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I love NABs, but I'm not afraid to admit when a bullet fails. The 150 NAB ahead of IMR4007SC shoots quite well in this particular 06, so I decided to fill a doe tag with the rig Saturday afternoon. Turned out to be a pretty good hunt. Around 5 pm I had 3 doe come out at 400 and while glassing them 4 more walked out at 180. I picked out one of the larger doe standing broad side and let her have it. It was a fairly common reaction, I heard the thud, she humped up, and made a mad dash for the brush as the others bounded off into the timber. The shot felt good and the reaction looked good, so I head to the camp to get an atv for the retrieval. When I got to the impact sight there was no sign at all and so many tracks, it was difficult to tell where she traveled in the thick brush. After an hour of grid searching, I decided to back out and come back in the am as it was going to dip into the 20s Sat night. I returned to search at 8am Sunday morning, but still found no sign at impact. After grid searching I found her laying by a creek probably 80-100 yards from impact. I noticed when I found her that the bullet had deflected terribly as the entrance was in the center of her shoulder and the exit(as you can see in the pic) was between her legs in the brisket area. The bullet absoultely destroyed the shoulder, but never entered the chest cavity, it deflected straight down. The 2nd pic looks like the sternum was destroyed, but strangely it wasn't at all. None of the ribs were broken and the sternum was not harmed at all. The meat and gristle were blown off of the sternum leaving a clean exposed bone. When I gutted her, the heart was fine, but one lung was bloodshot with a few tiny holes as well as a few small fragements of the bullet jacket mixed in. I've seen this exact bullet used on several medium game animals with good results even at 300WM velocities, but this one was a failure in my book. Yes, I got the deer, but the bullet definitely didn't perform in it's normal fashion. Anyway, I'm having steaks, smoked hot links, and bacon burger made out of her as we speak. Oughta be some fine eating. Blurry cell pics, but you can get the drift:  I stabbed the knife into the entrance wound for reference:  Ya'll have a Good One, Reloader | ||
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Dang...That's too bad. I've had nothing but luck with AB's. All of my shots have been pass throughs with devastating internal damage. "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then is not an act, but a habit"--Aristotle (384BC-322BC) | |||
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Had the same thing happen last year on a Sika deer using 110gr Accubonds.  Free men should not be subjected to permits, paperwork and taxation in order to carry any firearm. NRA Benefactor | |||
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I love the bullet as well and intend to keep using them. I guess maybe this should be more of a post on how any bullet can give strange performance than called a "failure." One thing that's odd is the exit in relation to the entrance. If you'll notice in my pics, there is no straight line relation between the entrance and exit. Meaning the bullet appears to have actually curved around the sternum in relation to the exit/entrance holes. Maybe the hide was blown down/stretched enough to give that effect. I've had a 150grn NPT Gold do a very similar but worse deflection on a whitetail shoulder, but I still consider it a very good whitetail bullet. Just goes to show that whether it be a mono that pencils or a cup and core that explodes, all of them can give strange performance at times. Ya'll have a good one, Reloader | |||
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You should pick out the deer not wearing kevlar to shoot! | |||
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Ronnie, that is incredible, thanks for the share. Is there any possibility the bullet could have deflected off of something before impact? I am assuming from your recap of the story there wasn't....I would really like a ballistics (or whatever appropriate expert) to tell us what could cause things like this to happen. I wonder if it would be worth you asking Nosler? I really hate to hear that, I have really been leaning towards AB's as my go to bullet, but that is quite disconcerting to learn of an incident (and throw in 30378's) or two like this. It was the doe's at 180 yards you shot if I read it right, so I wonder what impact velocity was? I'm gonna look and see what I find on that, just curious you know. HOT LINKS, that is a damn fine idea, I haven't had my butcher do any of those, and I love 'em, will have to ask him on next deer to be processed. Regards--Don | |||
