comment-in-passing about the English and airguns, have you got something you're trying to say Mike?!


That's right, I'm callin' you out pard'ner!

Just impressed and envious of the firepower and hunting opportunities in merry old england

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:


Have you completely sworn off Ann Coulter then? ten pints, bit of a squint, low lighting and a bag for your head in case the one on hers falls off, I reckon the jobs do-able.

Well if you put it like that... I may have to reconsider

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Hinn:

quote:

Originally posted by Ghubert:


Have you completely sworn off Ann Coulter then? ten pints, bit of a squint, low lighting and a bag for your head in case the one on hers falls off, I reckon the jobs do-able.

Well if you put it like that... I may have to reconsider

If you won't do it for Queen...

If you won't do it for Country...

If you won't do it for god...



Do it for Gryffindor!