This is from the African hunting forum but it affects us all........

Time to start writing your representatives!

The whole thread: http://forums.accuratereloadin...043/m/4241073902/p/1

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Besides 4457's, it seems that in April new requirements will go into force when you travel from the U.S. with firearms and ammunition. With less than 3 firearms or 1,000 rounds of ammunition, there is an export license exception, but you will now be required to file electronic export information.

There is an online quizz that you can take to help you determine whether an export license or an exemption applies.

See: https://www.ice.gov/exec/ice-gov/cpiquiz.htm

And, here are some FAQ's that should shed more light on the topic:

https://www.ice.gov/cpi/faq

Unless one travels abroad with guns, it has no effect on our US ability to keep and bear arms, as I see it. After all, it is a US constitution, not an international constitution.

I agree that it is total bullshit for international travelers. BTW, this has actually been law for a while but never enforced. Title 22 CFR 123.17 has not been amended since July 8, 2013. That is actually when this was changed.

Larry we either all stand together or "fall" apart!

What will it be next? Will we have to "register" when we cross state lines? County lines?

Make no mistake this is a FIREARMS REGISTRY! Back channel or not! Unlike NICS there is no requirement that the FEDS purge records after compliance.

I have never once, ever, shot "Green tip" 5.56 ammo, but do you think the ATF would have stopped there?

We must all get involved. Write Senators, because ITAR "the United Nations Arms Treaty" is what is behind this, and the SENATE have NOT signed that treaty. Yet Obama is by fiat enforcing one of it's provisions on us. What will be next?


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quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:
Larry we either all stand together or "fall" apart!

What will it be next? Will we have to "register" when we cross state lines? County lines?

Make no mistake this is a FIREARMS REGISTRY! Back channel or not! Unlike NICS there is no requirement that the FEDS purge records after compliance.

I have never once, ever, shot "Green tip" 5.56 ammo, but do you think the ATF would have stopped there?

We must all get involved. Write Senators, because ITAR "the United Nations Arms Treaty" is what is behind this, and the SENATE have NOT signed that treaty. Yet Obama is by fiat enforcing one of it's provisions on us. What will be next?


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I agree JTEX. It's time for that "it doesn't affect me" BS mentality to go away. If it doesn't affect you now, just stand around and do nothing and see what that gets you. I've written all the appropriate people/places I can think of as well, and urge every gun owner to do the same.

Didn't say it wasn't BS, in fact I said it was if you learn to read. But what I did say is that not every issue makes the sky falling. It was done in 2013.

And we all stand together until someone disagrees with you, right.

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And we all stand together until someone disagrees with you, right.

I don't know about the 2nd ammendment stuff Larry? I think we all need to put our petty differences aside on ANYTHING to do with more nonsense from the leftist gun control creeps on this.


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Originally posted by larrys:
Didn't say it wasn't BS, in fact I said it was if you learn to read. But what I did say is that not every issue makes the sky falling. It was done in 2013.

And we all stand together until someone disagrees with you, right.

Lighten up there with the personal insults jayhawker. We don't need another internet tough guy mouthing off. I wasn't necessarily talking to you anyway. We do need to stand united, and this is potentially a helluva big deal.

Thanks internet police. JTEX and I are good as far as I know. Hell, I'd have a Shiner with him any day, and I don't even drink that much.

Yep. We're good. A Lone Star would be better though

Seriously though, we got to give up on the pettiness between ourselves and stand together on all hunting, shooting and 2nd Ammendment issues.

We ARE the good guys! I know ya'll think the same!


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Seriously though, we got to give up on the pettiness between ourselves and stand together on all hunting, shooting and 2nd Ammendment issues.

Include Political issues where folks are all wanting the same thing as far as the future of America is concerned!

Somehow I don't see that happening!

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Somehow I don't see that happening!

Ran'l you never do. Your continuous and consistant negativity is always so refreshing and helpful.

Guys this is nothing more than a backdoor gun registration scheme the feds are starting in direct accordance with the United Nations treaty on small arms!

You know, the treaty that must be ratified by the Senate!

I know this involves taking guns out of the country. But what next? Crossing state lines? County lines?

I have written and E-mailed both my Senators, my Congressman and the Congressional Sportsmans Caucus. Get busy folks.

When we get busy we win! When we are complacent we lose!

When we just type a bunch of cynical negative crap we lose!!!!!!!!!



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anytime we have to give information or register our guns with any agencey its a form of gun registration and guncontrol plain and simple any one who thinks other wise needs their heads taken out of the sand or some other body orfice plain and simple

It only takes a few minutes of internet research to write an email to your state Representatives/ Senators / Congressmen. If every one of us that participates in shooting sports would do this the pressure on them would be overwhelming and we will get what we want.
It is our responsibility as gun owners to do this.
If you don't then you get what you get and must follow the rules as doled out to us like sheep.

