You will be allowed no food only the stuff you shoot yourself and you will be up agiasnt some of the meanest animals on the planet in which you will be a part of there food source.

you might have to shoot a rabbit or a rat to survive so think about that when you choice the 458 lott what will be left to eat?

your rifle or shotgun ammo will be what ever you want and there will be someone to carry it arround for you.

Selections for the rifle is as follows.

any name brand you want, no custom guns allowed, ruger has the 458 lott setting on the shelve if you choose that.

1. 22 lf
2. 243 win
3. 30-30 win
4. 12 gauge shotgun, 3" only
5. 338 win
6. 375 H&H
7. 458 lott

my choice would be a shotgun, birds are hard to shoot with a rifle, but then again a bengal tiger wanting to eat you might make you feel a bit undergunned.

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Ignorance is curable but stupidity is terminal.

I'd go for the 338 Win, 275 grain Speer, half tungsten solids and half SP, loaded to 2600 fps.

I'd use the solids on small fry and buff, and the SP on the rest.

Don

you've got to learn how to manipulate all the loopholes here people...

there are many of places whee there are very few big game animals but birds are almost every where.

Curtis_Lemay has the right idea but no combo guns are offered.

[This message has been edited by mikfla (edited 07-04-2001).]

First and foremost is the legal question. Whereabouts in these countries of the world will we be? Wilderness, the cities or the suburbs? Some countries have no wilderness left nor even much open country. We are allowed no food other than what we shoot ourselves. Where would one do any subsistence hunting at all in Europe or Japan without getting arrested? Can we shoot farm animals? Or do we have legal tags for all "game" fauna available in each country, and will we be in that country during open season for that fauna?

How about clothes? Can I cut up my clothes into strips to make bowstrings or snares?

What era are we talking about? 2001 or 1002 or perhaps some year BC?

Okay, enough quibbling. If I can take a .22 Single Six then that takes care of any bird that eventually lands on water/earth/a tree branch. You never said we had to wing shoot them. Given that, since biting animals are included the next logical choice would be a .375 H&H in ANY decent bolt action rifle with a 1.75X6 Leupold and a mixture of 270 grain A-Frames for edible stuff and 300 grain A-Frames for the nasties.

destinations could be NY city or in the middle of the Desert or in India or Africa, anywhere, you are not allow to enter any buildings or to talk to anyone.

No one will be able to see you except for your ammo barrier and animal life, in the city every watch dog will pick up your sent and will want to make a meal of you, best bet is to get out of the city as fast as possible, any animal life is fair game wheather wild or domestic.

you only have the cloths on your back and you can do what ever you want with them, you will not get more, only clothing you will have is the cloths you get from the hides you take, that is if you are not eaten before then by a very hungry critter.

depends where you are dropped off you might go a week with out seeing wildlife or you could see one all the time.

the law cannot see you so that is not your concern, only thing you have to worry about is the critters and the climate in which either can do you in, you will get water purification tablets and unlimited fire source for lighting your fires, no first aid will be given, your ammo barrier is not a doctor, sorry .

at the end of 6 months if you are still arround the animals will no longer have a hunger for you and the people will once again be able to see you and you will have won more money then bill gates currently has.

[This message has been edited by mikfla (edited 07-05-2001).]

I will go for the Luftwaffe drilling option, with a good EUROPEAN SCOPE. A very large selection of Brenneke and buckshots. I even would like to have one shotgun barrel rifled for 900 grain lead solid hardcast slugs with brass case. Most european makers has ammo for 9,3X74R and nosler makes both partitions and BT in this caliber.
Shootguns are good for thoose who can use them, wich not all of us can??

Only ONE gun?? This is completly out of order�. I could think of at least 10 rifles i'd like to use. Seek help if you could think of owning one rifle.

[This message has been edited by JOHAN (edited 07-07-2001).]

what you put on the guns you have is up to you and of course you will havve your pick on any optics available in binoculars and scopes, night vision is also available, you will need it for the critters that like to feed at night .

smallfry I hear ya

i do have to go on the fire works thing to night

I read the book some Bears kill, What do you think that might have been a bad idea?

[This message has been edited by mikfla (edited 07-05-2001).]

If I KNOW there are big and scratchy critters around, I want the rifle.

