For the last couple years I've been putting together a nice do it yourself muley hunt to Wyoming each fall.

Last year we took (7) which I thought was plenty, now everyone's buddy is wanting to tag along on the deal. Might be about (10) guys interested in going this fall. That seems a little crazy to me.

I don't have a problem with any of the guys, it just gets a little crazy around camp, a bunch of vehicles, more hunting pressure, a huge bunch to cook for, etc.

I am considering jumping ship and doing my own thing with about four of us.

How many do you guys have in your hunting camps ?

Well, if you can fit the team in a jeep, then its ok,

Make sure that Jeep is a CJ not a Wagoneer.

More than 4 is too many IMO

It depends on the area and how much hunting country around it.
We used to hunt a spot in the east kootneys every year. Camp could hold up to ten people some times. This was mainly a meat hunt because draws were easy to come by for anterless mule deer, whitetails, and elk. There was usually a bull moose tag in camp also and then every one had their over the counter buck tags on top of that. It was not uncommon to have 15 animals hanging by the time the hunt was finnished. The area had so many logged out areas that we were allways well spread out.
Now on the other hand I have my alpine hunts for mulies and goats that are sacred. There is a chance to see them in any of the alpine but mostly in two spots. I will only bring a pair of hunting buddies to that spot and they are sworn to secrecy. We see some pretty big bachelor herds there and some real bruisers. The goat tags are hard to draw but many to be seen.
I see your problem. It sounds like you have a good spot and it's pretty hard to turn people away after inviting them the previous year(unless your the invited one). Do you have a better option than this spot you talk of? And if so, can I come?

four makes for a good hunt. if they have common interest. i.e.; do they want to sit up all night drinking and playing cards or hunt hard or what. more than four start getting into each others way around the camp. And four makes for a nice divvy on camp chores, etc. I'd suggest two different groups independent of each other.
I assume you're camping. If you don't get up in the morning with a skiff of snow on the ground and watch the sun light up the snow on top of the Big Horns, you're missing a really great part of the hunt.

When I hunt on my uncles property in michigan, we usually have my cousin, his friend (who has been hunting there for a long time), me, and MAYBE one other person who would likely be my other cousin. All are respectable hunters, and we sort of all have our own ways of hunting and areas we like. For instance, I prefer the lower, swampy areas as opposed to the thicker forested areas with a lot of yearling trees. Too thick. Where on the property I hunt is pretty open with shots up to 100 yrds. Its near the pond and stream, but I find a lot of deer there. For thick typical michigan forest thats pretty good. I cant really comment much on your situation, but if YOU feel like there are too many people, and you began the deal, its up to you to tell the others to go somewhere else. Nothing like opening a chest of gold and having others getting first dibs.

Steiny: This is like someone previously said a tough one! It would be hard to disinvite someone or to even tell the rest of the guys you are going off to be in a smaller group. I have had to do this in the past though several times. The cure is when putting together a Hunt for a group of Hunters - I tell folks that invite themselves in or folks I invite in that this camp or this ranch or this area only accomodates "X" number of people! And the invited folks are not allowed to invite anyone unless there is a vacancy same with those that invite themselves - when a vacancy comes along so can they if they are approved! It sounds though like your area has room for many people its just the size of the camp may have grown to include some non serious Hunters or drinkers or something. I have been there also. That again is a tough one. In that you are either going to have to make sure camp is for serious Hunters and not people that will make your Hunting harder! I've been there to, many times, and have finally learned that lesson. Picking Hunting partners that are positive, energetic, up and at'em types that share gleefully in the fun as well as can still be upbeat in the tough conditions and tough times - is an ART! And that art pays dividends. I now even plan my camps around snorers! I don't exclude them I just have a bed for myself where I can sleep through and away from the snoring and be fresh in the morning to Hunt all day without a nap. A Hunting time wasting, mid day nap will be needed by me or anyone who is allergic to snoring like I am if snorers are invited to camp.
Yep, I think that is the secret, keeping the number of invited Hunters to what the camp (area) can tolerate and those Hunters invited are in fact "Hunters". If you think things are gonna get crazy with 10 or more Hunters then by all means take 3 "Hunters" and set up your own camp. Or make alternate plans. Visit the other camp on occassion and don't feel guilty! Its your hard earned time off and your money that paid for the long trip and the licenses. Having said that I was invited into a camp recently for a week of Hunting and there were 10 of us in that Deer/Elk camp. I shot a 5X5 Bull Elk and saw three huge Mule Deer and 2 Wolves along with many Moose and Coyotes. A great week was had by all in two medium tents and I slept in the back of the VarmintMobile. The other Hunters insisted I drive home and get the VarmintSons (my teenagers) on the weekend as they were out of school and could Hunt then. I did and the camp was then 12 and my sons slept well, right in with the snorers. And they were treated like Princes by all the other Hunters! They were the only young Hunters in camp and were hand fed and provided fishing poles to catch some rare (in our area) Arctic Grayling in the creek. Spoiled they were - to tell the truth! We were Hunting National Forest with unlimited areas to Hunt though. You did not say if your area can accomodate 10 Hunters! If it can handle 10 Hunters then maybe try it this year and see how it goes. But you as the originator of this Hunt - in my mind has the "SAY" on how many and "WHO" comes to the camp! If someone has to be excluded ths year for sake of space and your sanity then tell them the truth and tell them as soon as there is room for them they will be invited. Maybe you will have to suggest another area that will have enough room for them as an alternative solution.
Good luck this year on your Hunt and your camp!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I hunted for about ten years in a mule deer camp in West Texas. A dozen hunters were not too many until I began to notice the company that "owned" the camp slowly lost control. They invited some of their biggest customers. One company started to dominate. Where they used to have two invitees, they now demanded six or eight. The whole "feel" of the camp changed, and I enjoyed the camp less each year.

