https://biologicaldiversity.or...2MjgxLjE3MjY1MTk5MTc.


For Immediate Release, November 25, 2024

Contact:

Russ McSpadden, Center for Biological Diversity (928) 310-6713, rmcspadden@biologicaldiversity.org
Elizabeth Bennett, Mountain Lion Foundation, (949) 392-9063, ebennett@mountainlion.org
Sandy Bahr, Sierra Club Grand Canyon Chapter, (602) 999-5790, sandy.bahr@sierraclub.org

Petition Aims to Ban Dog Pack Hunting in Arizona

TUCSON, Ariz.— Conservation groups today petitioned the Arizona Game and Fish Commission to ban the use of dog packs to hunt mountain lions, bears, bobcats, foxes and other wildlife. The petition calls on the commission to modernize Arizona’s regulations, as other states have done, to safeguard both wildlife and the public.

“The science is clear, packs of hunting dogs let loose on public lands cause significant harm to native ecosystems and wildlife. Their prohibition in Arizona is long overdue,” said Russ McSpadden, Southwest conservation advocate at the Center for Biological Diversity. “Currently hunters use GPS-collared dogs to track wildlife for miles via smart phone apps and satellites, often from their vehicles. This trophy hunting method not only undermines fair chase principles as well as Arizona and federal law, it also disrupts hundreds of species of native wildlife and threatens jaguars, wolves and ocelots, just as these amazing endangered species are staging a comeback to the wilds of Arizona.”

According to Arizona Game and Fish data, 748 mountain lions and 323 bears were reported killed by hunters using packs of dogs between 2020 and 2023. A 2020 study estimated that the state's entire mountain lion population was between 1,166 and 1,715.

“It's just common sense that hunting mountain lions with dog packs is not fair chase, a principle that has guided hunting practices for more than a century,” said R. Brent Lyles, executive director of the Mountain Lion Foundation. “Mountain lions are critically important, and they deserve better than to be shot out of a tree after being cornered there by hounds wearing radio collars. This petition offers Arizona a chance to implement fair and humane practices that respect both the dignity of wildlife and the ethics of hunting.”

Today’s petition says that releasing unsupervised dogs on public lands creates hazards for humans and may violate the Endangered Species Act. It highlights cases of hunting dog packs endangering hikers and other public lands users and inadvertently targeting federally protected animals like jaguars. The petition also stresses that the practice violates hunting ethics like the principle of fair chase.

“Most Arizonans, including hunters, want wildlife treated respectfully and don’t support methods of hunting that violate hunting ethics,” said Sandy Bahr, director for Sierra Club Grand Canyon (Arizona) Chapter. “Arizona Game and Fish should act on this petition expeditiously and ban dog pack hunting, for our wildlife, for our public lands and for people’s safety.”

The petition also points out the significant risk of harms to hunting dogs themselves, including physical injuries, abandonment of underperforming or injured dogs, chronic health complications due to exhaustion, dehydration and selective breeding. Dogs are sometimes purposely starved by their owners to increase their prey drive.

The proposed changes would only restrict the use of dogs in recreational hunts for large mammals. The changes would not apply to the use of dogs for bird hunting or managing depredation through permitted hunts, preserving Arizona’s wildlife management and traditional hunting practices.

And you can bet they would have no problem with packs of wolves chasing everything that moves 24/7/365......IDIOTS

So, would anyone like to try to hunt a cougar or bear with a single dog? I'm thinking that the dog getting killed is more than a 50-50 chance.

Years ago I was working as an assistant guide for an outfitter that used dogs for lion, bobcat, lynx and bear. One of the worst experiences I ever had was when we were chasing a big tom in an area of very steep ridges with ponderosa pine and about a foot of snow.

We could hear the dogs baying treed up above us and we were struggling up the steep hillside trying to get to the dogs so we could leash them. The hunter and another guide were going up the other side of the ridge, but could not see anything either.

We instantly knew the cat had jumped out of the tree as all hell broke loose. We heard dogs yelping and in short order it was deadly silent. When we got to the tree there was blood everywhere and three of the the dogs were dead, the forth bleeding out and she died moments after we arrived.

That episode took all the fun out of it for me. I know the dogs are bred for it and they live for it, but it just really affected me as I am a big softy for dogs.

