Tell me about .338 Win Mag recoil! Is it such that most people can learn to shoot it well? I would like to eventually incorporate one into my battery of big game rifles, but want to have a pretty good idea of what the recoil will be like before I commit. I don't know anyone that owns one, or else I'd ask to shoot a few groups. While I don't currently own one I have learned to shoot the .300 Mags well, if that gives any indication of my current recoil tolerance. My thought is to get stock pre-64 M70 in .338. So I'm not talking about an ultralight set up.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts.

Bob

I don't know if most people can handle it, but I didn't do too bad. In fact, I found the recoil of my M70 Classic .338 to be more manageable than that of a previous Browning A-bolt II .300 Win Mag. The real recoil is probably greater, but the felt recoil is certainly lighter, probaby due to the heavier rifle. The .338 just doesn't seem as "harsh" as the .300 was.

Bob, I own a .300 Winchester and a .338 Winchester that weigh the same and have the same stock design.

As far as felt recoil goes, the .300 with 180 gr. loads feels about the same as the .338 firing 210 gr. loads. The real difference becomes very apparent when you move up to 250 gr. loads in the .338 - then recoil definitely goes up to the next level.

AD

bobvthunter,

The .338 Win. Mag. is a great cartridge. Recoil is not hard to learn to handle even with heavy 250 grain loads, about the same as a 220 grain heavy load out of a .300 WM. Also you can take the fast bite of the recoil out of the .338 by installing a mercury insert in the stock. They work. I got them in my .340 Weatherby and everything bigger. Lawdog

I find my .338 Tikka with 225 gr bullets to kick less violently than my .300 Wthby Model 700 with 180 gr loads. That could be stock design or recoil pad, but it is my opinion.

less than a three inch slug out of a 12 guage shotgun.

Arty makes a good point. I live in Iowa where we have to hunt deer with a shotgun. Slugs kick more than about anything out there, along with 3inch turkey loads. Yet many of my friends balk at shooting my 338 or 375, saying they have "heard" that "Those things really kick". I don't think either one is as bad as slugs or turkey loads. Felt recoil is dependent on a lot of factors, including stock configuration and the load you are shooting. All in all I don't think the 338 is too bad to shoot. I practice with mine on a regular basis, and have yet to hurt myself. By the way my 338 is a M70. Good shootin'

DGK

bobvthunter, if you can tolerate recoil with a .300 WM, you shouldn't have much problem with a .338. As was mentioned above a 250 gr. bullet moves it up to the next level. If I may make a recommendation I install Pachmayr Decelerators on anything I shoot fromm 7mm-08 to .338. You'll find it a good investment.

The recoil of the 300 mags seems sharper to me ... and frankly a little more unpleasant as a result.

The .338 with anything but the Federal High Energy 250s (at 2850 fps) is pretty reasonable in a rifle with a reasonable weight. My mountain rifle is a pre64 Model 70 with a Krieger barrel, McMillan stock, Leupold QR mounts, and a 2.5-8 Leupold VX III. Weighs just over 8 pounds. Is fine to shoot.

In the field with a set of horns under the cross hairs, you don't notice the recoil at all ;>

Life gets unpleasant at the 340 Weatherby or 416 Rigby level at the bench.

I'd more interested in shooting longer and enjoying myself at the range than trying to impress others with my machismo (stupidity). I use a Past Recoil Pad when shooting off the bench. It doesn't matter whether I'm shooting a .338 Win Mag or 7-08AI. Recoil in the field is hardly ever noticed when shooting off hand. The bench brings out the worst recoil in any rifle, but even the .338 isn't that bad if you use some common sense at the range. Loads with 250gr bullets shove more than the lighter ones, but are still manageable.

What I hate is patterning my turkey gun with 3 1/2" magnums. Necessary, but hardly fun.

