Well, creatures of the night have cleaned up the carcass of the buck I found earlier in the season, so I brought the head home this morning and took a photo of the rack.

What a shame this beautiful, old buck went to waste.

While 3-4 days of decomp and rain made it a little more difficult to ascertain with absolutely certainty what happened, it did appear that a poorly-placed neck shot is why this buck was able to escape and die on the back part of our property.

I do realize things can go haywire when hunting, but I don’t feel the shooter exhausted all options in tracking. After all, no one came by and asked to enter our property. If they had, and if my health would have been cooperating at that time, I’d have not only granted permission but even would have gladly pitched in my services to try and find the animal.

Can you tell I’m still fumed after more than two months???

I’ll step off my soapbox for now.

That is a shame.
GWB

I can understand your anger.

I know lots of folks, especially Texans that swear by neck shots, but I have found several deer over the past few years that managed to get away from whoever shot them, I am not sure they were all neck shots gone wrong, but some of them were.

I am probably wrong on this, but over the past few years, I have heard some hunters admkit to taking a shot at a deer, and because it did not fall dead on the spot, they assumed that they had missed. Never went to check things out, the deer didn't DRT, so they figured they had missed.

And to take it a step further, these self-styled long range killers that, after the wounded deer runs off, haven't the slightest idea of how to locate the actual spot on which the deer was hit AND haven't the slightest idea of what to do if they can find the spot.

Unless you have found a bullet of fragments of ones. Looks like the carcass is pertty well gone to come to the concluesion it was shot and wounded.

If you have a shattered neck bones the deer would have dropped it its tracks more of a case of not following up properly.

Deer do die from other means and of old age thousands of deer get hit by cars and trks every year and rot along side the road some big bucks too.

I have killed dozens of car hit deer over the years.

Finding a dead deer in the woods even a big buck rotted is just a fact of life.

I would say wow I pick up a nice set of horns to bad I couldn't have shot him myself.

Other then that its nothing to be upset about.

With out actually seeing what happened,it is hard to point fingers at a bad shot or unethical hunter.More Big Old Bucks probably die from the rigors of The Rut than wounds.We very seldom see Big Old Bucks around here ,but I have plenty of Trail cam pics of them after dark.I was lucky enough to shoot a big 12 a few years back that only dressed at 160 Lbs.Sucker was skinny and had no fat on him.He had just worn himself ragged chasing the ladies.He should have gone over 200 dressed.it is my belief that nothing that dies in the wild is wasted.Critters benefit.Now having said that if I knew for sure that it was shot and left I would not be happy.

May have also been shot right before or after a rain. Awfully hard to follow a blood trail when that happens.

I'd have to think that whoever shot it would have given it some followup. That's a nice deer even for a fat lazy man.

p dog shooter wrote: "Looks like the carcass is pertty well gone to come to the concluesion it was shot and wounded."
----


You missed an important aspect of my post. And I apologize if I was unclear in my earlier explanation.

I didn't just find the deer now. I found it early in the season, when it was still possible to determine what killed it.

And yes, it was a poorly-placed shot that allowed the buck to make it onto our property and resulted in its demise -- and I can say that with 99.99 percent certainty. Granted, a brick could have fallen from the sky and served as a coup de grace, but a violent, grazing impact to the side of the neck is what put the buck here to begin with.

What a waste I don't like neck shots and get really peaved when slob hunters don't make every effort to recover wounded animals.

I read on another forum a post by a 20 year old who was asking for recommendations on a deer hunting rifle to purchase. He added that "out to 200 yds I like to take head shots." Some people challenged him on that and he reassured everyone that he was sufficiently experienced in doing just that (remember--he's just 20 years old).

About three or four years ago I shot a buck that had it's lower jaw blown off. He was trying to eat, but couldn't. I saved him from an agonizing death by starvation. Someone like the young man above tried to make a head shot and failed. I know that in Texas the neck shot is very popular, and I'm not saying it should never be attempted, but we hunters have a real obligation to be conscientious and humane outdoorsmen.

Red C. wrote:"we hunters have a real obligation to be conscientious and humane outdoorsmen"

Very well said...

