If you were only in the "think stuff' and never have a chance for a longer shot, I like the 416s, ( the Taylor's my favorite) but the 375H&H is IT if you want a "one gun do it all" rifle. (of course a 458 would be even better if you "never left the thick stuff"..) I have only fired a 375 Ultra mag once, and a 378 Weatherby a few times. They have truly evil recoil, and I can't see any way they could kill better than a 416,or the 458, and I don't think the "range advantage" over the H&H is a real consideration, in the real world. So, speaking strictly for myself,,, I'd skip the ultra mag.
Back in the mid-70's, I loaned my Win push feed 458 WinMag to my hunting partner's dad to go Kodiak Bear hunting. He shot the critter at around 200 yds. or so. I had put a 3X9 scope on it and he dialed it up all the way. His bear was 9' and change. My vote would be anything big that you can shoot comfortably.
I took my 91/2 ft. Brown Bear near Cold Bay with a .300 Win mag with 200 grain Nosler Partitions at 2900 fps. That experience was a clean one shot kill but the aftermath with additional Bears extremely close and the experiences of family and friends with Bears convinced me to pack a .340 Wby with a 250 grain Nosler Partition Gold bullet at 2900 fps my next trip to Bear country. I now pack a .358 STA and use 270 grain North Fork bullets at 2900 fps as my primary Alaska round in Bear country and consider it better than the .375 H&H. I wouldn't hesitate to take my .416 Rem or Rigby if I were hunting Bear alone. Shoot the largest round you can handle instinctively from all shooting positions. Good shooting.
Posts: 221 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: 19 December 2003
I have a brown bear/blackbear combo hunt coming up, and I'll be taking a custom Model 70 with a McMillan stock in .416 Remington instead of my .375 H&H. For me, the .416 Remington is a double-duty rifle: Good for coastal Alaskan bears, and superb in Africa for buffalo, etc.
Lots of cartridges have worked for brown bear. The various .300 magnums have worked time and again on big bears. The .375 H&H is an all-time classic, as is the .338 Win. Mag. The .375 Ultra Mag., .375 Weatherby, and .378 Weatherby cartridges should be fantastic. I don't think there is any one best choice, but I do believe on erring on the big side rather than the small........
For mountain grizzly, I've used the .375 H&H with great results, but I like a lighter rifle and lighter ammunition for interior grizzly hunting in the mountains, so the next time I go, I'll be packing a .338 Win. Mag. loaded with 250 gr. Noslers at 2700 fps...
After many years working both as a crew supervisor and alone for months on end in the most isolated wilderness areas of B.C. and Alberta, some of the time up on the Alaska-B.C. border, I have had quite a number of bear encounters. I have also known people who were mauled by Grizzlies and have been "in at the death" of a few bears.
The most critical aspect of any rifle used for shooting bears is that you can handle it quickly as you may need a second or even a third shot. The felt recoil is a very important factor in this and many large, strong people are very recoil-sensitive and should choose their rifles accordingly. To be "macho" is, I think, to be stupid and doing so just marks one as an irresponsible hunter.
I carry and use rifles in .338 Win. for all of my hunting in bear country during the pre-hibernation part of the season as I usually hunt solo and backpack my meat out; I also use a drilling in 9.3x74x12 ga., with Nos. Pts.. For protection purposes, I prefer a .375 H&H with Nosler or Swift A-Frames and I think that this is about the best choice for actually hunting big bears.
I do not own a .416 although I have shot them, I find that I am slower to recover from recoil and thus do not use them. I certainly respect the opinions of those who do, but, since I have no interest in Africa, I am not going to get one. A good .375 that holds 5 rounds total is, IMO, about perfect for this task.
I'm booked with Jimmy Rosenbruch for 2006. He's booked up until then, but is there's a cancellation, we might get in next year. I hope!
