Ignore the quality, the video was shot by my brother and edited by my 10 yr old. This is me shooting a Mule Deer in, I believe, 2008 with a 280 AI and 140 TTSX at 390 yds. The shot is higher than I would have liked but went through both lungs. He was hit once. The second shot was a hail mary at an unknown distance. The hole through him says the bullet expanded, but damage to the lungs was minimal. What does it mean? I'm not sure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tcs4w6VArIg

I have shot fallow deer with my 280 AI Imp at up to around 330 meters but I used 160 gr Accubond.

The video shows a clear hit just behind the shoulder a bit high but still in the main lung area. I would expect the bullet to exit a little lower..

Without any pictures of the inside damage, my guess is that firstly the 140 gr TSX would have lost velocity & therefore it would have expanded less than at higher velocity. Secondly it did not hit a rib but went between ribs and so there was no shock transfer to the spine or any bone fragments destroying the lungs.

Nice deer and good shooting.

Looks good is good. Guessing the velocity to be about 2350 at that range so I wouldn't expect a dramatic hit reaction.

As far as he went hit like that IMHO the bullet performance was very poor and it couldn't have expanded very much whether it hit ribs or not. Deer can take a pretty good hit if a bullet doesn't expand properly and zips right on through an animal. A friend of my Dad shot a rutting whitetail and the buck just flinched and kept right on chasing a hot doe around his south Texas tower stand. Every time he stopped the guy shot and after five he was out of rounds and didn't have any more with him. Another guy on the lease was watching from another tower stand, went over and up the ladder to let the guy use his gun. One shot from it and the buck was down for the count. When they dressed the buck out he had six holes in him and the five the guy had shot with his gun were all through the lungs and none had expanded at all. It turned out they were some hot loads a guy had reloaded for him and they were just too dang fast they didn't open up so that it was like that buck was just getting stung by a bee. He would have died, but it would have taken him quite a while to bleed out and could have been lost down in that heavy south Texas brush country.

Although it makes for a good story too much velocity will not cause a bullet to zip through.

It might tear the front end off a partition or x bullet leaving a small exit. But the faster a bullet goes the quicker it will expand.

The elk I shot this year with a 175 XLR had a quarter sized hole through him and barely bled with minimal lung damage besides the hole. He went over 100 yards.

quote:

Originally posted by RMiller:
Although it makes for a good story too much velocity will not cause a bullet to zip through.

It might tear the front end off a partition or x bullet leaving a small exit. But the faster a bullet goes the quicker it will expand.

The elk I shot this year with a 175 XLR had a quarter sized hole through him and barely bled with minimal lung damage besides the hole. He went over 100 yards.

Baloney, and it wasn't a "good story"!!! You obviously have never heard of the old saying to "use the proper bullet for the animal it's intended for". A bonded bullet is designed for deep penetration before expansion and shot at a smaller thin skinned animal than it's not designed for will certainly do exactly what I stated, especially a handload with a high velocity like those I mentioned!

I am not saying it didn't happen. Its just that a bullet can't zip through and not open from going to fast.

If you want to believe that go ahead I have found that guys that do believe that can happen are pretty set in thier thinking.

What really happens is that a bullet than can handle the speed like a partition or x bullet loses the front half of the bullet and leaves a small exit giving the appearance of no expansion due to the small exit hole.

This has been talked about on here for years.

Not trying to demean your post I just don't want a newbie to be misled into thinking more velocity can cause a bullet to not rexpand because it just isn't so.

If the bullet was too tough for the game it was used on then the higher velocity would only help to bring about expansion. It would be an aid not a detriment.

quote:

Originally posted by RMiller:
I am not saying it didn't happen. Its just that a bullet can't zip through and not open from going to fast.

If you want to believe that go ahead I have found that guys that do believe that can happen are pretty set in thier thinking.

What really happens is that a bullet than can handle the speed like a partition or x bullet loses the front half of the bullet and leaves a small exit giving the appearance of no expansion due to the small exit hole.

This has been talked about on here for years.

Not trying to demean your post I just don't want a newbie to be misled into thinking more velocity can cause a bullet to not rexpand because it just isn't so.

If the bullet was too tough for the game it was used on then the higher velocity would only help to bring about expansion. It would be an aid not a detriment.

You are actually saying essentially the same thing I am in the first part of your post. If there is a small entry, as well as a small exit hole, especially without the bullet hitting bone to shock the animal, the bullet has not done what it was intended to do on the animal. Therefore, it will not usually cause a quick death as it would have if the bullet had spent the majority of it's energy inside the animal. If there is no bullet to recover there is, therefore, no way of knowing whether it opened up any or did what you stated. However, I'll have to say that your last sentence is incorrect and just maybe you need to read up on how a bonded bullet is designed so that it doesn't expand quickly and why they are normally used on big game and not antelope and other small critters, etc. Why do you think your elk went as far as it did with that pass through where there was so little expansion and lung damage if there was only a hole the size of a quarter?! Using the proper bullets I've never seen an elk take more than a step or two before they're down for the count when shot through the lungs by myself or friends out in Wyoming where I hunt every year. Some of those have been complete pass throughs and some bullets were found on the far side of the animal opposite the entry wound and they all showed proper expansion that got the job done with all the energy spent inside the animal.

It was a good shot and killed the deer.The bullet did exactly what it was supposed to do.Me,I would rather use 140 grain ballistic tips or accubonds.Thats what I used in my 280AI and all deer shot were bang flops.I like to put them in the shoulder.Longest shot I took was 400 yards give or take.

On my elk the wound channel tells me the bullet opened quick and went right on through. The fact that it went so far tells me elk are tough.

quote:

Originally posted by RMiller:
On my elk the wound channel tells me the bullet opened quick and went right on through. The fact that it went so far tells me elk are tough.

I have no idea how you can say that if it went clear through and only left a quarter size hole without doing much damage to the lungs! Would you mind saying what your experience is with ballistics and how many big games animals you've shot to be making the statements you are? Yes, elk are tough! Was that the first one you've killed? I would think not if you've lived in Montana any length of time and hunt very much. IMHO you want an elk down right where you shoot it with the places they can get to if they go even 100 yards. The 6x6 a friend shot this year in Wyoming that I helped pack out took a heavy Berger bullet from a 300 Win Mag at 590 yards quartering away slightly and never moved one body length after the hit up through the lungs! That is what will happen with the proper bullet put in the proper place a good share of the time. I don't like long shots like that, but the kid that did it has a Nightforce scope, reloads his own ammo, and practices out to 900 yards such that with no breeze he can hit a basketball 9 out of 10 times. There was no breeze that evening and the 590 yard shot was a chip shot for him, but I don't care for this long range craze that we're in now!

I have probaby forgotten more ballistic trivia than most people ever learn. How many big game head have I shot? I think I was at 40 five years ago before I moved to Montana which would put it around 60 now.

This was my third elk all bulls. The size of the hole looked like the bullet expanded all the way but I only have one recovered X bullet to judge that on. Almost all the x bullets exit. The one I did recover I guess Ill have to see what it does compare to in size to a quarter. It does look like a match in size to the hole through that elk though.

A high lung shot is letal but it leaves very little blood trail as the blood is puddling inside the deer. He is actually drowning and can go a loooong ways before he realizes he is dead.