I'm interested in getting some thoughts from you guys about the use of gun safeties while hunting. I hunt with a round in the chamber, and the safety on [safe]. I know some hunt with no round in the chamber and some hunt with multiple safeties engaged.

My thoughts are that in my situation, you need to be able to react as quickly as possible, while remaining safe. More than one safety is overkill, and no round in the chamber would result in many lost chances on game (here). I also think the three position type safeties must be awkward... do you carry the rifle with the safety in the middle positon or in the full safe position? Seems either option might have some problems, ie noise, or getting hung on branches.

I ask because I was just watching a hunting show on TV, and the guy missed a shot because he had to unscrew the [extra] safety on his knight muzzel loader as the deer walked away.

Whats considered safe, and practical?

You asking about Maine hunting customs or the rest of the world? I recall there the window is kept open and the rifle has just one shot in the chamber with the lever closed, hammer down. The barrel of the rifle wedges against the console.

As far as bolt actions, Paul Mauser designed the Model 98 with a three position safety; Winchester made one on the original Model 70 in 1935, which only improved on the Mauser by allowing a low mounted scope.

I've not see any improvement since then. All two postions safety's are an inferior design on bolt actions. Amazing only one real improvement in the last 104 years.

Bob

Anyone who RELIES on a mechanical safety to prevent neglegent discharges (very different from accidental discharges mind you!) from happening is a fool. If you follow the basic rules of gun handling you will simply never get into touble.
The best safety in the world is the one between your eyes! Use it. Keep the gun pointed in a safe direction at all times. Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to fire. Treat every gun as if it were loaded and ready to fire. Simple and will keep you out of trouble every time its applied...
I'm not saying its not prudent to use a mechanical safety. I'm simply saying that time and again they have proven worthless and people have paid the price for the mistaken belief that the safety would protect them. Not necessarily because the safety failed...but because the person using the gun broke one or several of the rules of safe gun handling.
Having said that: In the Army, whenever I was asked to carry a weapon for serious reasons it was always locked and loaded. Since I pack a 1911 style pistol for protection its always cocked and locked. And finally, when I hunt I almost always have a round in the chamber and the weapon on safe.
Other than crossing fences, climbing into a tree, driving in the truck etc. The fact that people won't carry a weapon loaded and on safe doesn't make them any more or less safe or safety conscious. Because ultimately that weapon my be loaded and the guy carrying it just kinda missed that fact...seen it happen a million times with leverguns!
It really has very little to do with the instrument and everything to do with the musician.

When I carry a weapon for protection, it is locked and cocked. When I hunt (generally with a bolt action rifle) I do not put a round in the chamber until it is time to do business. I have found there is always time for this, and the sound is not an issue. If we have to move again after loading into the chamber, I use the safety. After the animal is down, for certain, the round comes out of the chamber.

This practice has helped keep us safe in Africa where we are in and out of the bakkie constantly. The first thing on getting to the truck is checking to insure the rifle is "under loaded."

I don't like safeties. I don't trust them. This technique avoids dependence upon them. Ku-dude

Safety

How about an empty camber

I load a round in to the camber when the time is ready and that's just in the final stalking, not before and not to late

I hate people who dosent handle rifles properly. How heck shall we know if his rifle is loaded or not when the action is closed?

/ JOHAN

I was taught to hunt with a round in the chamber and the gun on safe. My 30.06 has a magazine/clip so it's easy to drop the magazine and remove the round from the chamber when I want to unload.
As infantrymen in Vietnam we were always locked & loaded. On patrol we were all required to have our weapons on fire(off safe). Since our quarry had weapons and fired back(first) you didn't want to be caught fumbling with the safety.

Keep your finger away from the trigger until it's time to take the shot. Make sure you know where the muzzle of your weapon is at ALL TIMES!

[ 09-01-2002, 02:28: Message edited by: CaptJack ]

What MECHANICAL safety you use is situational. What's safe as you're aligning the the crosshairs on a trophy bighorn wouldn't be when you were scaling the vertical cliff to set up that shot. It goes without saying the safety protocols set between your ears never changes; 1)Never point a firearm at anything you don't wish destroyed; 2)Keep your finger off the trigger until you're ready to fire; 3)Treat all weapons as if loaded; and 4)Be sure of bullet path before and after your target (See Rule #1)

I've trudged for miles, through ravines, over ridges and up and down mountainsides with a round in the chamber and the safety engaged in search of my quarry without a hitch. But when I needed to pay close attention to what I was doing- such as scaling vertical cliffs, I'd empty the chamber and engage the safety (to prevent the bolt from being knocked open). When crossing a barbed wire fence, I'd unload first. Evaluate your situation, respect the culture of your host and act accordingly, keeping safety always in your mind.