You will love a 338, if you shoot 300 win. mag. you should have no problem with a 338. I shot my friends winchester 300 win. with factory 180's and it was definately less recoil than my ruger m77 with handloaded 250's at 2700 but still in the same range. My 338 is my favorite rifle, plenty of power without knocking the stuffing out of you.

I agree with SST 3 1/2" turkey loads are by far more unpleasent than my m77 338. With 180 or 200 gr. bt's it is very shootable.Heavy bullet {225-250}do kick more, but a different kind of kick . Either is not bad to shoot, I'd say get and have fun!!!!

I'ld rather shoot a well stocked .338 than a poorly stocked 06. You'll love the .338, especially for elk size game.

Just my humble two cents worth. I have two Winchester model 70 rifles, one a .300 Win. mag. and the other is the .338 Win. Mag. With bullets of equal weight, 200 gr. Speer handload at 2950 FPS from ,y .300 Win. Mag. and a max 220 gr. load from my .338, it seems to me that the .338 kicks a bit less. Both rifles weigh withing 5 or 6 ounces of each other, with the .300 being the heavier of the two.
Methinks the difference in recoil is due to greater rocket effect in the .300WM. The escaping gases from the muzzle are moving faster from the bore of the .300 than the .338. With 250 gr. bullets, the 338 does kick a bit more, but not all that much more. Both rifles have synthetic stocks and decelerator pads.
Paul B.

get the new model 70 in 338, classic action... the gas control is better.

if you shoot a light 300, the 338 will be nothing...

but then again, i am accused of LISTENING for a 338 going off...

500
jeffe

In my experience the 338 and 8mm mag I have actually recoil a little harder than my Sako 375 H&H (but it's heavier too). I haven't done the math but it seems to me like the recoil speed is faster in this category than the 375 H&H. I think most people can do fine with the 338 if it's setup properly and they don't try too much at once. As mentioned, 250 grainers will get your attention but are still ok as long as the gun isn't super light.

Hi. I have several 338 WM's which I have chosen as my hunting rounds having sold the 340 Weatherby and 340-378 Weatherby. I use a 308 Win for most of my practice thoughout the year then switch to the 338's and light bullet loads in the summer. However, I find that noise control is more importent to me than actual recoil. I use 2 sets of top grade noise control devices while I shoot and it makes a real difference. I use custom fitted ear plugs and Peltor top grade ear muffs. My light 338 loads use 180 Nosler Ballistic Tips at just under 3000 fps which has the same recoil as a 7mm Mag and then switch to the 225 grain bullets at 2850 fps just before I go hunting. I practice at 200 meters using all rifles and keep the hunting rifles sighted in for the 225 hunting load. The 180's shoot to a slightly different POA but I don't care while I am practicing as I shoot strictly for group size. I also practice using a sling in the various positions. If you shoot often and with rifles of increasing amounts of recoil then a 338 (or larger) will not bother you. I actually don't notice the recoil difference between my 308 and 338 light loads as long as I use the 2 sets of ear protection. I do find a huge difference between a 338 WM and the larger cased 338's which is why I dropped down to the 338 WM. Good Luck, Steve

I have absolutly no recoil problem with the .338, it is one of my favorite rifles..It is the scoped rifle on the cape buffalo on my web page...Its a pussy cat...

But, I shoot some really big bore stuff by my standards, not others standards...I shoot the 375, 404, 416 on a regular basis with a scattering of 458 LOtts and 505 and such from time to time.

I did not see this point made above but I have noticed in shooting my 338s and my 300 comparatively:

I believe the 338 does kick more. However it seems to have a slower kick to it than a 300 Mag.
The 338 is a bigger "shove" so to speak, where as the 300 is more like a "jab" to me.

As Yukon ( I believe) indicated, he thinks his 375 kicks less than either. I have shot a 375 and just like the 338, it is a big Shove instead of a kick.

Handloading I have also noticed that different types of powder can give the same velocity as another in any given caliber. However, recoil, perceived or actual seems less, or more drawn out, with one powder over another.