I can maybe load some sort of shotshell for the .45 Colt -or- I have shot the heads off of grouse with big game rifles many times. I've used .303, 30-06, 7mmRM, and .270. If we have unlimited ammo, you aren't wasting shells. If you know what your bullet is going to do at close range, it's not so hard, and there is very little meat damage.

This sounds like a video game!

<<<<<<<<< SMILE >>>>>>>>>>

Make mine #6 Please!

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..Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY DESIGNS
Collector/trader of fine double rifles, and African wildlife art

It is starting to sound like Burger King

Good Hunting
Steve

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'Trapper'

"any name brand you want, no custom guns allowed"

"in the city every watch dog will pick up your sent and will want to make a meal of you, best bet is to get out of the city as fast as possible, any animal life is fair game wheather wild or domestic."

Given these conditions, my choice remains the same. A Single Six .22 will take any small game around. If I can cheat just a leetle bit, if it is a .22 convertible then a .22 Magnum cylinder will up the power to take out small deer. If only .22 LR is allowed that is okay too. Rabbits, rats, birds, chickens, pigs in pens, cows in feedlots. Those watchdogs might be tasty too, I'll have to go to a Chinese restaurant beforehand and get some good recipes.

For everything else, including those big beasties one might find in the wilder parts of this planet, the .375 H&H with the Swift 270 and 300 grain bullets. Sight the 270's 3" high at 100 and the 300's about 1" high at 100 with the same sight setting, I believe I know someone who was able to accomplish this. Rifle is a Winchester Model 70 with Leupold 1.75X6 scope, which surprisingly enough I happen to have right now.

Oh yes, one more absolutely needed piece of equipment. A good knife for cleaning game and making jerky strips to get me through those weeks of no game to be found.

Clothing would be carefully chosen for durability and drab coloring and well layered.

If possible I'd like to make my reservations to start on March 1st, 2002, ending on August 31st. That would take me through spring and summer in the Northern hemisphere and fall and winter in the Southern hemisphere. That should keep the climate fairly endurable in most places.

So, where do we go first?

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"If you can keep your head about you when all others are loosing theirs and blaiming it on you..."

AD

G�ring issued those to some of his pilots on long range rec missions. Called "Luftwaffendrilling"

Would take fine shot, buckshot, RWS TUG for the largest, RWS FMJ RN, if these are still made, PMP or Norma SP bullets.

Bullet will be good for 250 yds. O - and a lot of slugs!!

For dangerous game I would load: rifle, 1 slug, 1 buckshot. If that�s not enough practice more or call the Marines ...

H

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Shotguns are for people who can't aim.

-- Mats

Being i started the theard i will cheat and drag along my 375 h&h along with my shotgun

The answer, of course, is the Harrington & Richardson Topper 88 in 12/76. Possibly with a half choke instead of full. It is naturally checked to shoot properly with Brenneke slugs but I wonder if the Sauvestres wouldn't be better? I have seen what a Brenneke can do but not what the Sauvestre can.

Barring the H&R, there are plenty of single shot break actions out there that will do as well or better. The Baikal is a good design, too. 28" barrel would be about right.

Most fat, wealthy Americans don't stop to consider that these humble break actions are found EVERYWHERE. From the jungles of the Amazon to the forests of the Cameroon, from the hills of Borneo to the plains of Burma and everywhere in between, these are the guns of the one-gun hunter.

3" chambers are completly unnecessary but count as a nice-to-have feature just in case normal ammo is scarce. If I had my druthers, I'd get the stock fixed on my 1950s 35/70E Simson since two barrels are sometimes better than one.

The 12 gauge will bag anything from a hummingbird on up to Cape buff (Don Zutz supposedly did this on a dare with Brenneke slugs). What's the next question?

Oh yeah, ditch the revolver since it ain't going to help you at all where you are sending us! Trade its 2 lbs in weight for a couple boxes of shells any day. After having lived in Europe for many years (yet remaining the token American), I find it quite humorous that the American outdoorsman can't imagine being out in the woods without a sidearm. I used to be like that, too, carrying my pistol out for "finishing shots". But it got to be a burden in an area where the threat level from armed mischief makers was non-existent.

[This message has been edited by David J. Moses (edited 07-07-2001).]