When I was younger three of us hunted together; me, my brother-in-law and his dad. One year it got out of hand. My b-i-l invited two guys from work who invited a whole group of friends. We ended up with ten hunters in camp. Two men stayed drunk 24 hours a day. Their sons were the type that would shoot anything that moved. The hunt was ruined.

To me, the fewer people on a hunt, the better. I would rather hunt with one good friend, than any other combination. More than four on a hunt is hard to manage to the satisfaction of all.

Ditto, KENSCO ....

How many people in a camp, is as dificult to anwer as politiacs.

I for one, don't want more the 2 or 3 of us in any camp at any time.

I want quiet, and minimal hunting pressure.

I'm with Terry...if not solo then me and my wife.
Even 3 gets too many for me.
Jeff

Our Oregon (plus Idaho) mule deer and elk hunting group of over twenty years was comprised of 5 hunters, including myself. We made an agreement to not let in any new hunters, and we stuck by that deal until we disbanded a couple of years ago. Very rarely, and by mutual agreement, we'd let someone invite a guest, but never more than one guest per hunt. All of us were heavily and evenly invested in camp equipment, etc., which was a big factor in our longevity (more on this later).

If you get more than a small, core group of serious hunters who get along well together on a regular basis, your camp will self-destruct very quickly, simply because friendships get polarized, idiots & drunks inevitably start showing up, plus wilderness experiences and mobs don't set a quality tone.

Also: Freeloaders are a pain in the neck and a destructive element that need to be kept out altogether. It always seems that those with nothing invested in a camp, and no willingness to share time, money, and labor in a hunt always have a way of being the biggest jerks who you don't want back.

All of this stuff I've learned the hard way, so think on it......

AD

[ 01-28-2003, 17:54: Message edited by: allen day ]

I hunt with a group of 12 hunters in Colorado, normaly Deer and Elk. The last three years Deer are off limits to us in our area the last combined hunt. I am responsible for the whole group, I answer to the ranch owner, with trespass monies, etc. We started off with 3 hunters, myself and my son, and a good hunting buddy. We were quite successful hunting on our own, then others wanted to go along. Brother-in-laws with their son's, other buddies, etc. We found out real quick that we had to pick out hunting companions closely, or we ended up with some dead heads, who wanted to party instead of hunt, or wouldn't hunt or haul meat. Now we have a core group of veteren hunters. The original three pick the new hunters to the group, considering their hunting abilities, shooting skills, know-how in packing out game, etc. We even test their shooting abilities, at my private range. We had good hunters who wouldn't want to gut, skin, and cut up meat, they didn't come back. We have turned down close relatives, who could not handle their rifle correctly, no if's ands or buts. We have a good solid, hard hunting group, who can shoot with the best. We have one rule, hunt until you kill, then haul meat and help others scout. No party, until after the last second of the last day, then we might break out some Makers Mark and Woodford Reserve, to go with the Elk liver and onions. This year we killed 17 Elk during a fantastic, snowy and cold Colorada season. Good shooting.

ONE is a nice round number.....

But the most memorable hunt I've ever been a part of included 5 of us:

Me & my son (taking turns hunting/videoing).
My PH.
2 trackers.

Rick.

I've always liked two. Cause carrying an elk out on one back is a bit more work than desirable.

Last year, I invited a trio to come hunt, and it worked out great. The first time I ever enjoyed a "large" group. However, I don't like the "guiding" and "camp cook" parts. So, the deal is: you come to my camp, you cook. Works for me. FWIW, Dutch.

