Seems Wyoming G&F would rather spend $95,000.00 on a "Consultant" for selling "Online" licenses than replace even one of the FOUR Game Wardens that retired this past year!
Wyoming has no problem selling every available Permit offered each year. With the exception of a few permits that have very limited access due to private property. With Wyoming not accepting Credit Card payments for Licenses how can they implement such a plan?
More mismanagment by Wyo G&F.

Link to page the story appears on below:

http://www.billingsgazette.com/index.php?id=1&display=rednews/2003/07/08/build/wyoming/z-wyo-digest.inc

Utter imbecility ....

Consultants, counselors, yadda yadda yadda ....

Logic dictates that of 50 states in this country, at least one has a very clean and user friendly permit system that Wyoming could emulate as opposed to reinventing the wheel. And could not said emulation be orchestrated by indigenous consultants?

Our new governor is quickly demonstrating his propensity for gooberment spending and I'm certain he has never met a tax he didn't like.

Beam me up, Scotty .... no intelligent life left on the hill

They don't allow credit cards,because the bastards want cash,that they can place into an account and make interest off of. You figure they pull in millions of dollars with all of the combined drawings. Just the interest alone is in the thousands of dollars over the the two or three months they have your money.

The other side of it,is as a business all credit cards are is a pain in the ass. They cost you as a business money and you end up waiting for payment. If they did start using credit cards,Game and Fish won't take a hit,they'll just let you pay to use a credit card and then some. They already charge three dollars processing on cash,I'm sure they'd gladly double that amount for credit cards.

[ 07-10-2003, 06:54: Message edited by: RMK ]

RMK;
Youv'e hit the nail right on the head!
I'm sure they will charge an extra 2% or 3% for a credit card convenience fee.
The $3.00 fee you mentioned is the processing fee charged to residents correct?
It's always amazed me that a Non-Resident has to pay $10.00 for the exact same service!
The cost of processing, printing and mailing a refund check or a permit isn't any different! Yet a Non-Resident has to fork over more than three times the amount.
By Wyoming, Game & Fish's own admission, they rake in a cool ONE MILLION dollars from the Non-Resident "Processing Fee" alone!

The only way to make a statement to fish and game,is stop buying licenses. I'm sure in another few years,they'll allow 10 year old kids to hunt big game,so they can reach an even larger market and sell more tags. The biggest problem with not buying tags,is fish and game won't do the logical thing(reduce the price of tags),they'll just increse the tag fees and try to make the same cash with fewer tags.

The biggest crime in the fish and game,is the fact that only a small percentage of license fee's go to game management and research. The rest(the majority of funds)goes to building office space,vehicles and other administrative bullshit.

I hope WY doesn't go to the Credit Card payment option. Look at the how the draw odds have been more difficult in UT, NV, and AZ after they started accepting CC. Utah odds went form 50% to 3% on some units. Arizona had 60% more applicants. Nevada had many units with 5x the applicant in the 2nd year of CC apps.

I wish Utah would only take cash, put it in an interest bearing account and keep the intrest. That is a lot better scenerio than allowing everybody to apply with a CC and only have to pony-up after they draw the tag. Pay to play or have poor draw odds.

I agree w/ your premise, MGC, but we have an accountability problem here. The problem has recently increased as the department now directly receives a higher percentage of revenues.

It is interesting to try and track the revenue trail as a private citizen. It is very much like tracking a cat ....sporadic, vague, ambiguous.

Now.... for those who received multiple tags.... did you receive all your tags in one nice neat and economical parcel? Probably not. More likely you received seperate mailings for each tag with all the expensive multi colour brochures, etc. Can you imagine the dollar waste here?

I won 6 tags and I'm receiving five mailings, five brochures, five behaviour notices, five access notices, etc., etc., etc. Administrative decisions considered wasteful and non-productive in the private sector seem to be the rule in this specific bureaucracy.

The WY Game & Fish Dept. is evolving rapidly these days. And the direction saddens me.

Use of a credit card won't necessarily mean a delay in payment or the loss of interest to the DFW. Credit card payments are only delayed by law unless the seller notifies the buyer up front of the intent to charge immediately. I would hope that if they go the credit card route, they charge the cards immediately. That way, it will eliminate the non-serious applicants and avoid the need to raise the processing charges. I would think that it would also eliminate the deadbeat problem. If they charge your card when they send the tag, there would likely be a number of no-pays. Recovery of the tag from a non-resident (and avoiding its use) would be difficult.