For hunting big game I'd take a 30-06.....

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

Simple.Then my prey is man. I would become an invisible untouchable uncatchable burglar/ mugger (thanks to the paramaters you have described above.)

Watch dogs in the cities a problem? I would rather handle shooting a few dogs than brave the 'nastiest critters'in the wilds( as you said) and try and find food for myself in walking out into the middle of nowhere.

I would head for the first sign of civilisation in any scenario and live the easy life sneaking into people's houses eating what I want and watching thier televisions at night since they can't see me

My choice of weapon would be a 338 for game on the march to the cities and the 45 for shooting peoples pet dogs when i go there.

Your move.

Karl.

[This message has been edited by Karl (edited 07-07-2001).]

The Heym Mod 37V Veirling four barrel gun. Side by side 12guage with a 9.3x74R (or 30 06) slung below and in the middle a .222 Rem.
(or .22 Hornet)
Now that has got to be a pretty good gun for everything...

great idea! only 1 problem half of NY talks to invisible people right now so you will be just one of many in the city they cannot see you but they can kill you.

You say you cannot kill what you cannot see? Don't count on it.

you ever see a female dog in heat how all the neighborhood dogs come arround well you will have to include cat and all dogs not just the male dogs.

don't you think the dogs are barking and eatting at you that the people will add 1 and 1 together and get 2 and tell there buddys that we have one of those strange fellas in the neighborhood from NY city

they can shoot in your direction or fumigate you and you will die just the same.

Then why respond at all?

Things are slow arround here and I thought I would living it up a bit, If it offends you then it is better not to click on a post that as my nick name.

I have been hunting for 35 years and I have read 270 win versus the 30-06 post about a million times, does that not bore you?

Hunting season does not even start arround here till sept for archery.

If you hate it so much.

Scratch the 22 rf, too small, and can be tempermental.
Scratch the 30-30---as the gunmakers should have done years ago.
Scratch the 458 Lott, wonderful round, to be sure, but VERY specialized.

Leaving the 12, 243, 338, 375, and the ever popular 45 colt.

Shotguns are fine for stuff that is moving/close up. People tremendously over-rate the 12 gauge slug, basically what you have there is a breech-loading muzzleloader. Although I do give credit for vast improvements of late, this "slug" technology is far from refined. Would not want to face a big critter with one, as they are by my way of thinking a "soft" round, not a Barnes X to be sure.

Which leaves us with 3 really good calibers.
375, and I suspect, but can not prove, 338 have stopped every animal on the planet at one time or another. 243 will work for probably 60 percent of the critters on this earth.

So back to the original presumption, you may have to shoot a rat to survive. Well now if you hit a rat with any of the firearms on the list, including many of the hot new 22's (CCI STINGERS) and definately the 12 gauge shotgun he is going to come apart in such a way that he wont be fit to eat anyway, UNLESS you can make an "accuracy shot" and blow his head off, leaving the body intact. Scratch the 375. Good caliber to be sure, but not known for putting one on top of another.

Which leaves us with the 243 or 338. Both can be quite accurate rounds, cabable of staying tight over distances, and both can take a wide variety of bullet weights for their caliber. Now since this is a World Wide gun, and you might face Harry the Angry Hippo, the 338's advantage is obvious.

While NOT my 1st choice, which is NOT on the list, the 338 can do the "accuracy shot" on small critters/birds to effect a kill without meat damage, and I would still feel comfy with it against the biggest creature imaginable.

Now for specific firearms. As I am familiar with the Browning A-bolts and Ruger 77's, I would use one of these for a starting point. Most likely a stainless stalker, (Or ruger comparible model). I spoke of the need for the Accuracy Shot, (high magnification) and the need for a scope to handle more reasonable sporting scenarios (mid to low magnification). This leaves me with some fine scopes available from Lightforce, Leo, Burris, Schmidt/bender, Zeiss. Strictly because I am familiar with it, I would choose the Burris 6x24. It would be fitted with a Harris bipod, just because I did not see anything about that in the rules. It would have a claw-type sling.

This is not the Ideal gun, sadly it is not on the list, but, rules are rules.

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Safety & Ethics,Accuracy, Velocity, Energy
Joe M

[This message has been edited by JoeM (edited 07-10-2001).]

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