Gentlemen -- Let me say a good word for the larger group. I am certainly not trying to convince anyone to go to a larger group from the smaller two's, three's, just trying to give a perspective from the flexibility, and utility of a larger group. This year one of our group who is a senior member and a first class hunter and shooter, killed a fine Bull in a formidable location on a rugged mountain, late in the day with a blizzard blowing in. He dressed the Bull and returned to camp well after dark. We all stayed to make sure he returned safely, as we always do with each hunter. He told his story and lamented about the next day's chore, of hauling out the Bull. The next day three, young and robust members, who had already killed and were itching for another haul job, got together with a plan. The hunter who killed the Bull, arrived after a late breakfast, our normal practice to celebrate the kill, to find his Bull in camp, hung and skinned for packing. There is no way he could have gotten the Bull from where he had killed it, but because of the diversity of the group, he didn't hesitate to do what he has done for 30 years, "Kill his Elk" on his own, we have just extended his years of hunting and pleasure, down the road a little more. ------------- Another incident on the way home also speaks for the larger group. One of the group blew a transmission on a Chevy Suburban, pulling a 16 ft. trailer with four wheelers, equipment, 4 Elk worth of meat, etc. The group spontaneously contributed $100 each to help defray the cost of a $2,800 transmission. Another rule of ours is we all work together, overcoming all obstacles, until we are safely back home. Our wifes also understand this completely and each summer and winter, help with a Bar-B-Que cookout to celebrate the last hunt and plan the next. My point is that sometimes a larger group is helpful, and servicable, and maybe I too, can extend my hunting years, with my son and two of five grandsons approaching hunting age. Good shooting.

I say it depends on the company. Some 30 or so years ago I began going on hunts with my Dad and his companions and most of them were quality individuals. Sometimes we had as many as about 15 hunters, but all were sensible and organized. Those were, and still are some of my most memorable hunts Ive ever been on.

On the other hand just last year I ditched a couple of yahoos that I no longer cared to hunt with and finished the season out solo, which was fine as well.

It depends on a few things. I am want to put 10 to 12 miles on my feet a day in the hills (mountains to those of you not in the Rockies.) This usually means few takers. For the most part, one other is a good number. I cannot imagine how it would be to hunt around 10 or 12 people. I do think I would enjoy camp company if I knew that there would be no conflict during the actual hunting time, but then only if we all were somewhat like-minded as relates ethics and methodology. The last place I want to be is around drunken hunters, armed or not!
best,
bhtr

ps, come to think of it, it would scare me to know that there are 2 people that think like me, let alone 10 or 12!

Thanks for the input folks.
Think I'll just suck it up and take it, and see how many actually pony up the money come time to apply. Sounds like maybe nine or ten.

They're all good guys and there is plenty of country and deer, so I don't anticipate trouble, but this just seems like too big of a crew. To me about four is perfect.

If this happens, I'll be sure to drive my own rig so I can peel out, hunt a few miles from camp, and do my own thing.

Steiny, you have been given lots of thoughtful information. Adding to that you might consider your impact on the attitudes of the hunters in the host state. I hunt the same haunts VARMINTGUY does, and I can tell you that when parties of out-of-state hunters that are greater than 4 or 5 show up, the frowns start popping up like bucks the day after the season closes. As a self guided hunter, you are probably hunting primarily public land, and have every right to. But keep in mind that your party might enjoy a little more comraderie with the locals, and maybe even truthful tips about tactics and location of game if you haven't riled them with an invasion force fit for Afganistan. I know when loud, generator blaring, boisterous large groups of hunters show up in our neck of the woods (not saying you are one of those, mind you), the group I run with gets decidedly cold and un-friendly. A small group is much more accepted. They are viewed less as competition and more as fellow lovers of the hunt.

Additionally, if you want to get permission on private land, where the best hunting generally is, a large group is a huge strike against you.

Even in 'home turf' hunts, if the party gets too big, internal compitition can raise some ugliness in camp, and generate some festering problems, and even ruin otherwise perfect friendships.

Always fault on the side of a smaller party. Of course, unless you have meat on the ground that is!

Just one anti-social guy's opinion.

Greg

I think that 2 groups of two are great, especially if a moose is on the menu.

But. it depends on the country, of course. Around here, both groups can go off in different directions and not see each other for the day.

10 people around a campfire seems like a party to me. I'd just as likely drink a bunch of beer and enjoy the company. That's why I usually exclude booze from my hunting camps...I know myself too well.

(of course,you can only pack so much beer in a pack when hiking up a mountain)