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Originally posted by thirdbite:
This is definitely a stupid requirement. However, what additional information is required that wasn't already required on Form 4457? It looks to me like the information (or registration) was already required.

How about a tax id# from the IRS and registering as a firearms exporter? Don't see anyway that could bite ya' in the Azz do ya'?

There is no provision that I or anyone have found where the records of owened firearms can't be kept either........Federal gun registry? You okay with that when all the firearms issues in this country are decided on a 5-4 vote in the Supreme Court?

This is big! Write your lawmakers!


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Originally posted by thirdbite:
The point is your name and address, firarms description and serial number are already on the 4457. If the govt. wants to identify and keep track of you and your firearms, they have the info they need. Registering as an exporter and obtaining an EIN don't provide any more info.

Wrong, your 4457 is not entered into a system, you keep the form yourself.

No, you keep the only copy, at least that has been the procedure when I got them in Scottsdale, AZ and Casper, WY.

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Originally posted by thirdbite:
I stand corrected, however what keeps them from retaining the information but not retaining the physical form?

Nothing except it is illegal for them to do so.
That is no reason to give up and accept new hoops to jump through. Instead of arguing on the internet take that same amount of time and write your Congressmen, Senators, State reps it only takes a couple minutes to do so and far more productive than the mental masturbation of whether or not the 4457 is kept in a data bank.

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Originally posted by Snellstrom:

quote:

Originally posted by thirdbite:
I stand corrected, however what keeps them from retaining the information but not retaining the physical form?

Nothing except it is illegal for them to do so.
That is no reason to give up and accept new hoops to jump through. Instead of arguing on the internet take that same amount of time and write your Congressmen, Senators, State reps it only takes a couple minutes to do so and far more productive than the mental masturbation of whether or not the 4457 is kept in a data bank.

And well.....you know our current Administration would do nothing illegal.......like maybe using the IRS as their attack dog?


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http://www.contactingthecongre...ite=ctc2011&state=co

Here is a link to write your politicians in Colorado. It only takes minutes to look up your state and write them to voice your dissatisfaction about this issue.
If we do nothing we eventually lose everything not just for us but for our children.
If you like I can post a letter I used all you need to do is change the names to suit your state.

Looks like this will be a NON issue.Got this news today
" Congressmen Hoeven secured a commitment from the agency to return to the paper process used by international hunters for years, while updates are made to the automated reporting system for exporting weapons. Kurlekowske said the agency’s web site would be updated later today."

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Looks like this will be a NON issue.

It's still an issue, it has been postponed NOT cancelled.

We must remain vigilant, they want our guns and our way of life!


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Looks like another attempt to register firearms to me.

My last trip to RSA some customs clown wanted to take my firearms behind a partition to check to see if they were stolen. I got my pen and notebook out and started to write his name and ID # down. He asked me what I thought I was doing. I told him I was going to call my attorney and report this incident; and that if it were an illegal attempt to create a file on me as a firearms owner I would have my Atty sue him personally for civil rights violations, both criminal and civil suits. He called his supervisor. I wrote her name and ID number down and repeated myself. She waddled off and brought some suit back. When I asked him for his name and ID # he declined to provide it, and I then explained the phrase " you have choices, and you will see consequences for those choices..." to him, he told the agents to just pass me thru.
That was Atlanta a couple years ago.

If we do get a Republican President next year, it will take him the first four years to cleanse the bureaucracies of socialists.

Hate to say it Rich, but even if we elect republicans for 20 years the bureaucracies will still be populated by these folks.

That is what "Civil Service" was supposed to be about.

Unfortunately the progressives are much better at that game than we are, we probably would have been better off never to have passed that, or insisted that you cannot vote as long as you receiving a government check.

Yes I'm sure it was a "end around" to firearm registration.
I got this from Colorado Senator Michael Bennet, who also seems to think it was unlawful registration and gave some instruction on use of the 4457.

"Last week, CBP announced that the international transport of personal firearms will be no longer be processed through AES. This means individuals no longer have to request an EIN and can go back to paper processing through Form 4457.

Form 4457 is a multi-purpose duty form that should be completed voluntarily. The form asks for a description of the article, but no specifics such as serial numbers are required. Travelers are asked to keep the original form and no copies should be made. Failure to complete the form can cause re-entry delays. Firearms should not be confiscated as long as firearm ownership is properly established.
In Colorado, we support the Second Amendment right to bear arms and people's ability to hunt and to protect their families and homes. We have also experienced some of the most tragic instances of gun violence in our country's history. This debate is not about challenging the rights of responsible gun owners-it is about keeping the wrong weapons out of the hands of the wrong people. In order to prevent gun-related crime, we need a healthy respect for firearms and vigorous enforcement of our existing federal, state, and local gun laws.

As gun legislation is introduced in the 114th Congress, I will keep your concerns in mind. In the meantime, I will continue to ensure that the Second Amendment and the rights of Coloradans are upheld."

Keep in contact with your politicians and exert pressure on them to continue to uphold our second amendment rights.