https://www.abqjournal.com/123...g-from-aircraft.html

State trying to curb illegal hunting from aircraft

By Maddy Hayden / Journal Staff Writer

Published: Saturday, October 6th, 2018 at 3:55pm
Updated: Saturday, October 6th, 2018 at 9:49pm

The state Department of Game and Fish is proposing a rule change aimed at preventing people from unfairly hunting with the aid of aircraft.

But the proposal has some recreational pilots around the state worried it may impede their ability to freely take to the New Mexican skies.

The proposed change within the “manner and method rule” would make it illegal for people to use aircraft to locate or assist in locating protected species, to relay the location of protected species to someone on the ground or to use the information gained for hunting from Aug. 1 to Jan. 31.


Currently, the so-called “48-hour rule” makes it illegal to use in hunting any information gained from aircraft until 48 hours after a flight.

“Really the issue comes down to fair chase when we’re dealing with our protected wildlife,” said Col. Robert Griego of the department’s field operations at a Friday meeting of the New Mexico Game Commission. “We have a pretty significant issue, primarily in the southwest part of the state where elk are being spotted from aircraft.”

For example, a pilot might locate an animal and convey a GPS point to a hunter on the ground, who can then easily find it.

Griego admits that the rule is a difficult one to enforce.

“My officers have to prove the transfer of knowledge within that 48 hours,” he said. “And unless you were there, that’s a very hard element to prove.”

Griego said of the four citations they’ve given out in the last three to four years for violations of the 48-hour rule, just one has resulted in a conviction.



Kerrie Romero of the New Mexico Council of Outfitters and Guides said she is worried planes flying over the forest, possibly just out sight-seeing, could be wrongly accused of scouting for animals.

“The only thing that will be accomplished with the rule change is to encourage hunters, who know nothing about aviation, to falsely report the tail number of any single-engine aircraft flying low and slow over the forest,” Romero said.

Ron Orozco of Animas, a self-proclaimed “law-abiding hunter and pilot,” said he wonders how extending the amount of time prohibiting the use of aircraft for locating protected animals will aid in better enforcing violations.

“If you can’t enforce it for 48 hours, how on earth are we going to do it for six months?” he said at the commission meeting.

The Game Commission will ultimately be responsible for signing off on any rule changes.

Other proposed changes in the manner and method rule include removing caliber restrictions for hunting elk, bighorn sheep and oryx and prohibiting most hunting within game-proof fences.

Just a thought... I don't think that hunters should try to fight this. If we do it will make it look like hunters using aircraft to spot game is a common occurrence(it's not, right?) that some/most of us find acceptable.

To a non hunter the idea that rich guys are using planes to find and hunt animals just makes hunting seem more detestable.

As a pilot and hunter this concerns me greatly. Just another way for the government to regulate.
Gun control is a good example. Give an inch and they’ll take a mile!

Yes, it is a fairly common occurrence in Southern NM. After the rut ends the big bulls go up into secluded valleys to recover and put some weight back on before winter. They will often stay in the same spot for 1-2 weeks, so even if one follows the 48 hour rule flying can be a big advantage. Most of the Governor's tag bulls are shot this way during the winter.

The next thing that I hope G&F goes after are cellular game cameras. Numerous guides here in the southern half of the state where snow is not reliable have a network of trail cameras at preferred lion crossing points. They get sent a picture immediately, load up the dogs and then call themselves "dry ground houndsmen." It is pathetic.

At this point there are too many technical advances that are taking the "sport" out of hunting. A line in the sand has to be drawn and I think the time is now.

quote:

Originally posted by nmhunter4life:
Yes, it is a fairly common occurrence in Southern NM. After the rut ends the big bulls go up into secluded valleys to recover and put some weight back on before winter. They will often stay in the same spot for 1-2 weeks, so even if one follows the 48 hour rule flying can be a big advantage. Most of the Governor's tag bulls are shot this way during the winter.

The next thing that I hope G&F goes after are cellular game cameras. Numerous guides here in the southern half of the state where snow is not reliable have a network of trail cameras at preferred lion crossing points. They get sent a picture immediately, load up the dogs and then call themselves "dry ground houndsmen." It is pathetic.

