Hey guys,

I was told last week by a friend that, instead of getting a Class 3 weapons license, I can apply for a $200 Federal Tax Stamp that would allow me to own one class 3 weapon. In this case, I would like to buy a suppressor to put on one of my hunting rifles.

I've looked around on the web some, but it seems to be hard to find much info on the subject. Does anyone on here know how I can go about doing this? I would really appreciate the help.

Thanks.

You have to set up an account, but this place looks as if it might be the place to get some answers.

http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/login.php

Take from another site. I make no promises as to the accuracy of the content, but thought it might help.

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Machine guns, suppressors, short barrel rifles/shotguns (SBR) are all completely legal to own in most states (those that honor/protect our individual freedoms - you're out of luck if you live in CA or NY).
If you've never gone through the process of purchasing one of the these items, it's really not that complicated (it just seems that way, if you've never done it before).
These item can be owned by an INDIVIDUAL, a TRUST, or a CORPORATION.

individual
STEP 1 We'll complete two copies of an ATF Form 4 for you (the only info we need from you is your full name, mailing address and county). You simply check a few boxes (to verify that you're 21 or older, not mentally defective, a drug addict, a fugitive from justice, etc.) and sign/date.
STEP 2 You get two passport photos done (Walgreen's or CVS pharmacy can do them in about 15 minutes in their photo processing section) .
STEP 3 We'll provide you with an ATF Form 5330.20, which simply verifies your citizenship status. You fill in lines 1 & 2, check the appropriate box on line 5 and sign/date on line 7.
STEP 4 We'll also provide you with two fingerprint cards that you'll use to get your fingerprints done (it's usually easiest to get the prints done when you go to your local law enforcement agency's office in step 5).
STEP 5 Take everything to your local Chief Law Enforcement Officer (CLEO) and have him/her sign on the back side of both copies of the ATF Form 4.
STEP 6 We'll mail the whole packet, along with a $200 check from you (a one time fee that pays your transfer tax - also called "tax stamp") to the ATF.
STEP 7 6-8 weeks later, when I get your approved paperwork back from the ATF, I can transfer the NFA item to you along with your ATF approved Form 4.

trust
STEP 1 We'll complete two copies of an ATF Form 4 for you (the only info we need from you is your full name, mailing address and county). You simply check a few boxes (to verify that you're 21 or older, not mentally defective, a drug addict, a fugitive from justice, etc.) and sign/date.
STEP 2 We'll provide you with an ATF Form 5330.20, which simply verifies your citizenship status. You fill in lines 1 & 2, check the appropriate box on line 5 and sign/date on line 7.
STEP 3 WE'LL ASSIST YOU IN DRAFTING UP YOUR TRUST and ensure that it's formatted correctly so that your paperwork won't get delayed or denied once it has been submitted.
STEP 4 You sign your trust documents in front of a notary and have it notarized. You'll make a photocopy of the entire trust and send it back to us (so that we can submit it to the ATF along with your ATF Form 4). Store your original trust with your other important documents (mortgage, will, etc.).
STEP 5 We'll mail the whole packet, along with a $200 check from you (a one time fee that pays your transfer tax - also called "tax stamp") to the ATF.
STEP 6 6-8 weeks later, when I get your approved paperwork back from the ATF, I can transfer the NFA item to you along with your ATF approved Form 4.
The TRUST is by far the easiest method of ownership. You'll spend 1/10th the time completing your paperwork if you use a TRUST (instead of INDIVIDUAL OWNERSHIP), because you won't need passport photos, fingerprint cards, or the CLEO's signature. There is no "down side" to a trust.
I do not recommend ever going the CORPORATION route for NFA ownership. Businesses change and/or dissolve eventually (and then you'll have the hassle of dealing with your NFA items that are the property of the corporation). A TRUST or INDIVIDUAL OWNERSHIP will last your lifetime.
If you have any questions about the process, please don't hesitate to call me and ask. My goal is to take the mystery out of it all and make it simple, easy and care free.

The "Tax stamp" IS the class-3 weapons permit.

It's just another name for it.

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
The "Tax stamp" IS the class-3 weapons permit.

It's just another name for it.

Hmmm.....interesting. I was under the impression that a class 3 permit was much more expensive, as it is used by people who want entire collections (more than just one or two) of class 3 weapons.

So here's my next question.....do you have to pay the $200 tax for every "class 3 weapon" you buy?

Example: If I wanted to buy 2 suppressors and a full auto AR, that would be 3 different "class 3 weapons". So would that call for 3 separate $200 tax stamps? $600?

Thanks for the info guys.