Wisconsin allows credit card license purchase but charges 3 or 5% more if you buy with plastic to cover the card cost. I think the card fee is the problem!

Wyoming refuses to try other states succesful programs. They would rather throw money away trying to do it thier way! It is like the application and drawing system. We apply and they draw 90 days later. yeah I know they want to earn interest on our money. But if you apply with your kids like four kids for moose sheep and goat it is over $1000 laid out for a long time and no return and naturally no license. But you have to apply.

Kudu;
Using your example; family of Five.
Now if take and transfer the same application count of "Five" into Non-residents fees for the same three species, you're talking over $20.000.00, and thats not counting if everyone were to apply for Antelope, Deer and Elk, that would add another $4000.00. So you add an additional 3% credit card convience fee to that $24,000.00 = $720.00.
With next years increase to Residents and Non-residents alike at 20%, your's now will be $1200.00 and Nonresidents will be $24,000.00 for just the three species; Sheep, Goat, and Moose. Heck if a family of five non-residents were to apply for all six species, they would pay $300.00 in application fees alone.

Marsh I never even gave that any thought! Rich mans sport indeed!

I don't know if I understand. If Wyo has plenty of aplicants why don't they just charge a nominal fee that covers the cost of paper work for the draw. If someone doesn't take their license they could just sell it to the next in line. I agree that sucks to have to lay out alot of money just to apply. Am I correct that you have to pay in advance and then wait to see if you draw?

Dickpal;
Wyoming G&F stated: They have in excess of 100,000 Non-resident applications alone.
For each species you apply for they do charge $10.00 for Non-resident, and $3.00 for residents to process the application.
Yes, you do have to pay upfront, in advance, the full price of the license.
Depending on when you send in your application they hold that money for Three to Six months!

[ 07-13-2003, 05:43: Message edited by: Marsh Mule ]

Online applications will probably have little to no effect on resident hunters and fishermen.

(Probably only future rate hikes!)

But it will have a Major impact on the Non-resident Hunters by decreasing the already Shot-in-the-dark chances of being drawn.

Sure, it will create greater short-term inflow of revenues for G&F. In the form of Application fees and from the actual cost of the Licenses being sent in with the applications and put in short term INTEREST BEARING accounts.

Long-Term:
[The costs to Hire a consultant, impliment, and Maintain, Fix glitches, Call applicants who make mistakes on their apps , will eat up any added revenue and most likely more!}

Can you imagine the confusion of all the FIRST-TIME rookie applicants trying to make heads or tails of Wyoming's admitedly Complex application system?
All the different maps+areas, dates of opening-day for each area for specific species.

[One thing they don't tell you on the Non-Res applicaton booklet is how long the season runs for each area, you don't find that out until you recieve your permit! ] Or if you go to G&F's web site and research it or call.

I can see great Confusion trying to coordinate a 10 day or two week hunt of say, three species, Deer, Elk, and Antelope!(I speak from experience, it's not easy)

Can you imagine how small the maps, on your monitor will be, to fit the same page as each species application, along with the dates?
There's a Miriad of possible mistakes a person can make!

They will need to hire&Train a whole PLATOON of people just to call prospective applicants(Long distance Phone bill) to try to resolve the errors! More Money spent to "Modernize" and fix a problem that doesn't exist!

I'D BE WILLING TO BET THAT THE PEOPLE BEHIND THIS IS THE "TRAVEL & TOURISM COMMITEE" THESE ARE THE PEOPLE THAT OVERSEE AND CONTROL "GAME & FISH"
(Kind of like having the Coyotes guarding the hen house)
THEY ARE CLUELESS, THAT THIS IS NOT LIKE MAKING A HOTEL RESERVATION ONLINE!
THIS IS THE SAME COMMITEE THAT KILLED A BILL TO IMPLIMENT A VERY SMALL "HOTEL TAX" STATING IT WOULD HURT THEIR BUSINESSES!
BUT WERE ALL IN FAVOR OF RAISING FEES FOR HUNTING & FISHING LICENSES BY 20% ACROSS THE BOARD FOR RESIDENT & NON-RESIDENTS ALIKE!
THEY ALSO VOTED TO WHAT AMOUNTS TO IN EFFECT, TRIPLING THE GAME COMMISIONERS PAY AND ALLOWANCES!

JUST WHO MAKES UP MOST OF THIS COMMITEE YOU MAY ASK?
HOTEL AND RESTURANT OWNERS OR PEOPLE WITH CLOSE TIES OR BACKGROUNDS IN THE HOTEL-MOTEL INDUSTRY!