Daddy I am sure that Browning is sweeter than apple pie, a real looker is what I mean. I have heard a lot of real good things about the A Bolt Browning. Then again seems like everybody has their favorite. I will just roll the dice and see what comes up.

I was told that the 300win mag didn't kill any better than a 30-06.....it just gave a shooter or hunter an extra 50 or 100 yards to work with. So why not have the best of both worlds come to think about it a little more.

I am NOT an early riser by any means, comes with the territory I suppose. Going to make some of my own "luck" as mentioned by Big Stick. I am off to go gun shopping and locate a couple of books on guns as well. Make one of those a reloading manual.....I don't roll my own yet. Today is going to be a fun day I can tell already. Thanks again fella's.

Jazz first you have to buy a BAR, then walk around the Rockies with one. Then you can call me weak.

There aint no mountains in IL. and anyone that has to post asking a question like this shouldnt be implying anything about anyone here. A .338 BAR must be around 11lbs loaded and scoped, while you can get a bolt that will weigh in at least 2lbs lighter.

If you think 2lbs doesnt make a difference at 10,000' then youv been a flatlander for to long............10

Two years ago I was hunting Whitetail on my farm and took a solid shot from a prone position on a great looking 10 pt whitetail buck at around 210 paces. At the shot the deer dropped like a sack of potatoes. His head was convulsing up and down but he looked otherwise immobile for about a minute. Then, inexplicably, he stood up and took off at a full run, tail and head high in the air. I tracked him for over 200 yards through the pastures (he left some pretty good footprints as he was running to beat all) Then again for another 150 yards or so through some hardwoods. Then I lost the trail...not a single drop of blood to be found...
The shot broke clean. He was standing broadside and the shot was aimed right behind the crease in his leg. The gun was a Model 7 in 7-08. Contrary my normal practice of shooting the gun at many distances I only had fired the gun at 100 yards or so and left it sighted in about 2" high at 100 yards. The bullet was a Hornady SST 139 grain. Powder was a hefty dose of H414.
I was totally perplexed. He went down like many deer I've hammered.. So I went back to my firing position and set up some paper targets where the deer had been standing. I shot the rifle three times and found a group 14 inches higher than my point of aim. Like I said, the gun was sighted in 2" high at 100 yards. So I figured out what happened...probably hit him high in the back and the shock of the bullet in a non-vital spot temporarily immobilized him. While the gun, ultimately was the problem, the real problem was that I didn't spend enough time behind the trigger on that rig to know that there was a problem. It was operator error. I am a master class HP rifle shot and should have known better...but my ego or maybe stupidity took over and I went afield with a rig that wasn't up to the task...dumb call especially when I had at least two other deer rifles sitting in the safe which would have put meat on the table in this instance.
FWIW, I played with that rifle for about 2 years and never could get it to shoot decent groups nor would it shoot consistently at longer ranges...it was way off at 200 and 300 yards. Finally sent it back to Remington and they replaced the barrel... it now shoots like it should.
I ran across the same deer during the late muzzlelaoder season (unfortunately antlerless only) and he didn't look any worse for the wear... Its funny hunting deer on you own place..you usually know them all and when you shoot one you feel like you just killed an aunt or an uncle. So I now try to do most of my hunting on my neighbor's farms where I can shoot their "aunts and uncles"
T Jazz,
Tell ya what...that .338 BAR sounds like an ideal "mountain rifle" to me... I think you would be well served to get one of those big 50 mm scopes in something like a 6-24 power. That way you'll always be able to shoot tiny little groups with that BAR and your head will be way up and off that stock so the recoil won't hit you in the face. I'd also recommend a good solid Harris bi-pod for a stable shooting rig...very important in the mountains ya know!
How often have you shot your rifle at 300 yards?

10point....I am not sure exactly of the weight of that Bar, but it didn't strain my backside any when I picked it up. It seems as though Browning has sold a hell of a lot of them over the years. We never hunt on foot while elk hunting anyway (not more than a 1/2 mile).....horses do most of the treading up the mountainside. I have only seen 2 groups of city slicker hunters that did walk around and they were actually lost in the process dressed in solid orange to boot.

I just was looking at a stainless rifle in a 300 Ultra mag by Winchester @ 7.5 pounds plastic stock. I like the looks, but want a 338 caliber. Seems only Remington makes it in a 338 Ultra. I don't know anybody around hear that has one of those types. Hey, I see you are going on a big hunt as I read the bit about the airline tickets. If you don't mind me asking, where is it you hunt in Africa? Now that would have to be the ultimate hunt on this earth to my way of thinking.

I just got finished looking at some great photos of safaris back in the 20's. As a kid I always dreamed of going to Africa, but you know how that goes. Suddenly you are an adult bringing up kids of your own and so on. My aren't big enough to hunt yet, but someday it will happen for them at my side.

10point....I am not sure exactly of the weight of that Bar, but it didn't strain my backside any when I picked it up. It seems as though Browning has sold a hell of a lot of them over the years. They are very accurate number one and have a fool proof action with no hickups number two. We never hunt on foot while elk hunting anyway (not more than a 1/2 mile).....horses do most of the treading up the mountainside. I have only seen 2 groups of city slicker hunters that did walk around and they were actually lost in the process dressed in solid orange with all and I mean all of their gear on there backs. They looked exhausted to say the least. Pardon me if you thought I slighted you buy saying you must be week. I really didn't think that rifle was that heavy, and yes it didn't have a scope on it yet.