A 3 position safety isn't the best choice for all rifles and not my first choice for hunting. It takes more motion than needed to ready the rifle to fire and more motion than needed to engage correctly for any hunting situation. Yes, the middle position allows you to unload the rifle while blocking the trigger but you still have to follow all the rules of safe firearms handling. It would be better to have a swinging detatchable floor plate. The best safety for a bolt actioned hunting rifle is a good two postion that when engaged locks the bolt as well as blocks the firing mechanism, assuming the man operating it is properly versed in firearms safety and ettiquete

Only when Im in stalking mode and the hair on the back of my neck begins to rise do I chamber a round. The gun goes immediatly to saftey and even so Im very mindfull of the fact that there is a hot one in the throat and treat the gun as if it were not on saftey and was ready to fire. If the hair standing up turned out to be a false alarm and I go back into standard search mode the round comes back out.

When I leave the vehicle, a bullet goes in the chamber and the safety is engaged. Everyone I hunt with keeps the muzzle pointed in a safe direction at all times and an open action is maintained when in the vehicle, except in Africa. In Africa I always drop the bolt on an empty chamber so that everyone can see that it is not cocked and locked.

If there is any chance of encountering game, I have the chamber loaded and the safety on, thumb on or near the safety, finger straight on the stock above the trigger. With three-position safeties (Winchester, Ruger) I have the safety engaged in the first position when actively stalking, and in the second position otherwise. With the Steyr SBS rifles, if I'm moving through thick brush I engage the bolt lockdown safety as well.

If I were following up on dangerous game in the thick stuff, I'd have the safety off and my trigger finger on the stock above the trigger.

Other than in Africa, I load the chamber when leaving the vehicle and unload before the ride back to camp. In Africa, my PH would always ask, "Chambers loaded?" before driving out of camp. He seemed very comfortable with our gun handling. I hear that many PHs insist on empty chambers until they say otherwise, and given the gun handling of many hunters, I can understand their reluctance to walk in front of a loaded gun in such hands.

[ 09-01-2002, 18:37: Message edited by: Slingster ]

When I am in the woods hunting rifle shot gun ect the gun is loaded the safety on. The best one I heard about not having a shell in the chamber was a guy hunting in Ak by himself no one else around to shoot gets attacked by a grizzy dosen't have time to bolt one in and gets mauled I found that was carrying safety a bit far. I find that hunting styles are a bit differant in the states almost very body carrys there guns loaded safetys on when in the woods.

1. All guns are always loaded.

2. Never point a weapon at anything you are not willing to destroy.

3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target.

4. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it.

Adherence to these four rules absolutely prevents negligent discharges and tragedies, and nothing further is necessary or relevant.

Thanks for the replies. I expected some regional differences, due to the visibility of game (or lack of).

quote:

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Originally posted by Slingster:
I hear that many PHs insist on empty chambers until they say otherwise, and given the gun handling of many hunters, I can understand their reluctance to walk in front of a loaded gun in such hands.

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I remember well the instructor of my hunter safety class drilling into us the need to keep our firearms unloaded if you were walking behind someone. I have practiced that ever since. I almost always hunt alone, so it's rarely an issue. I am very careful of where the muzzle is pointed, even when the rifle is unloaded...

Cold Bore: By dropped bolt, I meant that the bolt is closed on a empty chamber, and then the trigger was pulled. With a quick glance, it's obvious the gun is not cocked. My first PH wanted it this way, and I've passed on that procedure to 4 other PH's who started using it.

JD-

That's exactly what I thought of when you said dropped bolt.

Although you can tell by looking at the rear of the bolt, if you know what you're looking for, I'd think that at first glance somebody would have a question about the closed bolt.

Hey, if it works for them, and they like it that way, then it works for me I guess.

Thanks for the reply.

I've been with an elk guide who allowed rounds in the magazine but not in the chamber until there was game in sight and time to shoot. I ordinarily hunt sage flats with an empty chamber and the people who hunt with me generally do the same, loading up when shooting is imminent. I have a model 70 with 3-position safety and use it on full safe, also a 700 with 2-position safety and keep them with empty chambers and on safe until there is game in sight and it's time to shoot. This is generally not jump-shooting so time is not of the essence.

The exception ( you knew there would be one ) is hunting sage flats or riverbottoms where there are birds, shooting a Savage 24V with a hammer. I usually carry it loaded with the hammer down until game is in sight.

Tom

Depends where I'm hunting and who with. By myself, slow stalking, or hidden beside a game trail, I'll have the chamber loaded, the rifle cocked, and the safety on. Hunting with others, usually rounds in the rifle, chamber empty. In the vehicles, the rifles are empty (required by law). I've hunted with a couple of folks over the years that I wouldn't let load their rifles, until the game showed up. I tried following one guy on a path and every time I looked over at him, his carried rifle was pointing at me. After a warning, I simply emptied his rifle and took his cartridges away. - Dan

I dont use a safety much. Usually with a bolt gun I always have an empty chamber. The only time I chamber a round is when we are going into an area with good, recent bear sign or I'm gonna shoot something. either way, the safety is off. With my marlin, I keep one chambered and at half cocked.

I dont trust mechanical safetys.

I don't use safeties because I don't trust them, if a cartridge is chambered you will not have a look through the barrel no matter the safety, will you?
My gun is always ready to shoot while hunting. My barrel is always pointed at a non-dangerous direction. When I have to cross a fence or something like that, my bolt is open, or my shotgun is empty (I've even removed the mechanical safety on my 12-ga). We all know the only safe gun is the EMPTY gun.