This is a pic from Leon Lesicka taken near Brawley CA while working for Desert Wildlife Unlimited (DWU). Leon said they were flying a survey of the bighorn sheep when they saw this bobcat attack this ewe. He said they tried to scare off the bobcat with the helo but the bobcat wasn't give up his lunch.





[ 06-23-2003, 03:24: Message edited by: spectr17 ]

Small sheep or one big cat.

I've seen some big Bobcats over the years but nothing in this cat's class!

Awesome shots! But "they tried to scare the cat away with the helo"? Huh? Did I read that right?

These are members of an organization called Desert Wildlife Unlimited? More appropriate perhaps is Interventionist Clowns Unlimited. Unbelievable.

Leighton

lhonda,

Several of our sheep herds are on the brink of disappearng out here in AZ and CA due to the cougars and upper respiratory disease. The situation is so dire that depradation hunters sleep near the sheep and pop any cougars that get within a certain distance.

Leon is a hunter and DWU has put in countless hours working with DFG to keep the guzzlers working and filled. He is over 70 years old and just last week he told me he made his guzzler check run which also is his game camera run to over 20 cameras in the mountains. The run took over 12 hours in some of the bumpiest terrain.

Leon also works with the DFG to do the sheep studies and counts.

The helo Leon was in was a DFG helo and they are just trying to give the sheep a chance to recover. Knowing what I know about the sheep situation I would have done the same.

I won't go into the pheasant and dove work Leon has done in SoCal. That would take several pages of writing.

[ 06-26-2003, 09:24: Message edited by: spectr17 ]

Ah. It would appear I spoke too soon. Still I feel it's a tricky business when man begins to mess with natural life cycles. But per usual, I imagine it's in no small part man's actions that has seen the sheep populations come to where they are now.

Anyway, I recant my earlier statement in light of the facts (if that's indeed what they are). Ignorance at work yet again! Thanks for the enlightenment.

Leighton

[ 06-23-2003, 01:15: Message edited by: lhonda ]

Awsome pictures. That cat had to go 50-60lbs. Our Bobcats only go up to 30.

Not a bobcat. Cougar with an ear job.
s

ihonda,

Just to back up spectre, what he say's is true. The Desert Sheep are having a critical time of it here with a lot of work going into saving them. Normally my response to this would have been the same as your first one was, but in this case the pilot's did the right thing.

And damn, thats a big bobcat!

Cool pics! One big bobcat! You can either have lots of preditors or lots of game. You can't have both!

Hmmm, sheep security officer-- sounds like a great job!

That is a big bobcat.

A friend of mine is the Govt. Hunter with Wildlife Services for ******** County in New Mexico. Two years ago they had two mountain lions going through their big horn sheep herd which your(if you are American) and my tax dollars paid to introduce there. The Federal and the State governments started pissing on each other about jurisdiction and would not let him go in and take out the lions. Over two-thirds of the herd was wiped out. I still get hacked off whenever anyone mentions cats and big horn sheep! Your tax dollars at work.

Bob

LOL Awsome picture i thought it was a caracal with those ear tuft hehe. Never understand hunting to it's fullest if you dont watch the wild hunters and take in what they have to share.

This particular cat is big and I think has alot of experience with killing deer sized game with the way it's killing the ewe.

For people who live east of the Mississippi, Cats of any type are being allowed to kill off a lot of game in the Western USA.

Just because a lot of Yuppies think that "The Lion King" is an accurate example of the animal world. As far as the balance of nature, these Cats are totally disproportionate. They are wiping out lesser animals at an alarming rate, and are actually overextending their range so badly, that when they get near any people populations, their diets change and consist of a lot of domestic pets, poodles & cats.

Then the same people want to re introduct Wolves back into the same area. They don't want a hunter "shooting Bambi" but instead they want to introduce and protect animals that will wipe out the Deer populations.

At Hart Mountain Wildlife Refuge in Oregon, which is for Antelope, the entire offspring for a season was killed, by other animals. Coyotes, hawks and eagles, with I am sure the Bobcats that were around. Where is the animal protection in that. It only gives extinction.

In Northern California, I have seen Bobcats that big, if not bigger. Especially around Goose Lake on the Calif/Oregon border. It just shows how well they are eating in their environments.
Not long ago I saw one that crossed the highway in front of me, and sprinting for the lake shore, that was about the size of a Large Labrador Retriever. I had to slam on the brakes not to hit it. Never saw one anywhere near that size until in the last few years.

Wow what a cat! Just recently saw this pic when i did a search. While i am a sheep lover and hopefully future hunter, i sure wish i had that cat in my trophy room. Hes a pig!

Guys, what is the difference between a Lynx and a Bobcat?? I thought there was a difference, but maybe I'm wrong? The cat on those (fantastic) pictures looks more like a Lynx to me (or what I believed was a Lynx, as opposed to a Bobcat).
- mike

I can't see the pics. Anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks,

Shannon

That is one big pussy.

