In ST magazine this month, Dick Metcalf states" Expert rifleman have long noted that mediocre rifles shoot everything about the same. Exceptional rifles are picky. By that they mean that the precision tolerances and quality fitting that go into building a quality gun means that the rifle will be sensitive to slight variations in the ammo it is fed. My Tikka is picky. With load it likes, it shoots one hole. With the loads it doesnt like, well ...."
Do you agree or disagree with the statement? Is it mediocre to have a rifle that shoots everything well? Is it exceptional to have a rifle that performs well only with one type of ammo? Whats your opinion??? Interesting statement. swede

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WyomingSwede

I don't think that's true.

The 40X's I have/had shoot everything very well that's made right with top components.

I have rifles that are so so shooters and I am lucky to have one load that groups.

I have a old M-70 in .243 with a throat thats erroded for 4" and I think I found a load for it finally. That barrel used to be very accurate with a lot of loads.

So I don't think that statement is true for the examples that I gave but if the author found it to be true for his rifles I would believe it.

I don't agree with Metcalf, either.

In my experience, top-notch rifles that a properly and precisely made from the ground up will shoot a variety of loads well, and with great precision. I've even owned and seen exceptional, "blind-luck", off-the-shelf factory rifles that were absolute tackdrivers and seemed to shoot just about everything you fed them well.

Rifles that are extremely load-specific are a pain in the neck. If I had the choice between a 1" rifle that shot a range of loads, including factory loads, with the same accuracy and to the same point-of-impact, or else a 1/2" rifle that only delivered that accuracy with one load (especially with a marginal bullet), I'd take the 1" rifle every time and run.

AD

My own experience is opposite of that premise. Mediocre rifles shoot everything decently, while they have one or two loads that do very well.
My most accurate rifles shoot everything really well, and have one or two loadings that put them into benchrest territory!

An accurate rifle that's finicky and only shoots well with a given load is an oxymoron.

Generally, I find that great rifles will pretty much digest anything and produce nice results, often great results.

I definitely know of very accurate rifles that are VERY finicky, such as the 6BR. But, is it a great rifle?

So, my conclusion is that great rifles will shoot damn near anything well. Accurate rifles will shoot something well...

I disagree with Metcalf, I won't own a picky rifle...It isn't easy, and I have gone through a lot of rifles over the years, but most of my keepers will shoot 1" or less and most bullets and bullet weights to the same POI, otherwise it takes a walk down gunshow lane. It must also show a tendency to maintain its zero from year to year, indicating very stable wood....I have no use for "picky, finacky" guns.

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

I disagree totally.

In fact one of the reasons for having a "good" rifle is not to have one load that shoots well but rather it shoots well with lots of loads and also different barrel fouling conditions.

Good rifles a like big V8s with 6 speed manuals. They just do it so easily.

Mike

I agree with Don and everyone else. A truly accurate rifle will shoot well with most anything. I really figured this out with a Remington 40x 3 position rifle that I own. I stopped buying 168 grain federal match or even thinking about working up a load for it when I discovered that it shot fifteen year old 147 grain british military ammo just as well . . . with stiking regularity it will do 1/2 minute or better if I do my part (sometimes even when I don't).

JohnTheGreek

Hey John,

If you liked the Radway, try the Portugese! It's what I use for practice in my M14s, particularly those whose headspace is a little too "generous". Shoots great at 200 and 300 but the wind gets it at 600.

Cheap too!

Redial

If the rifle is made right to begin with, it will shoot right. Sure some ammo will shoot better than others but over all a good well made rifle should shoot well with what ever ammo you buy. I have a Reworked over Brno ZKK 600 in 7 x 57 that will shoot anything I feed it into 2 inchs or less and that is 5 shots each of 140's 160's and 175 gr bullet weights. This rifle likes the 160's and 175 the best but for a light big game rifle it will shoot just about any load I care to shoot. That rifle is just a good rifle that was made right from the get go. All I had done was to rework the trigger and do a bedding job and mounted a good 6 x 42 Kalhles scope on it. One of my better meat guns.

I've been disagreeing with pretty much everything Metcalf writes since I first started seeing his work in Shooting Times, back in the '70's. Like the one where he said higher velocity makes the bullet zip right through an animal without expanding!

He has this one wrong, as well. Good rifles remove variability from the system. That is always a plus...

Tim

Redial,

It seems that great minds think alike. I have a full case of the Portugese stuff in my safe . . . along with an M1A.

Regards,

John

Metcalf is so, so off on this... Like everyone else here, I totally disagree with his "findings". I bet his Tikka has a loose scope or something...

-- Mats

I would tend to agree...the accurate rifle is the one you have the confidence to hit your target with...be it animal,vegetable,or mineral.
I dont need to worry whether it likes the particular brand of ammo I am shooting. A picky? rifle limits itself. I have a 95 mauser in 7x57 that is very particular in bullet weight due to the rifling of the old military barrel. It shoots 175 gr like a laser beam. Any other wieght bullet gives a 3-6" group or keyholes into the target. Knowing this...I only shoot 175 gr bullets in this rifle. However it doesnt come out of the closet very often either. Thanks to all who responded. Swede

Just because a gunwriter writes it doesn't make it gospel -- I say this, even having met, and taking a liking to, various gunwriters.

I have guns that shoot a LOT of loads "well." Of those, they tend to shoot better with better loads -- but that doesn't mean the "better" loads are miles ahead of the "good" loads, by any means. Basically, I don't think any of my precision pieces are all that "picky." They're only as picky as I am. If I want them to shoot better, I'll put more time into load development.

As an aside, I lost any respect I ever had for "DICK" Metcalf after his little "Gee, we don't have any prize money" fiasco at the Masters in Barry, Illinois, some years ago. I have no respect for people who lack honor. This has nothing to do with his "mediocre rifles" observations, but I just want to take any opportunity to point out a slime-sucking SOB whenever I have the chance.

Russ

[ 05-28-2002, 00:39: Message edited by: Russell E. Taylor ]

I disagree as well. I have found that most decent rifles will shoot better than most rifle-shooters. Most of my "keepers" shoot just about any reasonable load well. I have an old pre-64 70 in 30-06 that shoots just about any bullet, any weight. My old 35 Whelen, a mauser, is about the same. Then again, I have had stuff that you couldn't hit a barn with if you were inside with the door shut. If the bedding is right, and the scope is tight, and the bore is good, and there isn't a jerk behind the trigger, well, that's a good start!