I really like the 308 based rounds though I've never warmed to the 243 even after owning five of them! The only one I've not had is the 260. For a 6.5mm, the case seems ideal. Ditto the 7-08. Still, the older I get the less hairsplitting and minutia management mean to me. Want a fabulous all-round deer round? Get a 270. A 7-08 would like to become it when it grows up! Still, if I lived back east where deer hunting is primarily a wooded affair I'd use the 7-08 as it does recoil a bit less and can be chambered in a *slightly* smaller, lighter rifle.

In my 22" bbl'd 270 I can easily get 3,000 fps with a 140... I've never heard of a 7-08 with a 22" bbl. breaking 2,900 with a 140 and generally they run around 2,850. Not bad but no 270. Case capacity matters.

Brad, you're right on with your velocity figures but my question is: in the real world what difference does 150 fps really make??? If you have a .270 and are pleased with it, I certainly wouldn't trade it off for a 7-08. Nor would I trade a cherished .280, 30-06, .308, 6.5, .257 and so forth. -we are indeed blest in the deer hunting niche in America- But if I were looking to buy a new rifle, the 7-08 would be among the front runners of my considerations. While I would not make a doxology of it, the slightly smaller, lighter package would be a definite plus.

BeeMan... if I lived in WV I'd opt for the 7-08 and not look back, no question. The beautiful, rugged, rolling and heavily wooded hills of WV (and its small ag fields) are 7-08 (and 260) country to be sure. Here in the VERY WINDY and wide-open spaces of Montana that extra 150 fps *can* mean something. For quick shooting in the field from improvised rest's the additional velocity *can* make the difference between a hit and a miss. Granted, there's some hair-splitting here, but the additional case capacity puts the 270 in a different category with 150 grain bullets which buck wind even better and make the 270 a truly viable big-bodied elk round. Generally I sneak within 300 yards on everything I shoot... still, the 270 reserve of horsepower is comforting. I'd sooner use an 06 in MT over a 308 as well.

Nothing etched in stone for sure...

BA

There are so many cartridges (including the 7-08) that will do well at the same tasks. You could take any one of them and, if you are a one rifle guy, use it for just about everything in North America. I'd be happy with one but I have so many now I can't seem to find time to shoot them all much less hunt and kill something.

One seldom finds cases at the range, but it may be that all 7-08 shooters are reloaders. I know a fair number are sold locally.

In my 7mm-08 with a 22" barrel I get 2950 fps with a 139 gr Hornady SP. I am using a Speer manual max load of W760. That equates to the same trajectory of a 30-06 with a near max load (2950 fps)with the 165 gr bullet (bullets of equal SD). I do not turn my hand for the difference in the killing power of 28 or 30 caliber bullet in most hunting situations. The 7mm-08 can basically match the 165 or 180 grain velocities of the 30-06 and be very close in killing power with the 140 and 150/154 grain bullets (equal SDs). For most hunting that you would do with a 30-06 with bullets of 180 grain (over 180 is a different matter) and under there will be virtually no difference between the two, except for the fact that the 7mm-08 case is more efficient, accurate, and shootable.

The 7mm-08 will never equal the trajectory of a 270 in similarly loaded rounds, but it will the 30-06 and that alone should speak for its value in the game fields.

Now since I have the audacity to compare the "newcomer" to the "venerable holy grail" I am waiting for the sparks to fly.

[ 12-05-2003, 00:07: Message edited by: Thunderstick ]

Brad, if you'll check one of my other post, I remarked that for the last several of my trips to WY, if elk were not in the mix, my weapon of choice was a 7-08. I must admit however that on my first trip "west of the big river", I was armed with a .270 and used it to kill a nice 16" antelope. As I said, we Americans are blest when it comes to deer hunting choices.

At some personal risk I'm going to quote John Barsness here.

"Modern propaganda suggests muzzle velocities under 3200 fps are insufficient for long-range shooting. Instead, look at downrange velocity. Any big game bullet will expand reliably down to about 2000 fps. Look for that number in the ballistics table, and your load will do fine out to about that range."(that's about 500 yards for a 7mm-08 and 140 grain bullet). *Rifle magazine, March 2001-"Practical Accuracy & Trajectory", p.30

also:

In comparing the 7mm STW and 7x57 he said-"Even at 400 yards, you have to know the range and trajectory. Otherwise you might shoot under, or only wound, an average buck pronghorn. The big howlers do shoot flatter, but by the time velocity gets up to about 2800 fps, almost any cartridge shoots flat enough for reality. If we're going to shoot past 300 yards with any cartridge, we need to know the range, not just guess it. And 2800 fps also provides enough velocity for sure expansion with almost any modern bullet out to 450 yards." *Rifle's Handloader, April 2002-Efficient Cartridges, pg. 30-31

My point is that any perceived advantage of the 270 over the 7mm-08 is just an attempt by some to try and elevate the "status" of one over the other. Hunter's and shooter's, I have noticed often spend too much of their time trying to make themselves feel good about the caliber they shoot and will demean and belittle others to this end.

The 270 is better because it is cheaper!

Every 7mm ever made has been underrated.

Ever since the 7x57mm in Cuba in 1898. The 7 is and forever has been the equal or better of the .30.

It's just that we here in the USA like our .30s and don't trust the metric system.

After all, the meter is based on the length of some old platinum bar kept in a French basement somewhere, don't you know.

Not much that the 7-08/140XLC combo can't do.

It's that simple.................

For a small rifle the 7mm-08 is a nice option. I got one this fall in a Kimber 84M and it's a light rig. The cartridge could have been almost anthing that would fit in that little rifle and still do a good job on game. For woods hunting the shots seem to be in the 70 yard range. Anything from the .260 thru the .308 are all similar and would do a decent job under those circumstances.

There is a situation here however where I wanted to pop a doe. They come out at dusk and the only spot I could shoot at one from was at a distance of 375 yards. Due to CT's law of a minimum of 500 ft from all occupied buildings including barns I was left with that unusual requirement. So I put the 7mm WSM to work. The little Kimber will just not push a bullet with enough force to satisfy me on that shot. The WSM will give the 140 gr bullet 3250 fps. Of course the wind drift could count also.

So I carry at least two rifles in the car. Never can tell what the circumstances will be.

I was looking for a 7 08 and couldn't find one (several years ago in southern Denver area). I bought my .308 instead, and have been glad it worked out that way. In my opinion, anything a 7 08 can do, a .308 will do at least as well, and I can find ammo anywhere if I need to.

I have a .270 and .300Win in the safe as well, and one of them goes as a backup in case of mechanical failure of the .308.

Having said all that, if I had gotten the 7 08, I don't think I'd be really that much worse off, but certainly no better off.