(I also posted this on the Africa forum)

How much influence do personal references, or reports from a hunting organization, play in your decisions to book trips with a particular outfitter?

All hunting concerns will provide you with individual references, but do you check them? And beyond that, is there much likelihood you'd be given the name of anyone seriously dissatisfied with the service provided and results obtained--or not obtained?

How far back can a reference go and still be worth considering? In Africa especially, I'd want to talk to current and previous year references; I might consider 2 or 3 year old references if the company is established and has a good reputation. Still, we probably all remember David Van De Merwe (sp?), SCI's PH of the year back in the mid-90's.

How about report-gathering services, like Causey's newsletter or SCI's hunt report files? Back before SCI ruined their published hunt reports by taking them out of Safari Magazine and putting many fewer of them per issue in Safari Times, I read them with interest but was curious that you never saw a bad one. Even the reports I ordered from the SCI service were always good--maybe the members are astute enough never to buy a bad hunt, or if they have a bad experience, don't see fit to report it? Causey seems to get some complaints; wonder why SCI never does?

How about on-line reports? There're several sites that have hunt report forums, and one has a special section that is updated about once a week. Although the majority of reports are favorable, I'd guess 30% or more are not, and some are very negative.

Do hunters give bad marks to outfitters when the hunter is really at fault, or are most negative reports pretty accurate?

I get the impression from the reports I've read that you stand the greatest chance of having a good hunt in Africa. Canada seems to get the most complaints, followed by US elk hunts.

Just wondering what others on these forums think about the value of references and reports--is there a better way?

You are getting to a very important point here Nitro,how to fathom and judge which outfitter/hunt to trust.To me it is a given that the outfitter will "sell",cant blame him for that.So the difficult task is to do proper evaluation of the info provided.Best way I learned is to not ask too many pointed questions to the outfitter ,invariably if its a questionable one he will read you and tell you what you wan to hear.The way I found best is to stay c outfitters that do furnish a reference list into the presence,than phone those.I usually get a feel for the ref. honesty,how many repeat bookings are in the list?,would the hunter go back? evaluate the hunters experience and frame of knowledge.Its a pain to connect to several as many listed reference are disconnected.Its worth every minute to listen to them.I usually ask them about experiences of the other hunters in camp,why were they not successful?
From my experience in the western Us and Canada,the number 1 problem is overhunting/booking.The area does not have decent game density any more.Do you think the outfitter will admit to this?I also heard of shoddy camps,unruly dangerous horses,guides that come out of collegue trying to earn a few bucks - no experience or knowledge.The only method I have is ask for previous experience and evaluate what I get for honesty.Yes it would be wonderful to have a web page one could peruse for published opinions- I dont see it coming.
Thru trial and error and asking respected outfitters for recommendations for other game/area one finally breaks into the respectable list,outfitters that are fun to work with rather the crowd that has to make a living selling what they really dont have.

sheephunter

Investigating the place you are going hunting is very important. One of the best ways to do that is to talk with people who have already been there. Usually the reference people given to you are satisfied hunters, so I try to locate other people too (ask the reference people for names of others in their group).

Much can also be learned by "networking", whether it's through SCI or the Hunting Report.

There are too many good hunting operations out there to gamble on going with a shakey operation. Most people get into trouble when they "bargain hunt", and learn too late there is a reason why an outfit was cutting prices in order to book hunters.

I like to hunt with operations that have a lot of repeat clients!

I am a special needs hunter so I always check out the companies that I intend to give my money to. I have a list of 25 questions that I send to a prospective outfitter with a SAS envelope so they can send it back. If I don't get it back all I'm out is a stamp and not $$$$$$. I always ask for 10 refs with at least 3 who didn't fill their tags. I always call the ref list and from those calls develop other contacts. I am always up front about my limitaions with regard to mobility. I don't want any supprises for me or the outfitter when I show up with my sticks.
I usually get my most useful information from those hunters who didn't tag out and alot from the wives of the ref list. Ref # 4 isn't home but MRS Ref 4 will sure tell you how her hunter felt after he got home from his hunt.
So yes I do use the ref list and that combined with the answers I get from my question sheet will determin who gets my money this year.

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Handgun Hunter
LOVE THOSE .41s'