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Going on a Coues hunt in January 2015. Wondering what cartridge for those that have hunted Coues was used. I have a new 6BR that I can shoot up to 90gr bullets. Is 90 grains heavy enough for Coues deer ? | ||
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I've used from 243 Win on up as well. It really depends on where you're going. Most of the places I've hunted Coues deer have been wide open and some pretty long shots are possible. I guess my last "favorite" was my 257 Wby mag shooting 115 gr Nosler BT's. Coues deer are small, light boned, and lightly muscled. They are not hard to put down. They are also smart, wary, and have an uncanny knack for being able to disappear right before your eyes. Make sure you take a good, clear, high quality scope on whatever rifle you bring. And make sure you bring a GOOD set of binos! The higher the quality the better. Si tantum EGO eram dimidium ut bonus ut EGO memor | |||
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So you get presented with a quartering away shot where, you need penetration almost the length of the animal...it's your only opportunity so far and you are now 1/2 thru the hunt... Do you want you 6mm or would you rather have your 270 win on up? Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I have a custom 6BR from Herb Coats that I would like to use. The biggest grain bullet it will shoot is 90. It has a 24" barrel with 1 in 10 twist. I'm just not sure if 90grains is a heavy enough bullet. I also have a custom .270 that I shoot 130gr Scirroco's through with good results. I would prefer to use the 6BR though. | |||
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I think you answered your own question "I'm just not sure..." Would you be 95+% confident on a 120lb whitetail doe? Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Tom, On a trophy hunt even for a small deer like a Coues you have to be prepared for a worse case scenario. What that mean is you might have to take a shot at a bad angle or right up the butt. Is your 6MM BR with a 90 gr bullet going to be up to that? Also your apt to have to take a long poke. I think your 270 with the 130 Sciroccos would be a much better choice. Whatever you bring for a rifle you should get comfortable with it and know where it hits out to 400 yards. A great range finder will be a big help. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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+1 on Mike D's replies. I'm going on another African hunt, plainsgame only this time, but I'll still be using my .375 Ruger lever gun. IMHO : " When in doubt, round up!" | |||
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Tom, On my Coues deer hunt, I used a 270 Win. with 130 grain Nosler BT bullets. Just about perfect a perfect combination. But I could have killed it as well with a 30/30 lever gun. You may have to shoot at 300 or more yards but on my hunt two archers killed three very nice deer. I don't know what velocity you can get with your 6BR, but how far can you reliably count on it to hit a deer? 465H&H | |||
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The 6br is a 600 yard gun with velocity pushing over 2800 ft. I am still working up loads and have the summer to do so. I have a good Swarovski range finder and I am very comfortable shooting out to 400 yards consistently. | |||
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I guess it would depend on which 90 gr bullet we were discussing. If we're talking premium constructed big game bullets, like a Sirocco, or a 95 gr Partition or CT ballistic silver tip, yeah, that'll work. ...And a 120 pound DOE?! A Coues doe weighing 120 pounds?! Well not in my limited 30 years of experience. We must not be hunting the same Coues species. Even a 120 pound Coues buck... now that would be an earth shaking monster... Some guys have all the luck I guess. Oh, your 270 will work, and a 300 win mag would work too. But that 6 BR, if you're highly confident and highly proficient with it out to 400 yards, that'll get it done. Did I mention good optics?  Those little deer have a maddening ability to just vanish right in plain sight. Si tantum EGO eram dimidium ut bonus ut EGO memor | |||
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Use your 6 BR They are itty bitty little deer. Making a great shot is far more important than what you shoot. Practice all summer and make a great shot | |||
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My choice is a .270 Weatherby with 140 gr Nosler AB's. More important though is quality glass both on the rifle and around your neck. My rifle now wears a Leupold Vari X 6 2-12 CDS. Previous it wore a Swarovski Z-3 3X10 BRX. | |||
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The guys that I know from here that went for Coues deer used 25-06, 257 Weatherby, 270, and 270 Weatherby. I get some reports from one of the rifle builder / sellers and they have shown a few 6.5-284s but that is their pet rifle anyway. | |||
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Certainly take this with a grain of salt as I haven't lived in Az for over 20 years. But back then, the real dedicated Coues hunters were using long range, heavy barreled magnums, such as the 7 rem mag and 300 win mag. They also used high magnification variables and the coveted binos were the Zeiss 15x60. Maybe it's different now. Those guys were really into Coues deer hunting and went all out. David Miller built some of those rifles. But the Remington Sendero is a very similar idea. | |||
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Never been Coues hunting but hope to do it some day. Of my clients who are avid Coues hunters, they use exactly what you are talking about and I would say the .300 Wby is most spoken of. Personally I have always thought that the .257 Weatherby would be the ticket. ______________________________________________ The power of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by those who are bereft of that gift. | |||
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I'm sure the 257 WB would be an excellent choice. The guys using those long range rigs were after the best trophies possible. They would have contests during the off season using big binoculars (like the Zeiss 15x) to see who could spot the most game. I took up glassing as my hunting method in southern AZ and enjoyed that type of hunting. But I was not necessarily after the biggest possible buck and didn't feel the need for the most specialized gun. Generally used a model 70 270, which worked fine. Coues deer can be very challenging to hunt, especially if you're after a big one. They are beautiful deer with fine features. And as noted earlier, they are wary, smart, and have very good senses. | |||
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I have never hunted coues deer, but it I did I'd grab my 270 Win. **************** NRA Life Benefactor Member | |||
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The new .260 nosler... | |||