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Don, I would say the bullet at impact was traveling in the neighborhood of 2500fps. No chance of a hit during flight as she was standing in a gas line ROW. I would not hesitate to use the NABs. I've used them in .284(140s and 160s) as well as .277 (140s) with great results. I've been impressed with them thus far and intend to keep using them. The NAB gives me the accuracy and performance I want, but any bullet can have a strange performance at times. Like mentioned, I've seen a NPT fail worse than this instance, but I consider it a great bullet as well. I've been loading the 150grn .308 NABs for years for two guys shooting 300WMs on primarily Whitetail, Mulie, and Boar with outstanding results. You would think they would be the ones to find this type of erratic performance, but you would know it would be me running them at 06 velocities  Matter of fact, I called one of my good buds whose been shooting this very bullet since it came out in his 300WM M70 and he said he's had nothing but great results on Boar, Mulie, and large WTs, so I just chalk it up to a freak occurence. I thought some of you may find it interesting as it is not your everyday bullet performance. Heck, I haven't even had this type of performance from match or NBTs in the past.This probably never would've happened with the heavier NABs. Expansive 150s in the .308 is asking for explosive results at times. Have a Good One, Ronny | |||
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Truer words were never written. Any bullet is subject to seemingly odd behavior at times. Like you, I certainly would not give up on a bullet, Accubond or other, on the basis of a single incident. For example, just-a-hunter's A-frames might, in the course of 1,000 shots, have a higher "failure" rate than the Accubond. | |||
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Fully agree SC.
I love em Don, the guy does his smoked links in either mild, spicey, or hot by varying the amount of red pepper. Sure hard to beat. I'll usually warm some on the pit for appetizers when we cook out and they don't last long when they hit the table. Ya'll have a good one, Reloader | |||
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I KNOW that's right! Should have thought of doing some a long time ago!!! I hear what you are saying on the 'strange things can happen' front, I've been lucky I guess, only had a few mono's pencil, and I did recover my critters.......just makes you wonder what really happened. | |||
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That seems like the kind of shot that I would have put through the ribs, not the shoulder. I doubt it would have run far. I have spent so much effort avoiding the shoulder with my arrows that I have a hard time aiming or them with my bullets. I never saw a bullet change directions that much, but again, I avoid big bones. I see no downside to shooting them behind the shoulder. Less wasted meat, sure kills (usually drops them), good blood if they run, big target. Especially with a fast light bullet. Shoulder shots with big slow bullets are smart, though. The only double lung runners I have had were with heavies. Good pics, thanks for giving us something to discuss. Jason | |||
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Damn, and here I was going to start doing some load development for my 7-08 using the NAB for an upcoming PG hunt. Guess I'll put the accubonds on the back of the shelf and start with other bullets. Thanks for posting the results and glad you recovered the doe. Something really wierd happended. I wonder if upon impact only one half of the bullet opened, which would have slowed the bullet on the open side and 'turned' it. Did you notice anything 'weird' with the wound channel other than the direction portion? Also, were these 2nds or were they 'off the shelf' bullets? Graybird "Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning." | |||
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graybird, fear not.......the accubond will perform well for you on PG. In 2006 10 of us went to Africa and shot over 100 head of game with at least 75 taken with the accubonds of various calibers without a single failure/problem. This was on game from 20lbs to 1500lb Eland and some tough Zebra. I took 6 head of game including warthog, kudu, gemsbuck, black wildebeest, blesbok and zebra without issue. Is addition, those same hunters have taken a trainload of NA game with accubonds. I have complete confidence in them. Every bit the equal to the well recognized partition. | |||
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Like Reloader has alluded to, when you hunt and shoot long enough, a strange thing or two will eventually happen. Some can be explained; others become great ballistic mysteries. Don't give up on the ABs. This happened to Reloader, and he isn't panicking and jumping ship. Bobby Μολὼν λαβέ The most important thing in life is not what we do but how and why we do it. - Nana Mouskouri | |||
