For a up coming hunt the outfitter said to get a "down sleeping bag (to save weight) and calibated to 0deg."

Is there a name brand or model you'd recommend? Best place, with the best price, to buy one.

Mark, the two best down bags in the world are Western Mountaineering made in San Jose, CA and Integral Design made in Canada. I've had two Western bags and they're the best, period. If you're not interested in that sort of cash layout, any of the chinese made bags from Mountain Hardware, Sierra Designs, REI, Moonstone, etc are good. DryLoft is preferable for a shell, but a microfiber is nearly as good. Do a web search for sale stuff.

I use a Marmot Never Summer 0deg bag(full down) as well as one of the newer Marmot Fusion 15deg bags. I've found for myself that the 0deg bag can be a too much of a good thing for all but the coldest weather. The Fusion bag which is a hybrid down synthetic bag is just as comfortable for me in cold weather and shuns moisture better. Of course your milage may very as a bag rating is not an absolute and is subjective from person to person. I bought both of mine from REI where I found the Never Summer bag for a about $200 on sale. I've noticed that for the past few years they put this bag on sale around May or June.

I agree with the remark about the quality of the Integral Designs sleeping bags. I don't have one (yet!), but they are great and I will get one.

Integral Designs website

I see Cabala's sells them, and many other places in the USA

jpb

David,

I'm going to Victoria Island in late October for Musk ox and Caribou. Being from the South (Alabama) we don't have very cold weather or snow and I don't know anything about all this cold weather gear I'm going to need. ( About now some of you are asking why in the world would someone from the deep south want to go hunting in the Arctic? I don't know, it just sounds fun.) Heres some of the other things on his gear list that I could use some help with.

Warm hat with flaps.
Balaclava.
Ski goggles.
Sorel-type boots.
Warm wollen socks.
Heavey woolen shirt.
Silk inner socks.
Warm mittens.

After many years of backpacking and climbing I can heartily reccomend Mormot bags, Smartwool Mountaineering weight socks with liner socks of either Smartwool or polyproplyne (sp). Mine have been with me from Colorado to Alaska several times and Africa. Good shooting.

I have two older Marmot bags with GoreTex shells when they were USA built... the newer Chinese made Marmot bags are pretty average, really no better than any of the other's I've listed (not trying to rain on any parades here)... when you compare them with WM there's just no comparison. Marmot's are overpriced and underloft.

Western Mountaineering bags are indeed excellent. Very high quality down, and very light for temperature ratings. Expensive but 1'st class.
- mike

I know the down bags are highly recommended but before you buy one seriously check out the Wiggy sleeping bags. The light weight is there as is the warmth but the Wiggy will keep you warm even when it's a little wet! Nate

I'm with BigNate on the Wiggy's

www.wiggys.com and I think Cabelas may be selling them also---chris

quote:

Originally posted by mark65x55:
David,

I'm going to Victoria Island in late October for Musk ox and Caribou. Being from the South (Alabama) we don't have very cold weather or snow and I don't know anything about all this cold weather gear I'm going to need. ( About now some of you are asking why in the world would someone from the deep south want to go hunting in the Arctic? I don't know, it just sounds fun.) Heres some of the other things on his gear list that I could use some help with.

Warm hat with flaps.
Balaclava.
Ski goggles.
Sorel-type boots.
Warm wollen socks.
Heavey woolen shirt.
Silk inner socks.
Warm mittens.

6.5 x 55

I can heartily recommend the Filson brand name for woolen socks, woolen shirt, woolen pants and warm hats. A bit more money than some other brands, but their stuff holds up real well. For Sorel Type Boots you might want to look into Schnee's Boots. Their store is out in Boseman MT (nice store) but they send out catalogs.

6.5 x 55;

I don't know if you mean Victoria Island, meaning Vancouver Island. I am assuming with Musk Ox and Caribou you are going up into the NW Territories or in the Yukon. Don't think those roam the upper end of Vancouver Island, but I may be wrong.

My experiences with cold weather hunting date back to Minnesota and No Wisconsin. I have hunted in 30 below. I don't know what your budget is, but I don't think one has to be outfitted with the latest from LL Bean or Cabelas to stay warm in the northern cold.

Outfit yourself from head to toe with wool, and you will be spending a lot of time scratching every inch of your body with all the itching.

Also having been trained in medical supervision of troops in Arctic Environments, courtesy of the Army, I have had alot of faith in what Uncle Sam has, which is available surplus. I could care less if it is OD green, instead of LLBean Green or Mossy Oak camo. A good Army arctic bag, available in goose down ( the older ones) or some of the newer Qualifil that they use nowadays. I assume you are at a base camp and are not hauling this stuff a lot.