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I didn't know Coues were THAT small...the point I was trying to make was...its a hunt of a lifetime why use something you are already questioning Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I used my 300 WSM in late January of this year for my coues deer hunt at Agua Nuevo with Matt Woodward. The scope was a Swarovski Z-5 with the Ballistic Turret. I have used the 300 WSM in Mexico for Desert Mule Deer as well. Both were one shot kills with a 180 grain Trophy Bonded Tip bullet. Binos on the coues deer hunt were my new Swaro EL 10X42 range finding binos. | |||
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I hunted the same ranch as UEG in '13. The camp rifle was a 300 Ultra shooting 200gr ACB's with a 5.5-22 (I believe) Nightforce scope. It was not overkill and I was happy to have it when presented with a steeeply quartering away shot. Another hunter in camp used the same rifle for a long range shot up the butt on his buck. DRT. When presented shots like this the small calibers and light bullets are not what you need IMO. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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Tom, It is of course your money and your hunt. If I ever do go (recall that I had to cancel) I will take either 1. .30-338 with Leupold Mark 4 and mildot shooting 180 grain bullet or 2. .30-06 with a 165 grain bullet cruising around 3000 fps. That one wears a 4 X 16 Nikon. Good luck. | |||
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I am confident with my .270 and my 130gr load I have. I just had a new 6BR made that can shoot up to 90gr bullets. I though it would be nice to use this if it is enough gun. That was why I was asking if it would be enough cartridge. I have friends who shoot deer and antelope out here with there 22-250 and have no problem. Just putting the feelers out to see if someone has used this weight bullet and cartridge before. . | |||
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I used a 243 Win and 80 gr bullets to kill several Coues deer when I was a young man. It always worked fine. Never had to shoot one twice. I sold the 243 one day in my youthful foolishness and regretted it soon after. It was a Rem "Mohawk" and very nice to carry around. My selling it had nothing to do with it's performance on deer, but my youthful restlessness in wanting something "different". I'd like to have that rifle back, but now, they're "collectable" and prices are blown all out of proportion for what the rifle is. twilli, You keep saying "90 grain bullets", but you don't say WHICH 90 grain bullet? That will make all the difference between a successful or a failing kill shot. There is a very huge difference in bullet construction across the 6mm bullets. A varmint or match bullet would be a disaster. Si tantum EGO eram dimidium ut bonus ut EGO memor | |||
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My personal preference is nothing under 30 caliber for deer or larger game.... so I would have a 308 or 30-06. However, I think a 270 or 25-06 would work just fine as these are much smaller (in weight) than some of the deer areas I hunt. | |||
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Your 6BR with Sierra 85 grain BTHP, would probably work fine. I have seen that bullet in the .243 kill many deer and elk. Reference the 243 success of thousands of dead deer from other folks as well. "The liberty enjoyed by the people of these states of worshiping Almighty God agreeably to their conscience, is not only among the choicest of their blessings, but also of their rights." ~George Washington - 1789 | |||
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I haven't chosen a bullet yet but shoot a lot of Berger VLD's. I am also fond of Nosler Partitions. I will have to see what's available in a 90gr bullet. I also am not a fan of Texas heart shots or shots I feel would be less than optimum. If I don't get a clear shot at a broadside or quartering away animal at a distance I feel confident I won't shoot and would still be happy about the hunting experience. I can bring my .340 Weatherby and blow a leg off or punch a huge hole in the animal if need be. I've been on more expensive hunts in the past and have come home empty handed because I chose not to shoot because of distance or shot angle. I also want ta bullet and caliber that can get the job done as humanely as possible. | |||
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Very well said Twilli, very well said. This is the root I feel of all of these discussions about what rifle is too small for deer. I feel the same way you stated when I line up an animal in my scope and if it doesn't present me the shot I want I don't try to make a shot out of a bad presentation. No matter what rifle is in your hands thats how you wound and lose game. | |||
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David Miller is an avid Coues Deer hunter, and uses a 300 Wby. | |||
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On my one and so far only Coues hunt, even though I never had a shot at a buck, I was carrying my .300 Weatherby using 168 grain Barnes TSX handloads. I figured that should I need to take a 300/400 yard shot or maybe a little farther, I wanted as many things in my favor as possible. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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I have never hunted Coues deer, but I have shot a lot of whitetail and several antelope. I would be perfectly happy with a lightweight 243, 25/06 or a 257Wby Mag. But truth is, If I was to go Coues deer hunting, I would use one of my accurate 308's or maybe even my accurate 300 Win Mag. Just because I have them and they shoot good. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
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I shot my first Coues deer with a .303 Savage Model 99 with iron sights in 1955 and have killed perhaps 25 to 30 others using .22-250, .243 Win, .257 Roberts, .270, 7mm Remington Magnum and .30-06. The .243 and any of the .25 calibers are deadly on these little deer if you hold your shots to 250 yards or so. If you are not capable of using optics to find an undisturbed deer and approach it to within a reasonable range, then you should do a lot of long-range practice and use one of the magnums. Just remember that wind drift in the wide canyons where these deer live can result in badly shot bucks getting away, no matter the bullet or caliber you've used. Bill Quimby | |||
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I personally like the 6mms especially for deer sized game. The 90 grain Scirocco, 85 grain Partition, 85 grain Gameking, or the 85 grain TSX would be wonderful choices. The Scirocco would be my first choice followed closely by the TSX. Will the 87 grain Berger stabilize in your gun? Is it a 10 twist or 11 twist? | |||
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223 | |||
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People in Arizona are nuts about the 257 Weatherby on Coues deer. I would be too. Nice match for the little deer. A new Vanguard (hell of a rifle) cost about $650, even if you upgrade the stock to a Bell and Carlson and bed it, you are into it another $250. | |||
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Shooting a 95 Berger hunting bullet like a house of fire. 1:10 twist. 3 shot group at 300 yards less than .700 consistently. | |||
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