I want to help my brother get into hunting and need to provide him with some choices for a hunting bolt action centerfire gun and scope. Let me kinda give some criteria: 1. Cost is a factor 2. bolt action 3. Used primarily and in Texas 4. Will need to use for everything. 5. Would prefer to buy new vs. used. Don't have much experience determining worn out or project guns. I think that about covers the requirements, any and all help is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Assuming that he is not new to shooting, I don't think that anyone could go wrong with a 30-06 as an all around lower 48 rifle. You can buy a rifle chambered in 06 in every combination of maker, stock, and finish that you can think of so one of them must fit your budget (new or used). Factory ammo is available literally everywhere from Walmart and the corner store to custom shops and in a billion combinations to cover everything from long range prarie dogs to up close bear. If he has never hunted then get a .22LR single shot and work up from there.

I did forget to give some background on my brother. He is 6'5" and all bull moose. He isn't new to shooting, just doesn't own is own rig and wanted some advice on gear.

As a rule, I would hit your local Wal-Mart. My licensed gun dealer buddies hate them. Sometimes they sell guns for less than their cost.
I believe Savage would be the best bang for the buck. I would prefer a Ruger stainless, but a Savage will do. Don't buy a rifle and scope combo. Instead, log on to samplelist.com and look for a good fixed 4X. I much prefer Leupold, with the new Weaver's 2nd choice. Buy a good, all steel mount from somebody. Again, I prefer Leupold's, but others have good mounts too.
I much prefer the .308 Winchester round to the 30'06. I've used both for years. With the newer bullet styles, there is no difference in effectiveness. But, the .308 has lots of cheap practice ammo available for it, unlike the '06.
I'd go further and have the trigger on whatever you buy reworked by a good smith. Nothing contributes to good shooting like a good trigger, and lots of practice. E

Thanks MSSGN and EREMICUS.

I didn't mean to be as clear as muddy water about the gun/scope combo, I did mean to get a rifle and a scope. I do like the idea of saving on the scope and spend it on the rifle.

Let me provide more mud to the water. Lets say you could spend up to $1200 and maybe more with sound reasoning. What would you get. And lets say in Remington/Winchester/Ruger/Weatherby for rilfe manufactures and what cartrige and what scope. He is looking at 270 Win. 308 Win. 7mm-08 and 7mm Rem Mag. right now, but will consider anything within reason.

I would say get a Win.mod.70 in 300winny, that is all the gun he will ever need to hunt most places. I use a 300 winny for everthing I haveever done or needed. You can relaod it with 110grs to 220grs for P-dogs to moose and even somefo the bears. Wal-Mart is a good place to start but depending on where you are in Texas some of the Gun shop around the Austin Area have great deals on used and new guns. But buy one with out a Scope is a good idea.

Hope this helped, and get him to a range as soon as possible.

Doc in Texas

All good suggestions for sure, but I noticed one thing that might be important.
If your brother is 6'5", he might need a bit of extension on his stock to get his length of pull the right distance. Whatever you buy, take it to a gunsmith and have him measured for LOP and see if a good pad will add enough to bring it up to his size. Most rifles come with about 13 5/8" LOP, sounds like your brother might need about 14 1/2" or so.
While at the gunsmith's shop, have him do a good trigger adjustment- then go out and do some shooting- lots of shooting.- Sheister

tlfw Take your Brother to a gunstore with a large selection. Have him buy a 30-06 in the rifle of his choice. I recommend a 2.5x8 Leupold scope, not too big but with enough of a power range to work up close and far. If/when He goes to hunt Elk, Moose, or Bear have him use Federal High Energy and have almost 300Mag. performance.

With $1200.00 to spend you can cover your needs with any of the brands and calibers you asked about. It is sort of like "Fords" and "Chevys", what you have is best but really any that you listed are good solid brands, and calibers, that back their products. When you spend that money try to keep it as close to 50/50 rifle/scope. Your brother will never regret the money spent on a good quality scope. Most of those on the market will "do" but a good piece of glass is like a good horse once you've had one you won't take anything less. Wal-mart if you have one will beat anything, price wise, that 99.9% of your local gunshops can sell. Don't expect to get good advice but the price will be bottom dollar.

Look at both Remington Model 700 and Winchester Model 70 offerings. Both are great guns.

Looking backwards I'd say the .270 Win., 30.06, 7mm Mag., or .300 Win. Mag. would be the most versatile. I'd lean towards the .300 Win. Mag. if you thought he might step up to elk or other big game (Canada or Africa plains Game) at some point.

Looking forward, I like the new fat-mags. My latest purchase was a 300 Winchester Short Magnum. I bought the Browning. You can get it in the Winchester. (Remington makes their own version, 300 Short Action Ultra Mag.)

The other interesting fat-mags are the 7mm WSM and the .270 WSM.

Have fun making up your mind. There have never been more great choices.

Forgot about the scope. Look at Leupold. Pick a variable. 3x9 is the standard. Go higher magnification if you are going to do a lot of long-range sniping at deer, pronghorn or varmits.

Get him a .308, 270 or 30/06. Don't get him a magnum anything. Total waste in Texas. Just a lota extra boom and recoil for nothing.

Ruger or Winchester or Remington. See what feels best to him.

All good things to ponder. Fortunately for me I don't have to make any choice, he does. I am trying to let him find what caliber and manufature turns him on. The more opinions he can read and guide him in this decision process I feel the better. I am not going to pick for him, this is his and he will enjoy it for a long time to come especially because it was his decision.

