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AGREED! | |||
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The really scary thing about this eco-friendly bullet thing has yet to be considered. What will happen when one branch of government declares lead bullets a health hazard and another branch declares that solid copper, brass, or tungsten bullets are technically armor piercing? I can't help but think that even a Barnes expanding bullet will penetrate most LE vests unless they are also wearing ceramic plates. Long term, we are in deep shit my friends. | |||
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For big game we have copper, and will probably end up with bismuth like for duck guns. For 22 rimfires, things are not good. I bought a box of lead-free 22 RF last year, and they were pitifully inaccurate fired from a 513T that is good for 1/2" groups at 50 yards with good ammunition. I can't remember seeing lead fragments in any of the small game I've shot, seems like a solution looking for a problem. TomP Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be kept right, when wrong to be put right. Carl Schurz (1829 - 1906) | |||
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Well said. I too have sent many letters and emails, and while I am sure those representing me appreciate the support, we are hopelessly out numbered by the loons in the Bay area and Los Angeles. Jim "Bwana Umfundi" NRA | |||
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tendrams, any bullet at a velocity over 2000 fps will penetrate any concealable body armor Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Agree There are some....but few centerfire bottleneck cartridges that won't penetrate common armor Heck....for that matter....a center mass chest impact from a 2800+ fps 180 grn anything with zero penetration could still be leathal from impact alone ________________________________________________ Maker of The Frankenstud Sling Keeper Proudly made in the USA Acepting all forms of payment | |||
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thanks Scott King, I don't think it is long. My oldest goes to college in 2 years and we are out. I want my mom n dad to come along to. They deserve better! | |||
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6th generation arriving in the 1850s to Trinidad Harbor...5 generations in timber logging and mills, all 6 generations are ranchers as well. My brother left as a business man due to what has happened. I am a forester and wildlife biologist and have spent my life in Northern Cal, in the redwoods and the Forests of Six Rivers, Klamath, Mendocino and the Shasta-Trinity working on active timber/forest management. My father 42 years in mills and as a scaler. I travel often for work and rarely find somewhere as amazing, but with the marijuana issues in Trinity Humboldt and Mendocino and the State ran by the masses in less than 25% of the State we are lost. AND those from the cities have flooded my beautiful lands to grow weed..that city culture is not in rural California...it is gone. | |||
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I agree, but all this also depends what one considers "concealable". Do compound curve ceramic plates added to a vest count? Some of that is rated to 30-06 black tip (some not) and is pretty light and wearable. I don't know if that same plate would stop a 300 win mag Barnes solid or a 400 grain .416 Rigby solid or not. The only reason I brought this up was because of the recent attempt to ban green tip 5.56 on the grounds that it was armor piercing due to its partial steel core. Doesn't seem like much of a stretch at all for the powers that be to go after solids (as already done with some calibres from Barnes a few years ago) or even hollow points with a solid copper or brass base. Mark my words, it might not be soon, but we will find ourselves stuck between the green activists and the ATF on this issue sooner or later. | |||
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IIRC, Cal FaG originally opposed the lead ban during the ballot initiative campaign. **************** NRA Life Benefactor Member | |||
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