Elevate yourself off the ground, hopefully they have a cot type of bed to use. If not I'd consider one. Put an Army wool blanket under your bag to keep condensation from coming up from underneath... Sweat pants and double T shirts and cotton socks or polypropelene socks under wool socks for pajamas. Cotton breathes well, and you don't want to sweat in your bag, or that condensation will get cold and you will freeze your fanny off.

Also consider putting a wool blanket inside your sleeping bag with you. YOu will be surprised at how warm this will keep you. I even use an pillow inside to hug and that really reflects your warmth back. I have had to sleep in 45 below zero for several days before and this actually keep me so warm I had to let the sleeping bag open to let in some cool air, I was so warm inside.

Wear a wool hat when you sleep or a sweatshirt with a hood up. Your body looses 15 to 20% of all of its warm out the top of your head, because 20% of your body's blood is in your head at any one time.

The key to staying warm in cold conditions is layering your clothes to keep air pockets between your body and the outside. Polypropelene long under wear, or some of Cabelas long johns help out dramatically. If you wear a large shirt normally, get an extra large. This will keep air pockets. Get all clothes and shoes One size larger than you normally wear. You want loose fitting.

Boots: Snow Packs. If I had to NOT scrimp on one item, this would be it. Head and feet are the two biggest places that body heat is lost. Get something your feet are going to stay dry in. Get one size larger than normal and for foot gear, one pair of cotton socks under a pair of wool socks.

A fleece balaclava is a great idea. Hunting out in the windy areas at way below zero, I just use to wear a hooded sweatshirt under my jacket, but had it one backwards. The hood on backwards also doubled as a good balaclava and also allowed me to pull it up under my eyes, if the wind was that bad.

Gloves: combo polypropelene and wool, are great.
I actually use to wear one of those on my left hand, as its only activity was to hold the end of my rifle barrel up when I shot. My right hand was more busy, trigger etc. On my right hand, I always worn an neoprene Ice fishing glove.

Neoprene can get wet and you can still stay warm. It is what a wet suit is made out of. It is a lot more flexible than the heavier wool glove.
They are also available without the index finger and thumb for guys who are tying fishing line in cold weather. When I didn't need my hand out of my pocket it was in my pocket keeping warm, but that flexible material of the neoprene was sure handy when you needed to shoot.

A good over sized jacket is a given., but make sure it is wet protected. and has a hood to keep the wind off of the neck.

As for head gear, I always worn a wool hat OVER a baseball hat. The brim of the baseball hat kept the old face covered from falling snow etc. The wool hat goes over it just fine, and kept the old ears warm.

Some of this may sound funny or thinking about it looks funny. However, I had several more important interests. Staying warm, yet keeping functional. Some out of town guys bundle up so much to stay warm, they can't move. Like the Charlie Brown cartoon, where mom bundles him up so much he falls down on the ice and can't get back up. A long way to travel, and then not be flexible enough to take the shot.

I am sure what the outfitters are concerned about is the number of times that hunters from the lower 48 show up and are there with the best that Walmart or Kmart has to offer in sleeping bags and cold weather gear.

I have a military surplus sleeing bag I got in 1966 that was meant for arctic environments. It is a little ratty, but it has seen a lot of cold weather, been a lot of places and kept my little tushy warm on many a cold night. So don't rule out military surplus stuff as long as you know what you are looking for.

Good luck and have a great trip,
Cheers
seafire

quote:

For a up coming hunt the outfitter said to get a "down sleeping bag (to save weight) and calibated to 0deg."

Is there a name brand or model you'd recommend?

Western Mountaineering.

The best modern down sleeping bag that I've ever had or have seen was built by "Feathered Friends" of Seattle, WA. I've owned one of these since 1994, and I've used it from Alaska to Mexico, including backpack sheep and grizzly hunts, pack-in hunts for everything from elk to grizzly, Sonoran desert hunts for mule deer, etc.

This bag never changes, develops problems, or loses its loft. It's a high-quality bag in every way, and it's light, packable, WARM, and roomy.

www.featheredfriends.com

AD

Thanks guys

I've sent wigglys an e-mail asking what they'd recommend for a sleeping bag.

Now as to these Sorel-type boots, an band you'd recommend?

Seafire, thanks for the over size idea. I hadn't thought of that.

