How many of you guys shoot females? (I mean female animals � I know most of us know of at least one real b*#$%h we�d love to shoot, not to mention a certain Saudi extremist !)
Is there a still feeling around that it is not �cool� to shoot the females of a species, or has the principles of game management finally prevailed � where a percentage of everything has to be removed, in order to maintain sex ratios.
If females are shot � then when you apply for a �tag� do you request male or female, or is it the luck of the draw? And is there any difference in cost?

Over here, those people who are only hunting for meat often shoot females, as they cost a lot less than males do � sometimes up to half � so instead of shooting say one Kudu bull and one Impala ram, you could go and shoot a Kudu cow and maybe three Impala ewes and a ram for the same cost.
Which means on a five day hunt you�re out hunting every day, and not sitting around for three or four days because you got both your males on the first or second day � and have now used up your budget.
As much as we all like just being in the great outdoors � what we are there for in the end is to hunt.
Having said that though, I must say that there is still a stigma for some people here about shooting females - probably a carry over from granddad�s teachings � and that inevitably some females are going to be in the early stages of pregnancy, and removing a foetus is never pleasant, I�m sure this puts many off.
Bush Baby

I take does every year.

Doe tags are cheap, and I actually live in a PA special regs area where you can buy just about as many doe tags as you'd like. You get a buck license straight out, then buy your doe tags, for about 6-7 dollars.

PA has a new idea on taking does to improve the "quality" of buck. Truth, for me, I guess I'd rather take a buck because it seems like more of a real hunt. You're working for something. I usually get a buck.
However, for the remaining segment of the season, I have no problem with dropping does and leaving a buck to another hunter or to age another year.

During archery, where I have had little success, I pretty much go by the idea of, "If its brown, its going down".

But I think the lure of a buck is always there.

I'm not a trophy hunter, and even I would rather take a buck.
But hell, in my eating experience, which is vast, the doe usually seems to be a better quality of meat.

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Live Free! Madison, Jefferson and all the boys paid for it, and so did our very own fathers.

[This message has been edited by 1LoneWolf (edited 09-17-2001).]

I shoot female deer. Our deer heard is increasing at a very high rate. Here in Oklahoma we had a panel of hunters,farmers, and game officals work together on a sound management plan. We can now shoot more does than before. This should also allow the young bucks to survive hopefully until they reach 4 yrs for max. trophy pontential. Shooting a year old buck is a waste. IMHO

It is a necessary evil and I have no objection to shooting a female for meat, I normally get involved in culling operations and will shoot does where required..The meat is normally better than that of males..I have no problems with it.

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

Like 1LoneWolf, I live in PA, and take advantage of $6 USD doe tags. Compare that to a side of beef. You just can't beat it. We also have deer damage areas, where, if I'm lucky enough to be given a tag, I will take a fawn. If you tasted one that I've marinated and then roasted over an open fire - you'd do it too.

My only hang-up comes with turkey hunting. In most places I hunt, I will shoot only males when given a choice between the two sexes.

The most important thing to me when hunting is that I fill the freezer. I am quite content to take either a cow elk / doe deer or a young bull elk / buck deer, depending on what tag I have. The guys are right, the females or younger males typically eat better.
In Colorado for elk, they have a point system where you can apply for a prefference point every year. Cow elk tags are in a drawing and you can apply your points to move yourself up the list of applicants. He with the most points comes first. Sometimes there are extra cow tags leftover (in certain areas) and you can get them without using your accumulated points.

[This message has been edited by DaveC (edited 09-18-2001).]

I admit that I am addicted to hunting critters with big antlers. I've had a lot of people tell me that you can't eat antlers. True but you can't hang that meat on the wall either. (actually you can but when the weather gets warm it starts to stink) That being said I usually have at least one sometimes two cow elk in my freezer. It just doesn't get any better than that. If the herd needs thinning i say do it and enjoy the bounty.

I have no problem shooting a doe. During the year I see more does then I do bucks. In fact here in WA. bucks can be rare. Last year was the first time I saw horns in a few years in the area that I hunt. I just wish I could buy the doe tags instead of being drawn-I get one about every four years. So as you can tell, I get skunked a bit. But not for lack of trying. Slim

It depends on the type of animal, the location and the conditions of the hunt.

Some animals are a little difficult to sex. Bears, mountain lions, wolves for example.

I know this is big game but rabbits and quail are not easy to distinguish.

One big problem with shooting trophy male animals is the elimination of the gene pool. In some species shooting off the males can have devastating effects. Elephants for example. And gorillas. It disrupts the herds, disorients the mothers and children and leaves them virtually helpless or causes serious disciplinary problems with the teen agers.

Most hunters have instilled in them that the burning desire is to take a large male, the cream of the crop, and try to ascend to the top of the scoring systems.

Now, in some management areas the new rules, promoted by biologists, is that you must take a doe before you can take a buck. They call it "Earn a buck". You are required to take your doe to a reporting station and then you will be issued a buck permit. If you shoot a buck first the penalty can be severe. Lose hunting privileges for 2 to 5 years.

Kendll Dace

I hunt the male of the speicies by choice, but have no problems with shooting the females, in fact just sending for my 2 extra doe tags this AM. First time in along time will get to shoot 3 deer in ND this season.

I prefer to eat a yearling doe, all else being equal.