Two of the posts in this tread mention neck shots being popular in Texas. I'm curious to find out why deer hunters in the Lone Star State would be more likely to take a neck shot than hunters elsewhere?

Typically you're in a stand no more than 100 yds away. In E TX you're lucky to be 50 yds away.

Up here in MN we have post rut bucks like that killed every day by wolves. Those ravenous f$#@kers have moved into our area and it is easy to see their kill sites on the property. From the looks of things we will be lucky to have any deer left to fawn this spring. I'll trade you for one bad neck shot!

That's a shame but I don't see why some of you are so down on neck shots. In my experience, with a neck shot the deer is DRT. Now before you get up on your soapbox again, I only take neck shots where I am going to kill the deer. This is usually not much over 100 yards where I have a good steady rest and am sure of my shot. Both bucks I shot this year were off hand neck shots at about 30-35 yards. Neither one knew what hit them. No spoiled meat and dead deer. Neck shots have their place.

quote:

What a shame this beautiful, old buck went to waste.

Nice find. But only a waste in our eyes, the coyotes, skunks, bugs and what ever other critters feasted on it didn't think it was a waste. A coyote didn't have to kill another animal while feasting on this deer.

Neck shots do have their place, and fired from a one hunt a year rifle by someone that does not do that much shooting during the year, isn't it.

Head and neck shots work wonderfully if they are placed correctly, and the shooter haa the ability and experience to know when and where to use it.

Not everyone sitting in a blind in Texas, has such experience.

Bigaaanelk, taking head and neck shots is just one of those things that lots of folks here in Texas swear by, or claim to.

I have taken them and most of the time they work beautifully, but things can and do happen, where an animal is not going to be DRT.

99% of the time, I am going to take a heart/lung shot as my first option , and if that isn't available, a dead on shoulder shot is my No.2 choice.

There is not that much meat on the shoulders of a deer to really worry about.

Also, as Ide mentioned, the majority of shots on deer here in Texas are taken at 100 yards or less, from a stand, looking at deer standing around under a feeder, hence why some folks don't consider deer hunting in Texas as real hunting but simply deer shooting.

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:
And to take it a step further, these self-styled long range killers that, after the wounded deer runs off, haven't the slightest idea of how to locate the actual spot on which the deer was hit AND haven't the slightest idea of what to do if they can find the spot.

I've seen plenty of deer hunters bugger up shots at under 100 yards. Many of them dust their rifles off the day before the season opens.

quote:

Originally posted by Whitworth:

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:
And to take it a step further, these self-styled long range killers that, after the wounded deer runs off, haven't the slightest idea of how to locate the actual spot on which the deer was hit AND haven't the slightest idea of what to do if they can find the spot.

I've seen plenty of deer hunters bugger up shots at under 100 yards. Many of them dust their rifles off the day before the season opens.

What is your point? That one is less bad than the other? That one gives license to the other? I have no moment for the hunter that drags old trusty rusty out of the closet the night before the season opens either but simple logic tells us that if he buggers up a shot at 50 yards, he has a much better chance of bringing the deer to bag than the hunter with the same mind set who sez "here, hold my beer, I'm gonna try something", and starts popping away at long distance. They're both slobs. Why do you feel the need to defend the long range poke and hope shooter??

Perhaps I feel a need to defend the long-range crowd for the same reason you feel the need to attack them. If the two groups are equal in your mind's eye from a "slob hunter" standpoint, why didn't you mention the typical and much more prevalent hunter who doesn't shoot all year yet expects to harvest a deer on opening day? I have found that the long-range guys are typically much better prepared than many hunters from a gear and practice standpoint. Do they lose animals? Of course -- but so do others at much, much closer ranges.

So, what was your point by making the asertion that it must have been a long-range hunter?

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:
And to take it a step further, these self-styled long range killers that, after the wounded deer runs off, haven't the slightest idea of how to locate the actual spot on which the deer was hit AND haven't the slightest idea of what to do if they can find the spot.

Another uneducated, BS shot at someone's way of hunting that you do not understand nor comprehend.

a good tracking dog would have solved the matter

And the usual collection of assholes joins in: Other people wound deer, why can't we???