At this point there are too many technical advances that are taking the "sport" out of hunting. A line in the sand has to be drawn and I think the time is now.

It's not that unusal here in the northern part of NM either.

quote:

Originally posted by nmhunter4life:
Yes, it is a fairly common occurrence in Southern NM. After the rut ends the big bulls go up into secluded valleys to recover and put some weight back on before winter. They will often stay in the same spot for 1-2 weeks, so even if one follows the 48 hour rule flying can be a big advantage. Most of the Governor's tag bulls are shot this way during the winter.

The next thing that I hope G&F goes after are cellular game cameras. Numerous guides here in the southern half of the state where snow is not reliable have a network of trail cameras at preferred lion crossing points. They get sent a picture immediately, load up the dogs and then call themselves "dry ground houndsmen." It is pathetic.

At this point there are too many technical advances that are taking the "sport" out of hunting. A line in the sand has to be drawn and I think the time is now.

These are the kinds of things that give hunters a bad image, we don't need any more.

Grizz

quote:

These are the kinds of things that give hunters a bad image, we don't need any more.

While I agree in principal, the problem that has developed a foothold in hunting/among some hunters has more to do with success than the effort put forth.

Younger generations of hunters simply do not have or are able to spend the time in the woods that the older generations did.

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:

quote:

These are the kinds of things that give hunters a bad image, we don't need any more.

Younger generations of hunters simply do not have or are able to spend the time in the woods that the older generations did.

My kids are also super busy with various activities and finding time to study is hard. So, by your logic, they should be able to just quit studying and use the internet during tests to make sure they get good grades.

I know that's not what you had in mind, but it's the logical extension of your reasoning. What these fellows describe above is, to me, cheating, just like copying off your neighbor or using Google to answer test questions.

At some point we allow technology to take the hunting out of hunting. With so many short cuts, "hunters" are just technocratic killers.

quote:

Originally posted by DesertRam:

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:

quote:

These are the kinds of things that give hunters a bad image, we don't need any more.

Younger generations of hunters simply do not have or are able to spend the time in the woods that the older generations did.

My kids are also super busy with various activities and finding time to study is hard. So, by your logic, they should be able to just quit studying and use the internet during tests to make sure they get good grades.

I know that's not what you had in mind, but it's the logical extension of your reasoning. What these fellows describe above is, to me, cheating, just like copying off your neighbor or using Google to answer test questions.

At some point we allow technology to take the hunting out of hunting. With so many short cuts, "hunters" are just technocratic killers.

You could not have said it any better. +1 from this northern NM man.

All too many "dudes" will cheap the system to puff up their egos.
Without money and ego involved, this would all go away.....or would have never been an issue in the first place!

Zeke

I can still remember a moment years ago, archery hunting in then unit 15A. I was calling in a big bull to my partner, just east of Centerfire Bog. All of a sudden, with the bull about 75 yards out, here comes a Cessna, flying los and slow... George Taulman of US Outfitters. The bull boogered off, never to be seen again.

I’m not a fan of people flying during hunting season.

quote:

Originally posted by DesertRam:

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:

quote:

These are the kinds of things that give hunters a bad image, we don't need any more.

Younger generations of hunters simply do not have or are able to spend the time in the woods that the older generations did.

My kids are also super busy with various activities and finding time to study is hard. So, by your logic, they should be able to just quit studying and use the internet during tests to make sure they get good grades.

I know that's not what you had in mind, but it's the logical extension of your reasoning. What these fellows describe above is, to me, cheating, just like copying off your neighbor or using Google to answer test questions.

At some point we allow technology to take the hunting out of hunting. With so many short cuts, "hunters" are just technocratic killers.

exactly. " no time for the woods so lets cheat" is asinine. no time for the woods is why its all going to hell in the proverbial basket!

Back around 1960 here in CO.
While out elk hunting we'd see a G&F plane dive bomb game we were stalking, or just about to see over the hill.

One of the guys put a couple bullet holes thru it and they never came back. A few days later half dozen trucks full of G&F showed up to harrass everyone. No proof it ever happened.

George