Forgive an ignorant question, please. But do Bobcats and Lynx ever crossbreed?

MHO, a bobcat and lynx are similar cats that share the same "role" within their respective habitats; the lynx is only found in the Northernmost states of the US and Canada, while the bobcat is found everywhere else. I believe that the only major differences are that the lynx has the large-padded feet, which act as a natural snowshoe, to allow for the lynx to hunt and survive in the snowy northern climes. As to the size differences, I really don't know, but I've seen bobcats in Northern California, where I live, that are the size of a midsize dog. They are a neat animal, that should nevertheless be shot (hunted) whenever they are encountered in the wild, as they really do a number on other animals when they are as populous as they are here.

Craig

Lynx are greyish with a short grey tail, and a black tip. Lynx go to about 40lbs or so. the feet are big, and they have lengthy ear tuffs..

Bobcats are usually spotted. they go about 35lbs , max. They don't have the long ear tuffs like lynx, and they are usually browner, or 'buff.'

Nice pics

Good pictures.

I am fairly certain that picture is of a lamb. Pretty much all ewes have very noticable horns. The desert sheep I have seen are smaller in body than Rocky Mountain bighorns, but proportionaly they have large horns. The sheep in the picture is probably a lamb which changes the perpective on the size of that cat.

quote:

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lhonda: Still I feel it's a tricky business when man begins to mess with natural life cycles.

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Do you mean like hunting them, taking away habitat or trying to help them?
Don't kid yourself. Man has centuries of messing with natural life cycles. It has only been in the last 50 years or so we have actually tried to mess with them in a positive way to attempt to maintain a balance.

My hat goes off to folks like Leon. Tell em to keep up the good work.

I am not trying to be argumentative but it matters to me little about how much this particular individual is putting into this program to keep them safe. They are part of nature and subject to the ups and downs that come with the harshness of survival in the wilderness. It makes no more sense to me to shoot an prowling cougar than it would be to shoot a sheep to help the cougar get an easier meal. If they are on the brink there are probably a lot more reasons than those natural ones and their position on the food chain. We can do what we can but I don't see intervention in the struggle of life as making any sense at all. My two bits worth.

Managment of some form is the only answer (unless getting rid of man is an option). As an example, here in Colorado the first ground that get bought up and developed is typically winter ground for elk and deer. Elk and deer cannot live with grasses, forbes and shrubs that exist in Winter ground. Many of their predators either hibernate or could eat trash in the winter time. Without a predator management policy, there would be no big game hunting.

Sound managment plans are the first line of defense against development and the other ways we have negative impact on animals. If it were as simple as letting all the animals do their thing without any interference, then why have hunting seasons? The fact is, we are the only ones in a position to try and manage it all effectively.

In the example of natural sheep, their biggest threat is not predation - it is disease. The disease comes from domestic sheep and cattle which were brought when the first Europeans showed up. Since domestic sheep and cattle have been introduced to this continent sheep populations had steadily declined until managment practices were put into place and now they tend to be on the upswing. We (man) screwed it up, and it should be up to us to fix it.

No doubt that is a monster of a bobcat! But, I have on occasion run into coyotes that look like dogs, wolves (when I lived in Canada) that looked like bears, etc. One year we were hunting up on the Tetsa river in B.C. and somebody had hit a lynx and broken its back. It was just a bit off of a side road & full of fight! I thought it was a lion for a moment! After we ended its suffering, I picked him up; it must have weighed 90 lbs! Certainly no lighter than by Chesapeake Retriever.

I, too, know Leon personally. He has seen hundreds of desert sheep. I've seen pictures of him handling many on various radio telemetry collaring studies. I've seen more than a few myself. That's a young ewe, but it is an adult. Yes, that a big bobcat. I've only seen one bobcat that might have been a bit larger.
Desert sheep must be intensely managed. If they are, they tend to do well enough. We have choice in this. If you want enough sheep to be able to hunt them, you must intensely manage them. All the states I know of that have enough desert sheep to allow hunting only harvest about 2% of their numbers. They are managed on a throphy/maximum numbers basis. Nevada, for example, has been very agressive in this and the results show. California has also done well much of the time often because of hard working, dedicated people like Leon, and the volunteers of Desert Wildlife Unlimited.
Most of the management work I know of revolves around making sure they have enough water, preventing poaching, and, in a few cases, keeping domestic livestock away from them. E

There is a sidebar in either Outdoor Life or Field & Stream this month that characterizes the challenge of restoring California's Bighorn population which they state as about 250 animals. That to get it to the goal of 500 will take 20 years and several million dollars. I think the price per animal was like 100k. Soooo, when you see that bobcat muncing on that ewe it represents, what a trophy elephant hunt???

I for one am glad to see us trying to save bighorn in our state, God knows we piss away much more money on many ridiculous wasteful political pork barrel projects!