Actually, I know a good deal about shooting at distance and have read some very definitive papers on hunting at distance. I choose not to; it is not my cup of tea. But, if I did, I wouldn't feel any need to defend the box a year shooter than reads a mag article about "you too can shoot deer a long ways away" and heads for the woods spraying and praying.

It isn't a total waste if you have that good of a genetic specimen breeding near your property. I'd love to have genes like that.
It is a shame though that someone lost a great buck.

Here is another perspective though...for all of you down on this hunter.

My first "big" buck to shoot at, in my life, came at age 25. He was a 158" ten point. I had never in my life seen a deer that big on the hoof. I was 20' up in a windmill over looking 3 cross roads. This deer crossed the first two before I could get my gun up. At first glance with binos I knew he was huge, in my book. When he got to the third sendero he paused for a couple of seconds. I pulled the trigger and managed to hit 3'above him in my excitement. He ran 50 yards in the brush and stopped to figure out what that was. By this time I had gathered myself up and managed a good shot that ended it.
We hunt for a lot of reasons including the excitement of maybe killing a real trophy, that excitement is sometimes uncontrollable and no can duplicate it to practice controlling it.

Remember we only have speculation/assumtion to go on.

Perry

quote:

Originally posted by Red C.

About three or four years ago I shot a buck that had it's lower jaw blown off. He was trying to eat, but couldn't. I saved him from an agonizing death by starvation. Someone like the young man above tried to make a head shot and failed. I know that in Texas the neck shot is very popular, and I'm not saying it should never be attempted, but we hunters have a real obligation to be conscientious and humane outdoorsmen.

I had to do the same with a doe. 120 X bullet from a 264 fixed that

That's a good point Perry. My Daughter and I were watching does at quite a distance when a "big" buck stepped out. She shot twice and missed both shots clean in her excitement. As the buck was heading into the draw I whacked him and a short time after he fell the does came back around. Without the horns in her eyes she calmly placed a partition from her 260 through the shoulders and her doe was dead where it stood. She is an MOA shooter and can consistantly kill p-dogs to 300 yards, but couldn't cut hair on that buck. She could have easily hit a leg or guts. It happens. That "neck" shot could have easily been an attempt at H&L.

Excitement is another reason IMO that most hunters should aim for the heart/lung/shoulder area. Lots more room for error that does occur. I was brought up using the back of the front leg as the vertical aiming axis with the up/down dependent on yardage. While I have taken neck shots, they still make me nervous even after 45+ years of hunting.

Blacktailer wrote:

quote:

Now before you get up on your soapbox again, I only take neck shots where I am going to kill the deer.

My soapbox had NOTHING to do with neck shots per se. This particular shot was poorly placed and the deer not recovered. Those were my two gripes. And like I also said, things do go haywire in hunting situations.

Bobby,
I hope your health issues clear up.
And back to the topic, I shoot for the lungs, an area as large as a small garbage can lid.

Stepchild

Bobby, That is a horrible waste of a great buck. Shame he didn't have a happier ending.

I've taken a few deer with neck shots and all but one dropped on the spot. The one that didn't was hit a bit low and ran as though I had missed....I was sure of it in fact. Sat in the blind for another hour before I walked out and double checked just to make sure and guess what?...a few drops of blood. Course it's just about dark by now and dinner's waiting but that doesn't matter now does it? Anyway, I tracked him (on my hands and knees for a good part of it)for about 500 yards before he bled out and laid down under a cedar bush. I don't profess to be a great tracker nor am I the best shot sometimes (obviously) but I found him nonetheless.

At the end of the day, what it taught me was that a neck shot is probably always fatal, just as long as it connects. But if you miss that baseball sized sweet spot then all bets are off and they sure as hell can go a long ways til they bleed out.

I also learned that I'm no longer a fan of the "neck shot".

Regards,
Scott

Shame about that deer Bobby. In reality most of this is assumption though. None of us will ever really know what caused his demise. I know you wish it could have been a perfect death for a respected critter but that isn't nature and unfortionately not always possible in hunting either. No matter how hard we plan. All I can offer you is good luck for next year and I hope you get to chase his big brother around.