In the latest issue of the Shooting Gazette a reader gave the results of shooting 150 Roe deer with either 22-250 50gr or 243 100gr. Figures in brackets are the 243.
40% (18%)dropped on the spot 19% (41%)ran up to 10m 22% (33%)ran up to 30m 11% (8%) ran up to 50m
The sample size is unequal 38 being shot with the 243 and 112 with the 22-250. Average range 75m, carcass weights varying a few lbs either side of 30lbs (presumably no head, legs or guts)Only 10% of 22-250 bullets failed to exit.
Make of it what you will!
Posts: 2258 | Location: Bristol, England | Registered: 24 April 2001
1894, A couple of years ago I read a very interesting report from a German hunter who had shot over 1,000 roe dear. He had used a number of cartridges from the 22Hornet up to the 8x68S and 9,3x74R and had very carefully recorded the results as related to the reaction of the deer considering the cartridge and bullet used, the place where the bullet impacted, and the deer's awareness when the shot was taken, which, by the way, was an important factor. To make short a long story, the winner was, hands down, the 22-250 with 55gr factory loads. I alway try not to argue with success! Regards, Montero
Posts: 874 | Location: Madrid-Spain | Registered: 03 July 2000
I made the mistake of writing my Masters degree thesis on deer damage to arable crops. I soon learned that trying to turn things like these into hard science is tricky. There are so many variables that it makes it almost impossible to draw any conclusion based on scientific evidence.
The gut feeling is usually the correct one! Science such as this is generally flannel IMHO.
Posts: 1978 | Location: UK and UAE | Registered: 19 March 2001
Guys, Please take it from someone who has hunted with a 243 for over forty years ... the Sierra 85 grain HPBT bullet will take a deer faster and cleaner then most of the 100 grain bullets. I'm sure if more people whould use it, the number of deer dropped in their tracks would increase greatly. Remember, this is a Gameking bullet not a varmint bullet. It works, try it. BEN243
Posts: 32 | Location: EAST COAST | Registered: 18 May 2002
Sure, under ideal conditions and with good bullets (stress : not the usual frangible varmint bullet), the .22-250 may kill like lightning (often with haematoma being present, although hidden by the hide). But, what about a distant, quartering shot or when the bullet blows up on heavy bone, in the summer, with flies all over the place ? No thanks, I'll go along with heavier calibers that go in and come out, whathever the angle or distance. Call it magnumitis, if you like...
Posts: 2420 | Location: Belgium | Registered: 25 August 2001
Velocity kills hi-stung animals quite violently and is impressive to the neophite hunter. The problem is that on ocassion the bullets come apart and fail miserably and an animal is lost...If you use one of the new controled expansion bullets in the hi velocity 22-250 for instance then it kills about like any other gun, but just may fail to leave a blood trail....
The bottom line is that you are better off with a heavy bullet at lower velocity in a larger caliber and not getting that crap shoot gamble of that instant lightening kill..what you will get is a 100% kill but without the dramatics and your animal will run 20 to 75 yds and leave a very good blood trail.
Those stats above coincide with some culling I have done over the years with the 22-250 except I recognize a few failures which I am sure the author of this article left out of his scenario, as it happens I assure you, fortunatel few actually escape and are killed by a follow up shot.
Posts: 41976 | Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | Registered: 04 June 2000
Can't help it but to my mind the 22's are for varmints. Minimum for roedeer is 6mm or more. My choice is 243/6mm rem or more. I hunt mostly with 270 win for roedeer and fallowdeer.
quote:Originally posted by Atkinson: Those stats above coincide with some culling I have done over the years with the 22-250 except I recognize a few failures which I am sure the author of this article left out of his scenario, as it happens I assure you, fortunatel few actually escape and are killed by a follow up shot.
Ray - what weight of deer were you culling with 22-250. A roe is hard not to penetrate broadside with a conventional soft point I agree that 150 deer without a loss is good going and that no one is going to advertise the loss of a deer in a national magazine that will be read by peers.
A lot of Scots kill a lot of Roe with 22 centrefires. I would go so far as to say it is the rifle of choice. There is absolutely no dispute that they work extremely well on Roe over here. A lot of English (and Welsh) stalkers are clamouring to be allowed to use them on muntjac and roe in England.
I wouldn't choose a 22-250 over a 243 for huge reductions of recoil or noise!
Posts: 2258 | Location: Bristol, England | Registered: 24 April 2001
quote:Originally posted by aHunter: The 22-250 will kill Roe deer like lightning. Meat destruction is occasionally drastic. Some hunters switched caliber because of this.
H
I agree with you also regarding the 243. I saw some roedeer and chamois shot with a 243, but that was enough. For "normal" hunting here I use bigger, heavier and slower calibres, even when the lightning effect is not so good. May be for far distance those calibres are useful.
Posts: 147 | Location: Germany | Registered: 16 June 2002
I've shot quite a few Roe with the 22-250 and would agree that with the right shot placement and at a closeish distance it kills like lightning. However, get the shot placement slightly wrong and you are looking at a tracking job. I do continue with it but pick my shots. If I know the shots will be rangier the 25-06 comes out! Ed
I've never hunted Roe deer, but I've taken a lot of American Whitetails and Muleys with .22 through .35 calibers. Most of these deer have been in the 100-200 pound range. Every deer I've shot with a 22-250 has been an instant kill, but all were either head or heart shots. Distances were all less than 200 yds.
I was a one gun hunter for many years when all the rest were stolen. This was a .243. I've taken several large deer with it and one elk; I passed it on to my son and he's taken every deer he's shot with it. Large deer 200-300 lbs. always seem to take more than one shot.
As sdgunslinger said 100 grains bullets it's not designed for a small Roe , I lost a Roe last year after a good hit with a 243 , change for Sierra 85 gr HPBT ( as Ben243 said ) and two bucks fell in his tracks with shots behind the shoulder , I lost a few ribs on the exit side but no problem , my dog like Roe meat , and inside the damage it's terrible , if we don't know bullet manufacturer on the Shotting Gazzete article it's no value .
A few years ago I did a study using a 22-250 AI with a fast twist , many different types of bullets and caribou. There are 22 bullets such as the 53 grain X, 55 Trophy Bonded. 60 grain Allred triple jacket bonded, 60 grain Nosler partition, 74 RWS conepoint and 80 grain Allred partition that won't fail on bone and still expand quickly enough to kill very quickly. Really good killer out to 300 yards...easily as good or better than the .243 in which 100 grain bullets expand pretty slowly at long range. With the typical varmint bullet the caliber was great on neck shots and penetrated well on body shots out past 150 yards or so when the velocity had settled a bit. The 22-250AI is equivelant to a Swift.
Just because the law says you can't (in effect) use a lesser calibre than .243 for deer in England doesn't mean to say that the law is founded in scientifically proven research and fact.
You other guys - what's all this stuff about Tikkas - you trying to wake me up or something?
Posts: 360 | Location: Sunny, but increasingly oppressed by urbanites England | Registered: 13 February 2001
I spend 3 months in Scotland stalking roe and sikadeer. As Montero says the awareness of the deer is an extremely important factor when you look at distance run after the shot. If you take one of two deer in front of you, the other will usually stay if the one shot drops on the spot. The second will usually run unless hit in the neck or spine. I don't know if its adrenalin or what but I have seen fawns shot through both shoulders push themselves 15 m on the backlegs and chest. All the Scottish stalkers used .22-250 with a 55 gr sako gamehead. I used my .250 sav AI with either a 117 gr Hornady RN, 115 gr Trophy Bonded Bearclaw or 120 gr Partition which all worked perfectly in my mind. Regards Martin