Just my observation, no scientific fact to base it on; but I will frequently load up about 5 or 6 different powders in one caliber with one bullet and then fire them and see if I can feel a difference in recoil. I do this as I load ammo at times for Kids to use, if asked by their parents to have something that kicks less. I and others I have asked to compare, do notice a difference, while the velocities are indentical for all practical tense and purposes.

It seems the general tide is toward saying the kick is not significant. I'll agree, with a reservation.

I have a Browning A-Bolt II in .338 WM, and I love it. I can easily shoot 40 rounds in a session with 64 grains of IMR 4350 and 250 gr. bullets.

I was warned about the kick before I bought the gun, so right out of the box I took it to a gunsmith and had it fitted with a Pachmyer Decellerator recoil pad. I decided to wait with a muzzle brake until I found out what the gun was like without one. As has been noted, these puppies are loud.

Well, I was fine without the brake, and that's how it stands. I can keep shots within two inches of each other at 200 meters when the barrel's warm. I still can't get around that first, cold-barrel shot going to the right, and that's really the only one that counts for me. But that's another story.

Now the reservation: I was talking up my gun and how little it kicks to my hunting buddy, who shoots a 7 mm Rem. Mag. So one day at the range, he asked to shoot it.

That was enough. Now, two years later, he wants nothing to do with the gun. Period.

What was the problem? I can't say. Maybe he was holding it wrong. He is quite a bit smaller than I am, so that may be it.... Who knows?

But the fact is, some people (like everybody here) are fine with the round. But there are others, and some pretty accomplished hunters, too, that simply hate it.

Maybe the best option is you're wondering is to find a used one for sale, try it out, and then decide. Guns, like people, are individuals.

kk

I am one of those guys that had to train himself to handle recoil. My first Magnum was a 7mm Rem mag and I could not shoot it well at all. When I started shooting Black Powder (A LOT). I got used to recoil. It's not hard, you just have to spend time behind the gun, and most people don't do it enough.
I shoot a .338 now and it's No big deal. I shoot 200gr loads for deer, and they feel about like a 30-06 with 180gr loads in a lighter rifle. Again, no biggie.
I have shot some 225gr Hornady Heavy Magnums, and they will losen up the fillings in your teeth!
So just hold on and enjoy the ride.

[ 08-08-2003, 19:56: Message edited by: Mark G ]

The recoil is not that bad. I think it is barely more than the 300 win mag with most bullets.

I got my first 338 when I was 15 (a ruger 77) . Shot a moose with it that year and moose and a sheep with it the next year.
A buddy of mine who is the same age as I am got his first 338 a couple of months before I did and he still hunts with his.( S&W 1500 )

I found barnes X bullets didn't seem to have as much recoil as heavy lead core bullets. I shot 210 and 250 noslers and 225 hornadys in that first rifle . I bought another ruger 338 when I was 23 and shot some 275 speer handloads in it and they definatly kicked more than the 200 grain ballistic tips or 175 x or 250 x bullets I also loaded for the same rifle.

I don't know the math, but the amount (weight) of the powder has more effect on recoil than bullet weight. I do know that in my .338 shooting 200gr. BTs that the 73gr IMR4350 load recoils more than the 65gr RE15 load with near equal velocities.

"Recoil Velocity" makes all the difference. A hot loaded .300 hits you hard and fast, like a karate chop. The .338 and .375 hits somewhat harder but slower .. like a punch. I shoot a .375 just as well as a .300 Magnum and find its' "type" of recoil less bothersome. Go up to a .378 and you've got the best of both worlds, heavy and fast, which is why so many are in awe of it.

I have a .300 H&H M70 and a .338WM on a Springfield. It's hard to tell the difference between the two. I shoot 200grn Noslers out of my .300 and 250's out of my .338.

