As some peple here might remember I have been talking about putting together a long range big game outfit.

Initially I was headed toward the .300RUM but recently I have setelled on the boring old consistent, non exiting .308win.

Partly because I don't do much benchrest(practice) type shooting with a big rifle and the step up might be a little too traumatic, to just go start shooting 50rounds of .300RUM in a day for practice.

The other reason is that I don't have elk or moose where I live, I have small to medium size game. Roe deer no more than 30kg(66lb)
fallow deer around 100kg(220lb) and pigs of similar size, say 120kg (264lb)

Shots out to 500m maybe 600m, under very controlled conditions, and the average would probably be closer to 300 or 400m shots.

Does anyyone here use the .308 for similar purposes?

I have very little experience with the cartridge, so I am putting a lot of trust into what I have read and heard.

The intended rifle should be a Sako heavy barrel varminter, the stock I would like to substitute with a McMillan A-2 and thing that Lapua Scenar bullets.

How does that sound?

I own a .300 RUM in a BDL SS and its a real good gun at long range I can easily hit pop cans at 650-700 yds. also with the RUM you can use heavier bullets. The recoil is very stiff though!!! I think you would be happier with the Ultra Mag over the .308. Good Luck In picking your rig

EXPRESS
Your Idea and cartridge choice has great merit, especially for the game you intend to hunt. The 308 has the same "power" at about 550 yards as the 30-30 does at 100 yards. So you have enough velocity left to expand the right bullet at that distance. {more on bullets later].
I have hunted a great deal with the 308 in many different rifles from 18" bbls to 26" bbls. I have taken whitetail deer, mule dear, and antelope. Shots have ranged from @25 yards to one antelope taken at @550. I have taken several antelope in the 300 to 350 yard range.
The 308 is very accurate if in a good rifle, and the 308 is very plesant to shoot, allowing you to practice [long bbl life] and place your shots accurately.
As to bullets, I have mostly used 165grain bullets, including Hornady, Sierra HPBT, Trophy Bonded Bearclaw, Nosler Ballistic Tip, Nosler Partition. I have also used Sierra 180spz and Nolser 180 Partition. In 150gr. bullets I have used Nosler Solid Base, Nosler Ballistic Tip,Sierra 30-30 type bullets and some others I can't remember. All have performed well.
I have shot a couple of Rem mod 7's extensively at 600 yards on a high power range and even with the 18" bbl they shoot good. It is the wind that causes you problems at distance, with laser range finders distance can be determined.
So your bbl length is your choice. For the game you intend to hunt I would pick the 150 or 165 grain bullet you like and think will still expand at those distances, and develop an accurate load. THEN I would develop a close in load with a premium deep penetrating bullet that hit to the same point of impact at 100 yards for big hogs up close and go hunting.

[ 06-22-2003, 00:33: Message edited by: N E 450 No2 ]

Guys, thanks for the replies, well put by both of you.

I realize that the .300RUM will carry a lot more energy further downrange, more spectacular kills...

I beleive for what I can shoot here I don't need that much energy and think I would do better to go .308 for the fact that I can practice more due to barrel life and recoil. Also top quality brass is another consideration. Lapua makes some very high quality stuff.

If all goes well I hope I can use 168gn moly coated Scenar bullets.

They are not hunting bullets, more similar to the matchking, but I've heard around here that you can't use them on game

EXPRESS
I have killed 2 pigs a coyote and a turkey with Factory Federal Match, which is loaded with 168 Sierra Matchkings. They killed the game good, but based on the postmortem I quit using them for hunting. I recommend you pick a good hunting bullet. I have found Sierra HPBT Gamekings and Nosler Ballistic Tips every bit as accurate as Match bullets when fired in good rifles. I have never had any trouble getting Partitions to shoot very good groups either.

I would prefer the 300 Ultra over the 308 at those ranges. I belive the 308 is inherently more accurate, however, the energy factor plus the fact that speed is more forgiving on misjudged ranges, both would lead me to recommend the 300 Ultra for hunting situations at those ranges.

Express, you should do well with that rig,what your talking about building is bacicly what we call a sniper rig, and it will do the job if you can, good luck

EXPRESS,

Have you considered a 300WSM or 300 Win Mag. Might be a good compromise between the 308 and 300 Ultra Mag. Less recoil than the Ultra and a bit more range than the 308. Just a thought.

Hawkeye47 beat me to it....nice compromise in terms of ballistics and economy.

My custom built Bench/Sniper is in 308(7.62x51) and performs extreamly well with bullets from 146gr to 165gr. It really likes the Ballistic Tips in 150 and 165. derf

Just an idea, but if you don't have the time or desire to practice at long range, maybe you shouldn't be flinging target bullets at animals?? If you can gut shoot a pig inside 100 yards with a Partition, imagine what havoc you can create with a Scenar at 600!

While I am in a committed lasting relationship with my custom rifle in .300 WSM firing 190 gr Match Kings, my opinion is the .308 is also an outstanding choice for the man who will do all his hunting with one rifle and load. I am not fimiliar with the Scenar so I would consider either a 168 gr Ballistic Silver Tip or 175 gr Sierra Match King. If on a particular hunt shots might be at close range on harder animals the 168 gr Barnes XLCBT should be fine if your rifle groups them well, and a load might be developed that permits same POA-POI as you Scenar, SMK, or BST.

todbartell:

I most certainly do practice and have been taking game out to 300m with a 6PPC.
With pigs it has been down to head shots and I practice on paper and water bottles out to and beyond 300m. I want to go to a bigger caliber so as to be able to shoot pigs and fallow deer past these ranges, where the 6PPC just won't cut it.

Please don't get the idea this is somthing "I just wanna have a go at..."

I have been through around 2000rounds of 6PPC this year so far, offhand I couldn't say how many animals I have taken, but the last animal I wounded was with a 7mmRemMag, and that's another story...

I would also consider barrel length for maximum velocity in the 308 and the 26" barrel would be best. At longer range you need that extra few FPS velocity to get the job done. The 308 is one fine accurate cartridge but lacks the case capacity to drive the heavy weight bullets at the desired velocity for long range accuracy.
I would limit bullet weights to 175 grains or less. Know your rifles capabilities as well as your shooting abilty at any given distance. Taking shots your not sure you can make will ony produce unsatisfactory results. If you can hit a plastic jug filled with water at the longest range you intend taking game you then know your files and your longest range ability.

For the type of game you describe you would be hard pressed to improve on your choice. Shooting at those sort of ranges demands practice and plenty of it reguardless of how flat or powerfull the round is and an arched trajectory will be part of the game, so youll have to learn to manage it anyway. The 308's "inherent accuracy" is an amazing feature and highly underrated.

Once again;

Wstrnhuntr, I'm with you on this.

Using the 6PPC which is a rather aneamic round in the ways of energy has never been of any hinderance in my experience.

The pinpoint accuracy, even though there is a good deal of drop @ 300m is a big factor.

Shot placement becomes "perfect" every time, and to date, (touch wood) I have not lost one animal with it, nor have any shots landed anywhere other then where intended.

I'm hoping to get the same sort of "oneness" with a rifle in .308 then maybe to on to a .300RUM or .338Lapua in a year or 2.

I know a bloke who shoots a .338Lapua and a .30-.378WBY at my range on the 160m line, would't want him shooting at my game...

Like your signature, Wstrnhuntr in this case; "An ounce of accuracy is worth a pound of lead" is a good motto.