Interestingly the next day we took more dogs out there and got on the toms trail again. This time he stayed in the tree and it was all over with rather quickly. As a side note, that tom weighed 214 pounds...a very large kitty.

Their goal is to chip away at hunting! Little by little. When there 6000 lions eating pet dogs and horse colts time to call in the profession hunters to thin the population. They have to be profession hunters because there can be joy in it! Idiots!

The antis are certainly doing this in Colorado via the ballot box. Good news is their recent proposal to ban all mountain lion/bobcat hunting didn't pass.

Very sad but it is done to keep us humans out of the woods in in the polluted and sick cities.

quote:

Originally posted by Live Oak:
Their goal is to chip away at hunting! Little by little. When there 6000 lions eating pet dogs and horse colts time to call in the profession hunters to thin the population. They have to be profession hunters because there can be joy in it! Idiots!

Exactly!

For many years in Wisconsin. The anti's tried to pit bear hunter against each other.

Hounds vs bait.

Divide and conquer was the name of the game. The only goal the anti's have is to do away with all hunting.

It was amazing how one group of hunter were very willing to throw each other under the bus.

Finely the hunters wised up. Worked together to fine a solution to keep both.


We have about a month long season. One year the bait hunters have the first week to themselves. The next year the hound hunters have the first week to themselves.

The hunters won the anti's lost.

Remember when you slept with the enemy.

There is a good chance your going to lose too.

quote:

That episode took all the fun out of it for me. I know the dogs are bred for it and they live for it, but it just really affected me as I am a big softy for dogs.

When one runs hounds one should not get to attached to ones hounds.

When on the trail, They can die many ways.

One of the best dog/hound men I know.

Gave me this advice about hounds.

Never pay more for a hound then your willing lose.

He always had a great pack. Why because the bad ones were culled quickly

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:

quote:

That episode took all the fun out of it for me. I know the dogs are bred for it and they live for it, but it just really affected me as I am a big softy for dogs.

When one runs hounds one should not get to attached to ones hounds.

When on the trail, They can die many ways.

One of the best dog/hound men I know.

Gave me this advice about hounds.

Never pay more for a hound then your willing lose.

He always had a great pack. Why because the bad ones were culled quickly

This is how it should be yet I have known people who claim their hounds are worth THOUSANDS individually. To me such an expensive animal is at risk not only from running dangerous game but vehicle collisions, causing injury to livestock and more. I ask about the vehicle strikes and then they say well, nothing we can do about that. Attacking/maiming/killing livestock- you better not shoot my dog(s), it's worth more than YOUR animals!!!

Keep in mind my area is nearly all private property and not thousands of acres of wilderness. Even public land is small in most of the state. Not a single houndsman has ever asked permission or come to say hello and introduce themselves. They just expect to do what ever they want on your property.

Let me say I enjoy hunting behind hounds and rode traditional fox and hounds for many years. We had a nice culture and depended on all of the private landowners to conduct our sport. Hounds did on occasion get hurt, hit by vehicles, get lost, culled, etc. Things happen, it's part of it.

Last year I wrote an article for the " Winchester
Collector" Magazine on Ben Lilly, the famous lion-bear hunter in the mountains of New Mexico and Arizona. Lilly did it right, including a period in the 1920s for the old PARC-US Govt program to eradicate predators on ranch stock and cattle grazing permits within the Gila and Apache National Forests.
He hunted from around 1911 to the 1930s.

Right into his late 60s he could keep up with his hounds, and walk anyone with him literally into the ground. He regularly wore out a set of hobnailed mountain boots just about monthly.

This while carrying a 40 pound pack, an 1886 Winchester in 33 WCF, and attending to his cold nose hound which trailed the rest of his dogs close on the lion scent. Dale Lee and his brother from Arizona knew Lilly, and could not keep up with him without a horse.

He would not hunt on Sunday, but chose to regularly read his Bible.

There is a brass plaque tribute to Ben V. Lilly embedded in a boulder N. of Pinos Altos, New Mexico. He was one of a kind who had hunted in Mexico prior to the Revolution of 1910 ; a unique and famous mountain hound hunter originally from Alabama.

His spirit still haunts the Arizona mountains and he would be a bit irritated at a ban on hound hunting there.