JLHeard - That's because there isn't a great difference. When I plug in the numbers for my 180 grain .300 Weatherby load and do the same with my 250 grain .338 load they calculate to:

Recoil Energy - .300 - 36.49 / .338 - 36.40
Recoil Velocity - .300 - 16.36 / .338 - 16.34
Recoil Impulse - .300 - 4.46 / .338 - 4.46

Sure, such calculations vary with charge weight and often fail to capture the recoil perception of the individual but they do serve to indicate how the higher velocities of the various .300's can bring up those numbers.

Thanks for the info Nick. I guess it shows that the similar feeling from the recoil isn't all in my head.

I have a 300 win mag and a 338 win mag in Browning A bolts. I think the recoil isn't much different except that the 300 seem quicker. I'm shooting 180's out of the 300 and 225 partitions out of the 338. The 338 is shooting in an inch at 100. I'm still working with the 300.

Bob257

Seems like most .338 winnies are chambered in light weight type rifles like you would get a .270 in. They should weigh alittle more just like the .375s are built into.

Correct. With a Lothar Walther # 1450 bbl.+ a Hogue Overmolded stock, my .338 Win Win 70 now weights 10.8 lbs. and recoil is about comfortable. Max 250 gn loads feel like .300 Win.

Recoil is a very personal thing...one guy will say the .338 has a nasty kick and another will say something else.

I have both a .338 Win Mag and a .375 H&H mag. As far as I'm concerned they both recoil the same.

As long as I see it that way, I no longer have need of the .338 Mag...I'll use the .375 H&H.

Both of these guns are all I want to shoot and I'm 6-1 and 230 pounds.

Nick, those numbers are revealing. The one thing recoil calculations never take into account is stock design, yet stock design has so much to do with felt recoil that it should never be ignored or underestimated.

Since you introduced .300 WBY. numbers, I can't help but think about some of the early, German-built, Monte carlo-stocked .300 WBY. Mark V rifles I've fired over the years. Talk about felt recoil - those rifles really jab and slap you! Lots of back-shove!

Take the same ammunition and fire it in a .300 WBY. that weighs the same, but is stocked in the America Classic style with a high, straight comb and the difference in felt recoil is like the difference between night and day.

AD

100% Allen. In regard to felt recoil, stock design and fit can take one a long way ... in either direction! I've fired just a few of the early German .300 Weatherbys and recall checking to see if someone had hidden a tomahawk in the pad. Another I recall was the early Ruger .300's had a too short LOP ... nasty. Just as an aside, and I could be all wet in saying so, but more than once I've thought that some of the synthetics seemed to damper recoil.

[ 09-06-2003, 02:08: Message edited by: Nickudu ]

I am a believer in proper stock design. One of the rudest recoil experiences of my life was a Win. 70 pushfeed in .338, one of the best was a Shilen .338 Win with a McMillan stock, 8 lbs sans scope. That one bothers me less than my Win 94 Trapper in 30-30, though the noise is refreshing. Also have an old Belgian Cape Gun in 12 Ga./.405 Wichester. A bit over 7 lbs and a pussy cat. For those not familiar with the .405, it generates the same energy levels as the .338 Win. I'm 6'2", 225 lbs., shoot a lot of clays and a fair amount of rifle. Couple of days at the skeet line a week, even with mild loads will increase your tolerance for recoil quite a bit.

A friend has a Marlin Cowboy Gun in 45-70 and paper patches 510 gr bullet, launches them at 1600 fps +/-. Bad design for moderating recoil and a stout load to boot. Doesn't hurt but you know you pulled the trigger for sure.

You fellas that complain about the pleasure of a 3.5" 12 Ga....there's a better solution. 2.75" and get a bit closer. Geez guys, they're not armour plated! Never met a turkey couldn't be had with a 2.75" 12 or 16 Ga #5 shot. Beware of salesmen selling something that cures a non-existant problem.

[ 09-07-2003, 01:55: Message edited by: DigitalDan ]