Thanks For the Advice!

The varmit rifle would be a .22/250 Ackley Improved, with a twist fast enough to stabilize 60 grain hunting bullets. This would allow the use of standard .22/250 Rem ammuntion for PDs, well loaded Improved 50 Grain for varmints and 60 grain SPs for coyotes ect.

Just a tad better now that we have premium bullets for the upper end, that being Elk.

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'Trapper'

Daryl

If I am not mistaken, the good old .243 is just that: a .308 case necked down to a 6mm bullet.

[This message has been edited by Jameister (edited 10-22-2001).]

quote:

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Originally posted by heavy varmint:
Anybody have any experience with the .308 necked down to 6mm, and maybe a twist rate to shoot the lighter bullets,what are your thoughts on it even if ya haven't done it and just see a problem I don't?

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That is the .243.....

mike

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NRA Life Member

America, Love it or LEAVE IT!

Of course that is not to say that a .30-06, .308 (which can do anything the .30-06 will do), or .300 or .338 Mag wouldn't fit the bill either. That is the fun about this, we have so many choices !!

Joel Slate
Slate & Associates, LLC
The Safari Specialists
www.slatesafaris.com

quote:

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Originally posted by hunting1:
If you wanted an elk, black bear, and deer rifle for shots 200-yards and closer, what caliber would you choose?

Thanks For the Advice!

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Something between .30-06 and 9,3x62, loaded with heavy RN bullets. I don�t care so much for caliber, just that I want sufficient penetration and moderate velocities. As handloader you choose the performance.

The primary concern is the rifle. If you can�t shoot well with it in the field and put the bullet where you want, everything else is useless. Weight, balance, stock fit and sights are some important factors here.

Fritz

P.S. Yes, I know. This is a boring answer...

[This message has been edited by Fritz Kraut (edited 10-22-2001).]

AD

For me, I think a much better round is 7mm rem mag. That would be my choice for a single big game rifle. Outperforms the -06 hands down.

1) Bigger holes are better.
2) Shoot to 200 yards with 2000 fps energy.
3) Heavy bullets are better.
4) Less recoil is better.
5) Light rifles are better.
6) Short barrels are better.
7) Less muzzle blast is better.

Add up, divide, multiply with the constant, and I come up with the 358 Win. No contest. FWIW, Dutch.

My all time favorite gun is the 338 Win. My 338 is a tack driver and I have shot everything from rockchucks to Buffalo with it, and lots of both.

I, personally see no advantage to a 338-06 or 35 Whelen, although they are fine cartridges, the 338 will do anything they can do plus a bunch more, and there is no difference in recoil that I can determine..I can load DOWN to their velocities, they can't load up to mine...they are wildcats, for the most part. I can buy ammo at any country store world wide.

Been there, done that, the 338 Win. fits me better, for my intended purposes. the 30-06 is a distant second, but also a fine round.

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

The one I have been lusting after for a while now is one of the new Remington Model 7 Magnum Alaskan Wilderness Rifles with a good quality lightweight scope in 300 Remington Short Magnum caliber. The rifle has a 416 SS barrel with a black matte finish and a nice looking all weather stock.

Probably not the best rifle or caliber ever created, but I would sure like to try one out to see if it is really as good as it looks in the picture.

I am guessing that unmodified accuracy would be mediocre and the trigger would be horrible, but a couple of hours of aluminum bedding and trigger adjustment work would take care of both problems.

quote:

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Originally posted by John S:
Any 300 magnum loaded with 200gr Noslers is damned fine elk medicine, BTW.

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Couldn't agree more. I pick the .300 Winnie myself. No disrespect for the '06's or the .338 (or the Weatherby ) intended, however.

If I were to build one now (elk, bear, deer gun), I'd give the new 300WSM a go. Nice thing about rifles, you don't have to keep them 'til death do you part. You can trade up (or down) any time the urge strikes you.

So many cartridges, so little time.

Canuck

[This message has been edited by Canuck (edited 10-23-2001).]

Having said all that, I really like my 7mm STW w/ 160gr bullets and wouldn't hesitate to use it on anything in North America.

Adios,
EC

quote:

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Originally posted by monyhunter:
Man, I just don't see anything in the 30-06. To me this round is just plain moderate. Sorry all you -06 fans, this is just how I feel.

For me, I think a much better round is 7mm rem mag. That would be my choice for a single big game rifle. Outperforms the -06 hands down.

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I still kick myself for selling my 7mm rem mag but now I have a 30-06 and it will knock out anything the 7mm will up to 300 yds. The ballistics of a 7mm rem can nearly be matched with a 270 AI with a more tolerable recoil. For shots under 300 yds I say why beat yourself up, a 30-06 AI is as close as you can get to magnum power without the heavy recoil and its versatility and popularity are tangible plusses. Just my .02 c.

I would hunt the same animals with any of them, up to Buffalo... and do with the exception of the 7 Mag and I have seen lots of game successfully shot with it..

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

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To be old and wise.....first you have to be young and stupid!

One of the great gun writers who has passed on felt that the 7 MM Rem mag was the best for most of us. Some how I think that recoil velocity hurts more than kinetic recoil energy. Thus the felt recoil is very high from the 300 magnums. For that matter the 7 MM mag seems to kick harder than the 30-06 to me.

That guy weighs 300 lbs and most of it is muscle. Once he picked up a coil of steel that was laying horizonal on a skid. That steel must have weighed 150 lbs. He snatched it up with one hand after wrapping a shop cloth on the edges. That 06 really hurt him however. Of course with that mass he does not roll with the recoil.

I don't know why "hunting 1" mentions 200 yards? Why limit yourself. I really like the .358 Winchester (for woodland deer) but where elk are mentioned the 06 is the place to start.

mike

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NRA Life Member

America, Love it or LEAVE IT!

It's basically just a 338 Win necked down to 308 caliber but it's also damned equivalent to a 300 Win with a longer neck. To me this translates to a round that is very forgiving in terms of reloads, i.e. wide swings in certain variables don't impact accuracy in the way they do in other calibers.

Just like any caliber of rifle, get the thing to fit properly, maybe a thumb hole stock to soak up some recoil in the hand, not much drop to get recoil perpendicular to the ground (reduce jump), and you'll be very happy.

I have confidence in this round for everything mentioned in the original question but given the desire for larger game at closer (<200 yards) ranges than typical applications (deer) I tend to think a change to .338, .358, or .375 might be in order. I will agree further with the others who say it's easier to load down a bigger caliber than to load up a smaller caliber.

Given that my 308 Norma will go to my grave with me, if I were getting something bigger (especially when you mention <200 yards) it would be a 416 Rigby or thereabouts...but that's another subject.

Reed