Anyhow, I have my .416 Remington going with 400 gr. Swift A-Frames. I have a "fast" barrel, so I get close to 2450 fps. with that bullet. I shot a huge black bear with Rosenbruch on Kuiu Island in 2002 with the same ammo I'm currently shooting. Of course, even a big black bear isn't much of a test for a .416, but nevertheless the kill was instantaneous, and I didn't see any evidence that I was shooting too heavy a bullet or that there were problems with expansion.
There was an article in Gun Gigest a few years ago written by Ray Ordorica and Andy Runyan about loading the .416 Remington for big Alaskan bears. It was an excellent piece. They were of the conviction that they liked bullets lighter than 400 grs. best for brown bear (quickest kills), and they were big on the 350 gr. Swift A-Frame. I might work with this one myself before I commit to the 400 gr. load for that hunt.
Gentlemen ----- You need to take a look at the .416 370 grain North Fork bullet. I am shooting it in my Remington and Rigby, it is an awesome bullet. Good shooting.
Posts: 221 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: 19 December 2003
I'm glad you brought this bullet to my attention. That just might be the ideal .416 Bullet for big bears, and I doubt that it would do a buffalo any good, either.
I have some 225 gr. and 240 gr. Northforks to work with in my .338 Win. Mag. once the weather gets better, so I might as well order some Northforks to try in the .416 as well!
I have a 416 Rem that will shoot a 400 gr bullet flat to 150 yds then drops 6" at 200 yds. My 375 H&H shoots 270 gr bullet at 200 yds with only a 2.5" rise at 100 yds. I'd take the 375 H&H.
Posts: 2209 | Location: Delaware | Registered: 20 December 2002
...both dropped after being hit with a 370gr North Fork bullet. Granted the brown bear, while not at all big, had already taken one 338 Win Mag round and was still standing at the time he was hit with the North Fork.
Here's the bullets, starting with the black bear, then the brown...
Both were shot from my 416 Taylor.
Posts: 778 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 23 May 2002
I had a similar question as Allen. Those bullets look like they would give good penetration.
In talking with someone at NorthFork they seemed to elude that their bullets aren't meant to achieve as much penetration as I thought I would like. But as Allen has said, they look great and appear to me to look like they would want to outpenetrate an A-Frame. Their supposed to shoot like gangbusters as well.
Posts: 2659 | Location: Southwestern Alberta | Registered: 08 March 2003
Yes, both were found just under the hide on the far side. The black bear was a 170 yard shot, broadside, through both shoulders. The brown bear was only 70 yards, through the front right shoulder, angling back ending up near the left rear leg.
I wouldn't mind a exit hole personally. But each time these bullets dropped the bear 'right now'. The one thing to remember is that my 416 Taylor is a bit slower than most Taylors (2300ish fps) and a Remington or Rigby may push these fast enough to make reliable exit holes.
The accuracy has been outstanding.
Posts: 778 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 23 May 2002
I have been wondering what are the fps people are getting with the northfork 416 370 grain. I will be getting my 416 rigby in a few months.I also wonder on the penetration of these bullets due to the wide frontal expansion.I like penetration as much as possible from bullets in general.I have also seen no reloading date or very little on the NF 370 in a 416 rigby. I would think 2600fps would be a attainable figure with a 370 grain, Thanks,Kev
Posts: 1002 | Location: ALASKA, USA | Registered: 22 May 2002
I mentioned it above (I think) that I get from 2300-2400fps from my 416 Taylor. I only recently discovered that H4895 would get me to 2400fps. Again, that's with a 370gr NF, not the usual 400gr benchmark bullet.
BTW, how's your Alaska move plan going? I recently sold my old boat and bought this one...
...it'a little drop bow, like we discussed before. It's a locally made boat, not a Packman.
Posts: 778 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 23 May 2002
BW, that looks just like a packman, how is it pulling on shore. I am going to the SE this August and look around, I think I can rap up everthing and by the end of the year be there God willing.You could have used that boat for that big bear you shot, load it up front and go. Kev
Posts: 1002 | Location: ALASKA, USA | Registered: 22 May 2002