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I had what may have been a similar performance with Hornady GMX on a cow elk. Similar damage along the outer ribs. Animal was angled toward me, bullet seemed like it hit the shoulder, but instead of punching through the ribs, slid along them and then went through, then traversed the body and exited. Stuff happens.   There was not nearly the internal damage I would have expected and this cow was hit then went down and stayed down for like 5-7 minutes then jumped up. It was as if the bullet may have not passed pass diagonally through the chest but slid along the outside and then caught a rib and made hard right and only caught the back of the lungs. Mike Legistine actu? Quid scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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GB, They were 2nds, but I feel that really has no effect on the outcome. I personally have as much faith in the NAB as I do the NPT. If they shoot well for you, I wouldn't hesitate to use them. I prefer the heavier for cal NABs such as the 140s in .277, 160s in .284 or 180s in .308. The result of this particular instance most likely had to do with the bone impact as well as the light weight of the bullet. While I do load .308 180 NABs, I prefer to use them in my 300 Mags vs the 06. Have a Good One, Reloader | |||
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No failure there.just about any boolit except a solid or hard cast will do that including Barnes.Shoot high for the spine or behind the shoulder and that does not happen.  | |||
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on the 2nd buff we killed in dec i had all 3 shots out of a 300 wsm and accubonds fail,don't know if it was the heavy hair of the buff or what.no penetration and no expansion, wounds were less than 6" deep. also saw the same preformance on a bull elk in oct. the only thing these shots had in common was the 40- 50 yds distances. this doesn't relate to the longer shots that some of the rest of you had. and my first thoughts were high velocity at close range,but now i wonder had to put the buff down w/ my 375 as he was pissed at this point and had spotted us and was coming hard. the 2nd shot on the elk was @ 120 going away and the guy slid one in behind the ribs ranging forward and tore up the liver bad enough the bull went and laid down and was finished with a close range neck shot that got the job done. i've never used these bullets for myself and never seen them fail with others using them, but with what i've just read from these posts and what i witnessed this yr,don't believe i'll try them. | |||
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We had three failures with them not long after they first came out. All of them were on mule deer from about 200yds on broadside shots, one a 140gr-270, a 30/06 with a 200gr and the other a 200gr from a 300mag. We quit them after three bad experiences, shot the rest up at the target range. I've used partitions since 1973 and never had that many failures. Have a good friend that tried them in his 338 over in Africa a few years ago, after three or four animals and bullet blowups he borrowed a box of his friend's Rem. ammo loaded with Swifts. No problems after the switch. I'm glad others have had better luck with them. | |||
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The above is I think the best explanation of what occured. I've had a similar experience using a 150 gr. cup/core bullet from a .308 on a small doe at close range: Entered shoulder, blew-up, traveled under the skin towards the "belly-button" and exited, never entering chest cavity. Even great bullets can do "wierd" things! friar Our liberties we prize, and our rights we will maintain. | |||
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I guess I just don't understand using anything but premium controlled expansion bullets for big game hunting (even deer) unless it's purely a matter of economics. If that was the case I'd be buying Remington core-lokts in bulk, using heavy for caliber bullets and keep my velocity down. I shoot mainly Sierra 90g HPs out of my 270 for practice and varmint hunting, but have always switched to 150g Nosler Partitions for big game. Reloader, thanks for showing the effect, and the bullet failure. It was unfortunate but very educational. Appreciate it. Chuck Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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That is why I prefer heavy for caliber bullets. | |||
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heavier bullets do strange things too, sometimes. | |||
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I guess I can't believe the folks ready to give up on a bullet based on one shot in one animal? Like the boys said, over time all bullets will have a "story"........... Bob There is room for all of God's creatures....right next to the mashed potatoes. http://texaspredatorposse.ipbhost.com/   | |||
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I saw a 200 NAB out of a .300 RUM do basically the same thing on a fork horn Mule Deer at something under 100 yards. I've heard of few other "failures" on the net with NAB. I wonder if the fact they design the bullet for the front to blow off like partition doesn't cause problems. The other tipped-bonded bullets are designed to retain weight and supposed to flatten out more and retain more weight. The NAB is designed to have a smaller expanded frontal diameter and penetrate deeper (ala partition). I "theorized" that since there is no partition to keep front end relatively flat, the front of the bullet can break off uneven and cause it to penetrate/deflect at odd angles. Lou | |||
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