Murf,

Like I said, The hornady is great under 2900-3000fps mv. Over 3000fps and on certain animals (Elk and tougher, etc), you need a tougher bullet.

I had a similar experience with a 139SST @ 2750fps. The Antelope must have stepped back and turned its head at the last moment. From 190 yards, bullet hit front of shoulder cut right across brisket bones, broke neck bone and exited. Of course the Antelope never took a step after that.

Deke.

I'll take the Partitions for either deer or elk. Good luck.

H K
I agree, but..........
As you prolly know downloading some cartridges can be a dangerous proposition (particularly large capacity Magnums) if one does not know about detonation!
With most slow powders a reduced load like you mention would be approx. 11-12 gr. less.
To safely download I would change the powder from a slow burning type to a faster burning variety of at least medium burn rates and adjust your load volumes accordingly.
Some fellas have run into this nasty little problem because they thought, all I need to do is drop down several grains of a slow Mag. type powder and voila they get DETONATION!
I just thought I'd point this out as I guess we all sometimes assume that everyone on the board is as experienced at reloading as we are and sometimes this might not be the case.
In the past when I have tried this idea in a large case I have found some sort of filler to be a good idea at times to enhance ignition by keeping the powder charge tucked snug to the primer. Otherwise accuracy can be a little hit an miss.
But you raised a very good point... reloading affords us great versatility in our firearms and in your case you can cover a wide spectrum of needs with your .300 weatherby.
By the way I envy your location, a shooters heaven I reckon!
Straight shootin

The old saw about "At which point in the animal's death......" is cute but dangerous if one believes it. Clearly, if there is a picture of a recovered bullet and a dead animal, all turned out well. Even if there is no picture of a recovered bullet, just a dead animal, that is also good. The problem arises when there is no recovered bullet and no dead animal, other than one that dies after you have given up tracking it.

If a bullet exhibits severe breaking up and inadequate penetration when it is recovered, consider yourself and the animal lucky. Learn from what you have observed and make the changes to prevent your "luck" from running out, as it inevitably will do.

Why did our ancestors not starve to death? Because, of necessity, when there were failures, they tried again with better tools. They learned from their failures and designed equipment to prevent recurrences, as we should also.

Well said Gerard!

WestCoaster,

I have to disagree with the merits of a boat tail under 400yrds. It is called WIND.

Using the 7mm 139gr Hornady FB and BT @ 7-08 velocities for comparison:

- The boat tail is .8" better in a 20mph wind @ 200yrds
- The boat tail is 2.0" better in a 20mph wind @ 300yrds
- The boat tail is 1.8" better in a 40mph wind @ 200yrds
- The boat tail is 3.8" better in a 40mph wind @ 300yrds

If you are hunting Antelope out West, common conditions are frontal shot, 200yrds++, and steady wind of 20mph+ with gust 20mph+ faster. Consider this with the windage info above and I believe you will see that a BT can easily have a significant advantage over a FB at 200-300yrds. When you consider a less than perfect hold, a BT will keep you in the vitals when the FB will not.

Deke.

Deke
Interesting post, I was thinking in terms of velocity/drop and forgot about the crosswind component.
But I also believe that unless you are a above avg. shooter who practises alot, why would you be shooting game beyond 200 yds?
Jack O'Connor pretty much said the same thing, from all his years of hunting and seeing alot of game shot. Under actual hunting conditions the avg. Dude is maxed out at 200 yds.
Now I'm not saying this is true of yourself, you may very well be comfortable with 200 yd plus shots on the windy prairie but prolly 90% of the other guys can't say the same.
If shooting boatails helps you, go for it. Lord knows we need to have absolute confidence in our rifle & ammo when the chips are down.
Staight shootin

I was so glad to see Born To Hunt's post. I think he finally hit the truth. The bullet did it's job, but it wasn't what HE would have liked to have seen. Wise remarks! All of the tests that I have seen in ballistic gelatin showed that 18" of penetration was a very good result for any bullet with a lead core at or above 3K fps. And this one did it hitting bone? The Partition, on the other hand, could have gone through without hitting a single bone. I think both performed admirably. I also LIKE blood trails, so I would like to never find a bullet, but it doesn't always happen that way.

You pays your money, you takes your choice! I hunt with a 6.5x55, 7-08, 7x57, 308 and 30-06. I shoot medium weight bullets for most applications. I load to safe factory spec speeds. I hunt mostly W/T deer and meat pigs. I see no need for premium deep penetrating bullets. I'll go up in weight and use an Interlock if I need more penetration. For what I do I am more than happy with a bullet that 'leans' to the soft frangible side. FWIW if the bullet seperates, there are two wound channels! As I said'You pays your money, you takes your choice!' capt david

I started with the Hornady 162gr BTs when I bought my 7mm Rem Mag and found them to be devastating on Deer and Antelope out to 450yds. I was very happy with the performance and accuracy they offered. They would drop Deer and Antelope in their tracks. Two years later I was using them when I shot a Cow Elk at about 80 yds. The bullets just came apart I found one peice of lead that looked like a .22LR slug and I shot her 4 times at 80 -120 yds. I finally was handed my friends .300 Weatherby and put her down. I was really surprised by the bullets falling apart but then again that was close range with a bullet that is really moving along. The next year I loaded up a bunch of 150gr Partitions and shot a cow at 60 yds this shot was a quartering on shot, the bullet went through her shoulder and was found on the hide near the hind quarter. The nosler held together really well. I came to the conclusion that the Hornadys are a great bullet for accuracy and pile driving medium sized game out to 450 but it is not a great choice on heavy animals at close range. If I new how I would take some pictures of the two bullets so those who would like to see them could.