For pack-type boots, Schnee's is the brand to go with.

www.schnees.com

AD

quote:

Originally posted by allen day:
The best modern down sleeping bag that I've ever had or have seen was built by "Feathered Friends" of Seattle, WA. I've owned one of these since 1994, and I've used it from Alaska to Mexico, including backpack sheep and grizzly hunts, pack-in hunts for everything from elk to grizzly, Sonoran desert hunts for mule deer, etc.

This bag never changes, develops problems, or loses its loft. It's a high-quality bag in every way, and it's light, packable, WARM, and roomy.

www.featheredfriends.com

AD

Feathered Freinds is a top notch bag.You would not go wrong with one.

Two things

Schnees boots only come in normal width. If you have wide feet you need to get the next size larger.

Second, I agree that some wool is itchy. However, Merino wool is not, or at least not on me. Filson makes a great pair of Merino boot socks, and if you like to wear a sweater instead of a shirt while out hunting they also make a very nice Merino Wool Sweater as well. And their midweight wool pants are not that itchy and you will be wearing long johns anyway.

www.Filson.com

Heres a third reccomendation for Feathered Friends. A BIG bonus is that they can custom sew bags or add additional down to a model you like. Top notch company in every respect.

I second the comment concerning the gortex outer layer, spent close to a month in the Alaskan bush and it rained, and rained and rained somemore. Thank god I had the gortex outer cover,another guy did'nt and damn near frooze his tail off.Needless to say by day 4 he was not real good company.... the river we were floating rose and rose and rose somemore.

In regards to what boots to use. Regardless of which ones you choose make sure they are loose on your feet, not so loose you can't walk. A tight boot is the enemy of warm feet. I always get boots WAY too big and then put layers of felt, closed cell foam, then a final "screen" layer to allow my boot liners to be above the felt layers. I feel that the screen layer really helps to keep your feet dry. Bring some down booties to wear around camp and pull your boots apart every night and let everything dry out.

Army surplus cold weather mitts are the cats ass for cold weather. You can also make felted woolen mitt liners, they are nice. Same thing for mitts buy them big. Someone mentioned neoprene for mitts/gloves....I tried them once and have honestly never had colder hands. It seems neoprene causes me to sweat then I'm in trouble. Gloves and warm hands don't work in really cold stuff, so bring a good pair of gloves for the places you need gloves otherwise use the mitts.

Toque should be a little loose on yer head because a tight toque will mess up your hair!! Actually a tight toque will cause "toque rot" a term Canadians use where your hair gets damned sore from constantly wearing a tight toque.

have fun

the chef

For those who have to carry what they get into the bush, check these out. You won't be dissapointed!

Wiggy's Superlight

Mark- I have multiple pairs of Schnees- they are a great product. Having said that I would, for your specific trip, get ahold of a set of surplus "bunny boots"., I am sure someone will come on with a source for you.The "bunnies" do shine where you cannot get a conventional felt liner completly dry each night. If you are having trouble finding them make a post on the Alaska hunting forum.Asecond suggestion would to get the catalogue from Sierra Trader in Cody, Wy. Or go online to them. I like to get several liner weight(med, expedition)balacavas.

I think that I have replied to this poster on 24Hr. but, will add some advice here. My coldweather experience outdoor experience goes back several decades and I have owned and used about every make of bag available since the late '50s. Most of the big name bags available today are pretty good, get one rated to -30F, with a gore-tex type shell or microfibre at least and you will be good to go.

If, you want a bag for a lifetime, I consider the Integral Designs bags to be the finest I have owned, used or seen. I have slept out in -40F and lower, alone in the mountains, for weeks on end and done this for many years. I have owned the once superb, USA made, Marmot Mtn. bags, mine from 1978, a Feathered Friends since 1989 and examined dozens of Western Mountaineering bags....and intend to buy one for next winter. I also have a Wiggy's bag, a "Kifaru Special" model which is kept as an emergency backup hunting bag, period.

Your bag is the most important aspect of your camp and this is one of the places where highend gear is really worth the bucks. No Wiggy's bag compares to a WM, ID or FF bag in comfort and warmth for the weight, again, I own and use these, so, this is experience talking. You need a good pad(s) under it, if your outfitter does not supply this, make sure to check!

I highly recommend Schnee packs and I have worn many pair of these boots in harsh weather and rugged terrain, get the warmest model and extra liners x 2. I also recommend Ulfrotte merino wool underwear, in 400 bottom and 600 top weights, with powerdry gonch underneath. Avoid cotton like AIDS, it will trap moisture and is cold, clammy and chafes. Do NOT take bottles of hot water into your bag, a spill can cause you to become frostbitten, keep hot liquids in a flask wrapped in spare clothing, between your bag and pad, where your body does not touch.