Thanks all.

Hmmm.... Not a single vote for a 45-70 Lever action?

This might sound like a broken record, but I recommend a bolt action 30-06 from Ruger, Winchester, Remington, Browning, or even Tikka, Sako, etc. I really like the 308 Win, but for hunting, I think that you're better off with an 06 because you can launch the heavier pills faster when you need them. In my opinion, even 180s seem to be too heavy for the 308.

Top it with a 2-7 Leupold VX-1 or a 2.5-8 Leupold Vari-XIII (my choice), in steel mounts (one reason I like Ruger is because of their integral Scope mounting system), grab some 150-180 gr ammo, and do a lot of practicing. I like the 50/50 rule on the cost of the rifle/scope as a good "balance".

Best regards, Bill

Wow! $1200 puts you in the range of a rifle with a high "fondle factor". You could get a Sauer 202 for that, with money left over for a scope.

As far as caliber, no need to look beyond the 308. It'll take everything in Texas, including Nilgai, if you use a decent bullet. Other good choices would be the 7-08, and the 260.

As far as optics, DO NOT SKIMP ON OPTICS, and BUY ONLY THE BEST RINGS AND BASES. Leupold, Burris, Weaver Grand Slam, and Nikon scopes are all well within your budget. Don't feel you are doing anything wrong if you spend the same amount on optics as on the rifle. HTH, Dutch.

I would choose a M-70 Featherweight in 30/06 and a Leupold 2X7 or 3X9. But he may prefer a SS rifle and plastic stock. Both are available.

I see inexpensive 30/06 ammo for sale.

Hi TLFW:

Here's another vote for moderation. For Texas game, you absolutely don't need a boomer. A std. cal. is perfect. Remember that recoil tolerance is not a factor of physical size. A mild kicker will always be easier to shoot well whether you are 5'5" or 6'5"

Twere me, I'd toss a coin between the 3 old standbys; 270, 308, '06 (for Texas, I'd buy a .270) and then get a nice scope. DON'T SAVE MONEY ON THE SCOPE!!!!

I think the new versions of the Leo Vari-XII are a great value and will leave lots of money left over for whatever rifle feels the best (to him) and a whole boatload of ammo.

One word of caution, the base model "synthetic" stocks from all the majors are really just plastic and are not especially light nor are they very rigid. A nice rifle to look at might be a Remington 700 Laminated Stainless. Just as weather resistant as plastic but a lot more rigid, hence probably better accuracy potential.

Jim

I did much of what you brother is looking to do and the advice on Savage is pretty sound. Great shooters. I bought one in .308(mainly to be different and I really like that cartridge). If I had to do it over again I might look at a Savage in either 7mm Rem or .300 Win. I think .300 win or .300WSM would get the nod as it can be loaded down to .30-06 and .308 specs if you, he or someone you know reloads.And since I like short actions it would most likely be WSM. Take a peak at BEARBASIN.COM, Natchezss.com, and Midwayusa.com for scope prices. Natchez has a refurbished scope section that can save you lots of money and get you into a better scope than you thought you could afford and it comes with lifetime factory warranty if the factory offered one originally(like Burris and Leupold.) I like burris scopes quite a bit and a good 4x or 2-7x compact may be just the ticket.

Here are some of the good place to get scope.

http://www.swfa.com/riflescopes/
http://www.bearbasin.com/catalog.htm
http://www.samplelist.com/

I have had great luck with these guys and never had to return a scope yet,and the prices are good but shop around between the 3 of them.

Hope this help with the scope part of your deal.

Doc in Texas

This may seem like treason but buying a rifle is like buying a car or building a house. You'll almost never get it right the first time. Unless he has a lot of experience with barrowed rifles or a strong preference for one design over another I'd say spend no more than $600 on the rifle (even $300 on a used one) because he will upgrade after learning what fits him best....

If he goes with a Leupold may just never buy another scope though....

I'd take him to a gun shop and let him shoulder them to see how they feel to him. Once he selects the rifle have him get it in either 308 or 30-06. Buy a 6 X 42 leupold scope from on of the above on line dealers.

Boy, lots of good info. Thanks guys. My brother does know of someone that reloads...Me. And I will for him if he wants, heck he may start himself. But if our shotgun shells are any indication...he has no interest in it yet, but he will let me do all the work.

Also I feel that buying a used scope, one could get alot for the same money vs. a new one. Also I feel with the companies mentioned will be good products. I have purchased my binoculars from SWFA...used. Not as scary as buying some other guys used gun. Don't know the real reason for him selling it, may not hit broad side of a barn.

I would recomand a tikka in 308 if you can get a good price on one. Don't save your money on the scope and mount! Get a proper, well known scope with a good reputation. May be not a Zeiss or a top Leopold or some cheap Tasco or Bushnell. Get some thing in the midle. Stay away from American made cheap guns. I bought a rem 700 ADL synt and is is not much of a gun. A CZ, Hova or Tikka would be better.

Johan

For $1200

Winchester m70 classic, trigger job, Leupold QR mounts and a zeiss 3x9 conquest... For caliber, I would think something in 30 caliber would be your best choice. Depending on what he may want to hunt later, maybe a 300 win mag would give him a little extra umph on larger game like elk, but if only texas hunting a 30-06 would be fine...