Some places there are just too many deer, and the does need to be taken.

Don

Biologically, its necessary to shoot the females. The state of PA has finally realized this, and it will eventually make a big difference in there deer herd. By only taking bucks (and mature ones at that), we severely alter what nature intended.

I've noticed that opinions vary depending on geographical location. Here in East, TN the deer population is no comparison to the numbers in West, TN. People here have the desire to take does but the way the bag limits are set they do not have much opportunity and usually end up taking the first legal deer that comes into range.

I hunt in West Virginia every year. The area that I hunt the buck to doe ratio is probably 1:30 or even worse. Out of a group of 8 hunters my wife and I are the only ones that will harvest does. A lot of the old thinking still exists there.

being 26yrs old when i was coming up it was wrong to shoot does, but here in north carolina the populations are sky rocketing, on my cornpile monday night i had 4 mature does and 5 fawns at once not a hole lot by texas standards but way too many considering i have put out 700lbs of corn in one place since the last week of july, i love filling my freezer, and shooting them with my bow does it with as little noise as possible but busting the older does is the main priority for me, because they will really blow your cover because most of the time when you see a big buck they are worried about two things food and sex, so bust the older ones and you will not have a group of bird dogs pointing you out

In Texas many of the larger ranches are in various levels of the state game management program, where you do a deer census of sorts, and the state biologist then issues you doe and buck tags based on that and other factors.

On my ranch in NE Texas, we have a fair amount of deer, but the buck/doe ratio is still way too high. I have only shot does the last couple of years with the exception of one mature spike that I took out for genetic reasons. I've let some nice 8 and 10 points walk, should have a few good bucks this year, but they don't have the antler size in our area that they do in S Texas. Obviously I have no problem shooting does and if you have a good many deer it is almost a necessity. In the relatively few areas where they are scarce, then shooting does would be counterproductive. It isn't the hunters that hurt the populations, it is development and poachers.

I have no problem taking a doe. If you want more of a challenge, then bow or handgun hunt them. In dome species the female can be as interesting as the male, African Gemsbok fro example have very long horns compared to many of the males.

Does can be trophies too. Last year I started having all the hides soft tanned and plan on doing it with all of them now. They look great thrown over the couch and hanging over the bannister in my A-frame. Wish I had saved them all from day one!

Sniper brings up a good point: make use of those hides regardless. You can normally have a deer skin tanned for around $25USD - if you look for a reasonable tanner. You can also make beautiful buckskin for about $1.50 per hide - if you are willing to take the effort.

In the UK, the doe/hind cull is usually the
hard work of the season...the days are short and the weather is usually bad which makes getting the numbers difficult.

In some respects, the does are often more difficult to stalk than the bucks/stag anyway as you have no distraction from the rut to help.....

Ray. If you need help in culling a few does, I'll be glad to help. Seriously, I have heard that some ranches have hunts to remove excess does and genetically inferior deer like spikes. What can you tell me about something like that. Maybe, if something along those lines is within my price range, I might be able to swing it.
I don't mind hunting does. Being a bit toothless, the antlers hurt my gums.
Paul B.

Paul,
the only culling I've done lately is in Africa on Blesbok, Springbok, and Kudu...

Most of our Texas leases allow the hunter to take 2 bucks and 3 does..The ranch owner manages that by selling one buck per hunter and sometimes a doe..He usually lets friends and relitives shoot the does, and aged spikes I think...

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

If I am hunting for meat (which is usually the case) I prefer to shoot does or cows. The reason being they are much better eating than the buck/bull. I have never removed a fetus from any doe/cow I shot during season. I really find it hard to believe you would here in North America since legal seasons almost always occur during the rut (mating season if you will) and any fetus would exist essentially on a cellular level i.e. not very well developed.

Besides killing females provides superior population control, which helps reduce the number of vehicular accidents involving deer for instance.

Todd E

Thank's Ray. I appreciate the answer. I figured that might be the case.
Paul B.

Todd D

It seems our hunting season is quite a bit longer over here. The rut, for the smaller species of game, occurs about April. This allows for lambing from Sept. through to about Nov. (given an average gestation period of 6 months), which is the beginning of our rainy season � food is therefore plentiful again.

The hunting season also starts around April/May (depending on the province), and continues through to about August/September. So the likelihood of shooting females with fully formed foetuses are very good � especially towards the season�s end.
It still amazes me to see these perfect miniatures of the parents. Sad as it is, it is never the less fascinating, especially to my 6 year old son, who always wants to take one home with him - my wife for some reason doesn�t share his enthusiasm.

Bush baby

This is sounding awfully close to PETA propaganda....

quote:

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Originally posted by Bush baby:
So the likelihood of shooting females with fully formed foetuses are very good � especially towards the season�s end.
It still amazes me to see these perfect miniatures of the parents. Sad as it is...

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In some areas of MI. you can shoot as many does as you want to buy tags for. They used to cost $3 but in the quest for economic gain the DNR raised the fee to $6. I will take a doe over a spike or any small buck for that matter. If I get a real itchy trigger finger and pile them up I'll donate the meat to Sportsman Against Hunger and wright it off my taxes as a charitable contribution. I was fortunate to draw a cow elk tag here and will have no problem in harvesting her as the herd is strictly managed. They eat just fine to.