Filson gear is uniformly superb and I get it whenever I can, nobody makes better woolen clothing, absolutely nobody! Check with your outfitter for suggestions on windproof outer clothing, I would use British ventile gear and have, but, it costs a bit. Ventile over layered wool will take me down to -45F in comfort and you will not be hunting in worse than that. A good down parka is also nice, FF makes the best that I know of.

Chopper mitts over woolen mitts is what we used to use and I still do, with light synthetic or silk or wool gloves under them, a handwarmer muff is very nice, too. Do not wear heavy snowmachine style suits if you have to walk, you will sweat, not vent it and get damp and cold. Check out the websites given, ID makes some neat Primaloft clothing which might be just what you need, in addition to Filson's.

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
6.5 x 55;

I don't know if you mean Victoria Island, meaning Vancouver Island. :

Victoria Island is off in the NW Territories, not too far from the magnetic North Pole.

:

quote:

I don't think one has to be outfitted with the latest from LL Bean or Cabelas to stay warm in the northern cold.:

True enough. Get good gear, but it doesn't necessarily need to be Orvis.

:

quote:

Outfit yourself from head to toe with wool:

Although Filson is fine stuff, I've found that the surplus Swedish, German, and suchlike stuff works just as well, and a lot cheaper. Do yourself a BIG favor and visit Sierra Trading Post website and see if they've got any of their silk long underwear on sale. They usually have it a lot cheaper than anyplace else. Wear it under your wool and it'll go a long way towards helping keep you warm as well as stopping the itching of the wool.

:

quote:

some of the newer Qualifil that they use nowadays.:

I second the Quallofil recommendation. Down has no insulating quality at all if it gets wet. Even mild dampness will degrade its insulation.

quote:

hopefully they have a cot type of bed to use. If not I'd consider one.

Get a good inflatable mattress pad from REI or some other backpacking outlet. When your weight is squashing down the bag, the loft, and the insulation it provides is reduced and the pad will really help.

quote:

Sweat pants and double T shirts and cotton socks or polypropelene socks under wool socks for pajamas.

Don't be tempted to wear the stuff you wore that day. Have a set that you wear just for pjs. Moisture, from your own sweat, is your enemy.

quote:

Wear a wool hat when you sleep or a sweatshirt with a hood up.

But don't put your face inside the bag. If it is that cold, lay a bandana over your face to help keep it warm. If you put your face down in the bag, you'll be adding a pint or more of moisture inside every night. That moisture build-up will really hurt the insulating qualities of any bag.

quote:

A fleece balaclava is a great idea.

And get a wool or fleece scarf to wrap around your neck.

Leave your rifle outside. The cold metal will build up condensation when you bring it into the warmth of the tent/cabin. Have some sort of soft-side case outside and leave the rifle in that.

Good Luck and good hunting.

quote:

Originally posted by allen day:

www.featheredfriends.com

AD

+1 for feathered friends excellent mountaineering and adventure bag.

To me, after 35 years in the REAL North, I'd first suggest Northern Outfitters and secondly, there's the place anyone up here shops at for cold weather gear, Weaver & Devore ~Arctic~

I would agree with Brad that the best bags on the market today are made by Western Mountaineering. Making bags with uncompromising quality is all the do. They'll cost more, but you'll know you have the very best. If I didn't get a WM bag, I'd get a Marmot which is also very good.

Mark, I have slept on the ground at -25 degrees F. WITHOUT A TENT and sweated in my sleeping bags. On several occasions. I use bags made by Mountain Hardwear, The North Face and Marmot.

If you are going to be in harsh conditions, get a bag made for Mt. Everest. From Marmot or The North Face. Or Mountain Hardwear. Some deals can be found from time to time at www.campmor.com

One way to evaluate whether the bag you are getting is good enough is whether it costs $500 to $800. If not, it is not good enough.

Tricks to staying warm in extreme cold in a sleeping bag:

1. Put on fresh socks before getting into the bag

2. Wear DRY long underwear top and pants in the bag. Maybe 2 long underwear tops if appropriate. Only use top quality synthetic long underwear. Cotton and silk retain too much water.

3. Do not drink cold water for 1 hour before getting in the bag

4. Wear a balaclava in the bag.

5. Cinch down the neck cord and the face cord, leaving yourself a 1" hole to breathe through

6. Use a high end mountaineering pad under your bag.

In the morning you will have to put your gloves on and punch your boots to break up the ice enough to slip your feet in.