THEY are replicating strong and weak points of Shark v Crocadile....

Question on the ultimate toughest predator..other then man.
Full size healthy male Kodiak..puts him in the 1000 pound range.
vs
a healthy full grown male African lion, over 500 pounds.

Put them in a pen, hungry and throw in the half leg of whatever...
who is gonna win the fight and why?

for when you really bored and have nothing better to do

I'm sure the Romans did it. Try researching the match-up.

I'd imagine the instant the bear stood up, he'd have the mental edge on the lion. It'd probably go downhill from there for Leo.

RSY

Did the Romans have access to browns/grizzlies?

Even money, I'd say. Everytime I think the bear could handle it, I visualize a house cat clawing the crap out of a dog 6 times its size. Not a fair comparison for the bear, but those friggin cats are fast.

I am curious what the Romans found out.

Canuck

Actually the bear lion match up has been done. Back in the late 1800's,in california a grizzly was placed in a pen with an african lion. The crowd had placed bets and from all reports,the bear killed the lion so quickly,that many people present missed seeing it happen(especially since there was no instant replay).

The above story is in a book about grizzly attacks in North America. I wish I could remember the exact title. But I believe the title was Bear Attacks. Green softbound cover with a publshing date of 1998.

I would bet on the bear. After seeing a Grizzly chase down an elk and killing it with one blow, I am impressed. And that was a much smaller bear than 1,000 lbs.

Pound for pound, I don't think anything could beat a badger or wolverine. If wolverines were the size of grizzly bears, they would rule the world.

My vote would be for the bear for two reasons; one- the lion is used to hunting in prides and then the females do most of the killing. 2- The lion hasn't dealt with a predator like the bear before, but the bear has dealt with mountain lions most likely and feels that he is the top of the food chain over any lion.

Bob257

I too have hurd that pound for pound the Wolverine has the title.But what do they know on T.V.Imagine a 1,000 lb Wolverine and a Brownie going at it.The fight of the century.

Just my opinion.Jayco.

I've read about a black bear/tiger confrontation in a magazine once. It was a circus situation and the animals were being trained. Anyway, the tiger attacks the bear out of the clear blue. By the time anybody could even realize what was happening, the commotion was over. The bear had a nasty superficial wound on one of its shoulders which required stitching up. The tiger was seriously F'ed up and had to be destroyed.

The match up of 3 bulldogs against bear has been done also. From what I have read about half the bouts ended in favor of the bear.

Keep in mind this was not the English bulldog of present but an animal more like a very large pit bull terrier or the current American bulldog.

The classic matchup in old California was, of course, not the lion and the bear but the bull and the bear. The bull almost always won, thus the origin of the Wall Street "bulls" as favoring a strong market and the "bears" favoring a weak market.

Not that it proves anything, but the old California experience just shows that size matters. Even lacking useful teeth or claws, the sheer size of the bull put the grizzly at a disadvantage. If one assumes the bear to be approximately twice the size of the lion, that would seem to favor a large grizzly over a typical African lion.

So many creatures on this planet qualify. They all have their special adaptations. Pitting them against each other doesn't really prove much.

For example, put just about any land animal against a Komodo Dragon. It's pretty likely that the fight would end when the dragon is dead. But in less than a week the "winner" would be just as dead. The infection from even a minor bite is enough to kill even big animals, like the dragon's prey, water buffalo.

And let's play with environments. Put the winner of the "Ultimate Animal Fighting Competition" in the Sea World tank with a big killer whale or a Great White and guess what? The UAFC Champion is reduced to chum.

In the "pound for pound" category my vote goes to the mongoose. Same family as the badger, wolverine etc, but smaller and tough/fast as hell. Anything that doesn't turn tail and run at the sight of a King Cobra gets much respect from me.

Excellent point, Gonzo.

As I stated the match between 3 bulldogs and 1 bear was essentially even. Another poster stated that bull against bear usually ended with the bull the winner. Then there is the matches between 1 bulldog and 1 bull where the dog often won. I am sure it was enjoyable for the spectators but holds no meaning further.

I think that it is almost impossible to know for sure, because it could go different on any given instance. Age and experience, condition, all play a factor. with two older experienced animals you might even get a standoff where they kind of trade on the meat, knowing it isn't smart to fight it out.

I would if I had to place a bet though go with the Grizz, the bones are much more stout, so the impact from the Lion's blows is going to be less effective than the mighty swing of the bear.

I have heard that pound for pound the Badger is also a force to be reckoned with.

All of this though brings me back to something, the animal versus man thing. People think that we so outclass the animals by using our rifles. I disagree, I saw that with all of our intelligence, the prey so outstrips us in senses and power that the edge we get from our weapons does not give us 100% surety of success without injury. Think about hunting Wester black tails, which must be the hardest of all the deer since you read about white tail hunts all the time and hardly anybody bothers hunting the california sierras and writing about it. In a typical hunting season, think about how many deer just pass right by you without ever even being heard, let alone seen.

Red

Interesting account of bull vs. grizzly...

Bull/Bear fight


I tried to locate a website from way back, but can't find it.

Grizzly vs. lion in staged fights in California ended up so often with a dead lion that people stopped betting on the lion.

The lion kills with its teeth. The bear kills with its paws. A tremendous advantage in reach.

Rick.

I find staged fights between animals extremely disturbing. When animals fight in the wild, well, that's nature. The account of the bull and bear fights above makes me sick! These grand animals deserve better. I have no problem with hunting them in a ethical/sporting manner but to torture them this way is sickening.

I'd be the first to want to observe a naturally occurring contest between two rivals in the wild, it's fascinating and, in a way, beautiful but when humans stage these fights it's just plain wrong.

I'm glad that these contests are illegal in most states but I'm sure that they still occur on some level. I know dog fighting is very popular with certain "urban" populations and I'm sure there's still quite a bit of cock fighting going on but I'm pretty sure it's nowhere near the levels it used to occur.

Just my take.

RickF...

Rattlesnakes are also considerably faster than cobras.

In Taiwan, there is a place they display cobras at a night market. Handlers take them out, and put them on top of the cage. As they "hood up" the handlers will smack them on the back of the head, driving their nose down on the cage.

I would not attempt that with a rattler.

When one of the cobras gets loose, you oughta see the crowd split, to give it room!

(sort of)....MOOSE that was injured.
On a fly in fishing trip many years ago and was canoe floating a river when came across a not too badlt sized bull dragging along the shore with a broken rt hind leg. It was on a big sandbar and was still there when we motored back up stream. It was having a little trouble getting around but it didn't look amaciated or close to dropping.

Next day we floated down the river and there was a pretty good sized black bear feeding on it. He was none too happy to see us when he noticed us but didn't make a big deal out of it. He also didn't look like it was much of a fight. We didn't try to take his moose and he didn't try to board us.

The Romans did indeed fight lions against bears regularly.
Their records would indicate that the bears almost always won. I think if you compare a lion and a grizzly,the bear still has up to a 200lb. advantage.If you compare a lion to an Alaskan brown,you have a bear that can outweigh the cat by as much as 1300lbs.,you would also have a dead lion.