Well I know how to take the pictures I just have no clue how to post them on the forum.

I agree about the 162 BT. It IS devestating on Antelope, Impala, and Blesbok, but go to a heavier tougher bullet for Elk, Kudu or Wildebeest.

WestCoaster,

I agree, especially when it comes to practice, doping wind, and knowing your POI. As far as hunting I do my best to get within 200yrds and I enjoy the stalk. However, sometimes Antelope just don't permit shorter shots and the conditions can be windy. When I have no way of closing the distance, the game is within my range and not spooked, I have time to range/dope, time to rerange/redope, time to adjust my scope, and I feel up to the task of killing with my first shot, then I will take the shot.

I do practice a fair amount and try to get in a few silhouette matches leading up to each hunting season. I find that shooting in a standing position, in whatever conditions that are present, with no props at 200-500 meters makes me a much better shot when it comes to shooting game at ethical distances.

BTW, I was talking to a fellow competitor who placed 5th at National Championships again shooting out to 500 meters, standing, no props. We talked a little about Antelope hunting and when he spoke of his Antelope, he was a little sheepish at admitting he killed it @ 350yrds that year. He took it through the shoulders and it was a very clean kill, but nonetheless he thought it was a long shot, even for him.

Deke.

Deke
Sounds like Antelope hunting where your at is kinda specialized to say the least. At any rate it sounds like you got a handle on it.
The Rifle Silhoutte shooting sounds like a blast! I unfortunately don't have a range available past 300 yds anymore. I shot IMHSA for years and really enjoyed that. Also competed in a 3 position rifle league for several years.
Antelope hunting is something I really want to try someday, Alberta might be an option if I can draw a tag. Our son lives there and he can sponsor us if we do.
I believe the longest shot I have made was a Moose near Dease lk. B.C. He was 250 yds and running, I broke his back with an off hand shot with my 7mm Rem. Mag. after my buddy wounded him with his .270 low thru the brisket.
But he was a tad bigger than an Antelope!
Straight shootin

I don't like messing with bullets. I usually work up one load for a given rifle that's built around a premium bullet, sight-in, then use that one load for everything I'd hunt with that particular cartridge.

For example, I load 180 gr. Nolser Partitions to about 3100 fps. in my .300 Win., and I'll use that same load for everything from pronghorn to elk, and from impala to eland. Sure, some specific non-premium boattail bullet might provide slightly better performance ballistically at long range on pronghorn or smallish African plainsgame animals, but that same bullet might be abysmal at 100 yds. on bigger animals such as elk and eland.

On safari, it's impractical to change loads, especially since you don't know what you're going to bump into next, and in Alaska, you'll pretty-much HAVE use the same load on a hunt that involves sheep as well as grizzly. So while a good premium such as the Nosler Partition might not exactly be the prefect long-range bullet compared to some others, it's a whole lot better as an all-around bullet, especially if you plan to hunt everything from deer to moose with the same load.

AD

I like messing with bullets with this qualification, as long as they are accurate and tough enough to take the most dangerous game in the world. I agree with Allen Day in that I deal with premium bullets only when I am working up a hunting load, because hunting is the focus of my shooting and reloading, not targets. That said I will shoot three to six targets daily, three days a week, weather permitting. I only will work up a load and use non premium bullets if the object of my hunt is cayotes, groundhogs etc, and I have worked up some wonderful loads of Hornady, Sierra, for that game. ----- I spend lots of money on premium bullets working up hunting loads because I use the best bullet for the job, that is accurate and tough, and my rifles like. I shoot North Forks, Nosler Partitions, Barnes, Swift A-Frames and others. If the bullets survives my toughness test and is accurate, then I will tweak that load until it is my "go to" load, and this can involve several dozen targets. Good shooting.

Phurley,

What sort of media do you use for your toughness tests?

Last Memorial Day I plugged a row of 3 gal. herbicide jugs at my father-in-law's farm. Shot a .270 130gr. Scirocco @ 2950 fps at 200yds (about 2500 fps at that distance). Bullet mushroomed just like they show on their web page and penetrated three of the jugs--so in the neighborhood of 15 to 18" of water.

I had great results with that bullet in Whitetials, but the price...

Last fall I shot NBTs. They killed well, but wow, did they ruin both shoulders.

For this coming season, I'm going to try Hornady's 140 gr. BTSP interlock. Lots better on the price, and I've heard good things about them, yes?

Finally, I'll also be hunting elk this fall in Wyoming, and am leaning towards either Partitions in 160 gr. or A-frames in 150. Any thoughs on these?

Thanks,

friar

P.s. my first post! this is a great forum!

First of all welcome to AR, you will find a treasure chest of information here. ----- My toughness test is an elongated box of old insurance files that I soak, then place a couple of plastic bound notebooks and a large Buffalo (bison) bone in amongst the files. I shoot into the end of this box and measure the penetration and weigh the bullet. It is a simple matter to seperate the files back to the bullet, but beware the bullet will be very hot when first found. At the speeds I shoot my bullet needs to be extremely tough. For me Deer sized game will get any the tougher non-premium bullets, above Deer sized game get only the toughest premium bullet. ----- This test will separate the tough bullets from the pretenders. I then take the tougher bullets and shoot for accuracy and proceed to what my rifle likes. Good shooting.