YES. You will have to pay the $200.00 for each weapon or device. The money is a transfer tax and is only applicable to a specific device. If you want 2 suppressors and one full-auto you will pay $600.00 in transfer fees. By hunting rifle you do mean for varmints or hogs, right? The use of a suppressor for any game animal is illegal in Texas period. I do believe it is allowed for exotics.
I am not sure where Montgomery is in relation to Corpus Christi. If you have the chance to come to Corpus, you should visit The Shooters' Depot. The owner is a nice guy named George Koumbis. He is a class II manufacturer and is swamped with orders for his suppressor systems from militaries around the world. He is a class three NFA and AOG sales.

I must include that I benefit in no way shape or form from recommending his shop. I have spent a great deal of time talking with George and after doing the research found he is honest to a fault and as genuine as you will find. He is easy to talk with and has the only gunstore I have ever been in where smoking is allowed.

Andy B
aka TEXAS_SASQUATCH

Go to www.subguns.com and click on the forums. There is a wealth of information and experts on this board. Suppressors are relatively inexpensive but an M16 will run you around $15,000.

Also be aware that a Class 3 dealer will likely also charge you and 'administration fee' for handling a class 3 or suppressor transfer. Here it is generally equal to the 'stamp', $200.

drewhenrytnt,

Yes, I am aware that you can't use a silencer to hunt game animals in Texas.....which is a shame because I would very much like to use one to cull Whitetail does.

By the way, Montgomery is just west of Conroe, north of Houston about 40 miles.

Thanks

The above information is correct. Additionally, the tax stamp is a one time thing, for as long as you own the NFA weapon. I know a lot of people are under the impression the stamp has to be renewed every year or so, which is false.

The tax stamp DOES have to be paid EVERY time the NFA weapon is transferred. Which means, if you sell the weapon, the tax has to be paid for by the new owner. It is not a one time stamp for the weapon, just the owner.

For interstate transfers, the stamp has to be paid TWICE. If I buy a NFA weapon from texas, the stamp has to be paid when the weapon is transferred to the class 3 dealer in my home state and again when it's transferred from the dealer to me. So if you are looking for an NFA weapon, it's cheaper to do in-state transfers. In my limited experience, the first stamp is usually negotiated in the selling price on interstate transfers.

Uzi-talk, sturmgewher, subguns are a good place to start.

Also, if you are going to do a transfer, expect to wait. I paid for an NFA gun in May and by the time I got it in my hands it was December. It was an out of state transfer, so it took twice as long, but that's still a long time to wait.

The ATF is taking their time approving these right now (due to an extremely high number of transfers).

Good luck, and post some pics when you get your supressor.

Thanks for all the info guys. It's been quite a help. After doing some research.....it is obviously going to be quite a bit more costly than I thought. I still plan on getting one, but it more than likely won't be very soon. I'm going to wait until I get a bolt action .223 Rem so that I can easily buy subsonic ammo for it. Right now, I have a bolt action .223 WSSM and as far as I know, nobody manufactures subsonic ammo for it.

Once again, thanks.

Suppressors are interchangeable within caliber. You could use it on any .223 caliber rifle.

Also, be aware that your CLEO may refuse to sign your application. You can get a judge to sign it, if you can find one. Again, other owners in your area should be able to help you find out who will sign your form.
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by drewhenrytnt:
Suppressors are interchangeable within caliber. You could use it on any .223 caliber rifle.

Well the .223 WSSM that I have has a large bull barrel.....and I'm not sure the .223 Rem that I buy will have a bull barrel.

Barrel diameter really is not an issue. Most cans attach via a flash hider of some sort, so as long as it threads diameter wont matter.

Perry

A tax stamp for the transfer of a silencer or other title 2 weapon is not the same as a permit or license. The tax stamp is a one time $200 tax for transfers or making silencers, short barreled rifles/shotguns and machine gun transfers. It is $5 for gadget guns (pen guns, smooth bore pistols).

A so-called class 3 permit is actually something a business has. The Federal Firearms License (FFL, $200/3 years)) is required for dealing in firearms. If a person wants to import, manufacture or deal in title 2 weapons, then in addition to the FFL, the business owner also needs to pay the Special Occupational Tax class 1 (import),2 (manufacture) or 3 (deal); this tax is $1000 per year unless they do less than half million in business per year, then it is $500. There is also something called the ITAR which is over $2500 per year. While a licensed manufacturer can make an unlimited number of silencer each year without paying the $200 tax on each, the silencers are owned by the business which must stay licensed and pay the large fees to the ATF to keep the license. If you go out of business, then you need to destroy the silencers; tax free transfer to another dealer; or transfer to yourself or another unlicensed person paying a $200 tax on each.

It is cheaper for me to pay $200 for each silencer I make; if I make 20 silencers in 10 years, but keep them for 40 years, this costs me $4000 in taxes vs. 40 years of at least $3000 per year in fees to stay current on a manufacturing license.

Http://www.subguns.com is one of the best resources for title 2 guns information on the net.

Ranb