Will be doing a Bison hunt soon andf need some advice between these two bullets. Wouldn't be asking if it were not for the cost of the Swift. Using a 444. Thanks, smoker1

Two different bullets altogether. The swift is a dual-core bonded bullet and generally considered a fine bullet by anyone's standards. The Speer(hot core or not-unless it's the Gold Dot) is not a bonded bullet and much softer. The Gold Dots are either bonded or chemically plated--not sure, but they are harder and tougher and do work very well at 44 mag velocities. My choice for a Bison hunt would be the Swift. It will hold together.

Thank you aliveincc, I really hate to spend a buck a bullet but guess I'll have to. Better start looking for the best price I can find. I have a WTB post on classifieds, maybe someone has a paritial box they would be willing to sell. Thanks again, smoker1

quote:

Originally posted by Smoker1:
Thank you aliveincc, I really hate to spend a buck a bullet but guess I'll have to. Better start looking for the best price I can find. I have a WTB post on classifieds, maybe someone has a paritial box they would be willing to sell. Thanks again, smoker1

If I could afford the Bison hunt the price of a good bullet would be the last of my worries.

I was expecting a comment like that, there always has to be one.

Speer has jacketed , Gold Dot [bonded] , and Deep Curl [bonded but with heavier construction than GD]. Get the Deep Curl , available in 240 HP, 240 Flat point , and 280 Flat point .I think the 280 Flat Point is the most appropriate for bison.

Thank you mete. Seems like the 280 would give me a little more speed...which never hurts. Been using Hornaday's 300 in HP/XTP with good results on thin to medium skined animals but always seem to get complete separation of the jacket. I don't think that feature would be good for a large animal. smoker1

Too bad you can't buy the Remington 240g Core Lokt bullets in bulk for the 444. Although I've been loading Noslers for 30 years, my father in-law and my youngest son shoot core lokts in their 270s with great results at both close range and 300 yards plus. They should work even better in a 444 Marlin moving much slower with a bigger frontal area.

They were discontinued but with some searching you may be able to find some nosler partitions. They were offered in 255 grain. Seen them perform great on a large bison cow out of a 44 mag revolver. Bullet found under the offside hide after going through two ribs, only lost about 15 grains. Another thing to consider would be any of the hardcast lead bullets. They offer excellent penetration and energy transfer due to the large frontal area. A little cheaper than the swift at around 30 to 35 ish a box depending on weight.The possible issue could be feeding. I assume your shooting a lever action sometimes bullets with little taper don't transition to the feed ramp out of the magazine tube very well. Other possible issue is if your shooting a marlin microgroove rifling some people claim accuracy with lead bullets is poor.Not to pile on but they bullet is the last place to cut costs on any hunt.

With a 444 on a Bison I think I would use one of Buffalo Bores hard cast bullets...

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Originally posted by Donald Nelson:

quote:

Originally posted by Smoker1:
Thank you aliveincc, I really hate to spend a buck a bullet but guess I'll have to. Better start looking for the best price I can find. I have a WTB post on classifieds, maybe someone has a paritial box they would be willing to sell. Thanks again, smoker1

If I could afford the Bison hunt the price of a good bullet would be the last of my worries.

quote:

Originally posted by Smoker1:
I was expecting a comment like that, there always has to be one.

Make that two. Bullets are usually cheaper than any other aspect of a hunt. Load them both and see which shoots best.

Thanks for your advice.

My family has shot about 7 or 8 buffalo with my 450 Marlin and all we have ever used is factory Hornady loads. None of those buffalo required a second shot and none of them went over 100 yards. And it must be pointed out that Hornady bullets are not really that stout a bullet.

I realize that the 450 Marlin and the 444 Marlin are two completely different cartridges, but from the experience listed above, I dont really think you can go wrong with either bullet. Buffalo are not bullet proof. Put a good modern slug in the lungs and you can get the skinning knife ready.

After all, the hide hunters from years gone by racked them up by the thousands with lead bullets from blackpowder rifles. Buffalo haven't changed in the last century and they haven't gotten any tougher.

Pick the one that groups well and go forth to slay the mighty buffalo.

Nothing beats real experience. Thanks Flags for your input. I have been saving for this hunt for almost three years now and don't want to blow it due to ignorance. Thanks again, smoker1

One other thing to consider is required shot placement. Numerous bison hunts require head shots only. In a herd situation the guide wants the animal down asap. You don't drop them the rest of the herd goes nuts at the smell of blood and will begin harnessing the wounded animal.This makes follow up shots difficult and worse case scenario you could end up with a ripped up hide on your animal. My shot was less than perfect on the cow I shot. She went to her knees but not down. Took an hour and a good half mile before I was able to get a clear shot to finish her.

If you have not already asked your guide about the shot he wants you taking you should before selecting your bullet. If he does want head shots I would go with the toughest bullet you can get. Don't need expansion just maximum penetration.

All good points. I have decided to go with and have ordered the Swift A Frame. Appears to be the bullet of choice of many that have used others and settled with Swift. I figure with this bullet I will get good penetration. smoker1

Emailed Swift yesterday asking about thier recommends for using this bullet. Was sure I would not get a response from them untill tonight when I received a phone call from one of thier techs who gave me all the information I needed. Was very surprised and pleased and wanted to pass this on to you folks. smoker1