I just was looking at a stainless rifle in a 300 Ultra mag by Winchester @ 7.5 pounds plastic stock. I like the looks, but want a 338 caliber. Seems only Remington makes it in a 338 Ultra. I don't know anybody around hear that has one of those types. Hey, I see you are going on a big hunt as I read the bit about the airline tickets. If you don't mind me asking, where is it you hunt in Africa? Now that would have to be the ultimate hunt on this earth to my way of thinking.

I just got finished looking at some great photos of safaris back in the 20's. As a kid I always dreamed of going to Africa, but you know how that goes. Suddenly you are an adult bringing up kids of your own and so on. My aren't big enough to hunt yet, but someday it will happen for them at my side. I must be off now, have a great day 10.

T/Jazz Look at the 375. You will have a friend for life. You will be ready for Africa some day. I think you will find that others are right about the weight of the BAR. Good gun just a bit heavy. One of my buds used one for elk. Weight was an issue and he gets his excercise. Also the BAR's are picky with their handloads. I have yet to put together a load that will feed his rifle. Bolts are not all light either. I carried a Ruger bolt M77 MK II 300 win mag on an elk hunt on rough terrain a year or two back. It weighed in at about 10-11 pounds. Too much for a mountain rifle. If you are stout enough go to it. My gun of choice is a 375 mod 70 tricked out to about 7 pounds scoped and loaded. Aint it great to live where you get choices. Good guns, good availability and the choice is yours. Have a good time. "D"

Kentucky Nimrod~~~We shoot a lot at my Dad's place. He has a neat range set up for shooting guns. That 270 cal rifle I have will knock an apple off a fence post at 200 yards leaning over the truck for support. I have shot at gallon paint cans at 300 yards from a rest and it will lay em in there using those hand loads of my brother in law (150 weight Noslers) I have killed several ground hogs with that gun at over 300 yards during the summer.

D Hunter I have a freind of mine out west who uses a 375H&H and swears by the rifle for hunting large game like elk. It is a Winchester 70 375H&H. I shot it once from the bench last year and it packs a whallop on both ends I would say. I didn't shoot a very good group with the gun at all from the bench. Something around 3 inches or so using the scope. Now he can shoot 3/4 inch groups with it with no problems. This guy is 35 pounds lighter than I am (I weigh 190) so go figure.

Okay, okay, I laid down and put a cold rag on my head and I took my medicine and let it have time to take effect. MY question is, why does anyone select a magnum cartridge and shoot a bullet that is best suited for a 30-06?????????????? If you're shooting a .300wm or over and using a bullet of less than 200grs, you lugging around more rifle than you need to. Get you a 30-06. When I used a 30-06 to elk hunt with, I used a 200gr bullet. sheeez

I know the 270 has and will continue to kill big game, even elk. But IMHO there are better cartridges out there. The 338 comes to mind, as well as others. The point is, to shoot the biggest gun you can accurately.
If I was you I would give the 338 a long hard look. It seems like a great elk cartridge.
Good luck and good shooting

Beemanbeme come to think of it, had you started at the beginning of the thread (right) you would have already known, that I do have a 30-06. Now as of last night....snow to boot. I have a Browning Bar in a 338, only because of the poll I took on elk hunters both talking and reading. I figure over 80% of the folks I talked to who in fact hunt elk in all kinds of conditions and not from their PC, shoot a 338 cal. Geeezzzzz now that is informative isn't it elk hunter. Oh yeah! My wife doesn't think it is to heavy for her either, but just for grins I am letting her shoot my 270 first. This is one dandy looking rifle.....can't wait to shoot it this weekend. Thanks again to those that spoke out about the 338 virtures.

Beemanbeme come to think of it, had you started at the beginning of the thread (right) you would have already known, that I do have a 30-06. Sorry your not feeling very well! You might try checking out your vision with an eye doctor soon.

Now as of last night....snow to boot. I have a Browning Bar in a 338, only because of the poll I took on elk hunters both talking with them (reading posts here) and reading a couple of books by the experts. I figure over 80% of the folks I talked to who in fact hunt elk in all kinds of conditions and not from their PC, shoot a 338 cal. Geeezzzzz now that is informative isn't it elk hunters. Oh yeah! My wife doesn't think the Bar is to heavy for her either, but she is a strong German girl, just for grins I am letting her shoot my 270 first. This is one dandy looking rifle.....can't wait to shoot it this weekend. Thanks again to those that spoke out about the 338's virtures.

T/Jazz

Ya done good.

I hunt elk with a sick addiction, every year. Over the years I have become convinced that all things aside, the 300 Win is where really good elk cartridges begin. Had to shoot too many elk too many times with 7mm's. You can puree the heart and lungs and they'll just stand there blinking. If they take of running, even with a heart and lung shot, they can easily go a couple hundred yards, and the couple hundred yards they always choose to cover will make your job five times as hard. Bounced a .30-06 180 grain partition off of a spike's shoulder at 200 yards 3 years ago. Someone else killed him before I could get there.

In my experience, the .338 Win transfers much more shock and energy, much more immediately than the .300's. It kills on one side and cripples on the other! I aim for lung and shoulder bone, and let her fly. The effect has always been devastating, which I cannot say for my .270, 7MM Mag, or .30-06.

I really don't understand the need for 400 yard capability on elk. I always find mine within 200 yards, and the shot almost always presents itself within 75 yards. Elk are easy to stalk. Keep the wind in your face, mind the cows, and you might as well have a bow. For each of the last five years I have stalked to within 30 yards of bulls (just for fun). Its always a hoot to see their big eyes when they finally bust you.

Congrats on your new addition! I think you'll be quite happy with it. Happy Hunting, Nate