Several may regognize my name and know that I am a longer range hunter type...meaning that I have been know to shoot game animals at ranges "generally" not acceptable to the apparent majority. I use this long(er) range capability as I desire and not as a sole method.

My first "dive" into the flamefest of ethics was several years ago and I've watched and read many posts on different hunting methods (main interest is long range of course).

There are times when some posts(ers) nearly have me convinced that longer range killing of game is less than a worthy pursuit...but I then recall the many other methods that are scorn by different factions.

When I was first learning to hunt (in Wisconsin's hardwoods) the majority of folks stalked and that was the method I was taught. The woods were large and rarely if ever was another hunter seen...I was taught to that real hunters needed to be stealthier than the animals and meet them on even ground...hunting from a stump or ambush was a lazy mans pursuit, not an honorable undertaking (not directly stated as such but inferred). A few years later I began archery hunting, few people hunted with a bow and it was a difficult proposition to bag a buck in such a manner. It was not considered "lazy or less than honorable" to hunt from a static position when using a bow.

In my travels around the USA I have hunted several places and usually did so after meeting locals and hunted using their accepted techniques ("when in Rome"). I live in the Eastern U.S. (Maryland) now and hunt using methods adopted and developed here (I've been here nearly 15 years now). Stalking for deer is essentially useless...there are many hunters and most hunt from tree stands so a walk through a wooded plot could cause you to pass sevral to many hunters...this is not a good method and it may disrupt at least two hunters doing so. The NON-Huntable areas are large and the deer frequent these areas, we generally hunt on the fringes of non-hunt areas and catch the deer as they come out to feed...spooking the deer could cause them to flee back into the non-hunt area and this can screw up many hunters opportunities to get a deer that day....best to not stalk and wait as it's easier to remain hidded from the deer when not moving.

I guess when I was young and in Wisconsin I had a set of adopted ethics (Wisconsin circa 1960's) models...stalking and meeting the prey on even terms was good...ambush was less than worthy of a "true" hunter. Archery came along (Ethics mod. 1) ambush is okay. Later it became acceptable to ambush deer even when using a firearm... the "ethics" system became diluted I guess.

Now as I travel around I hunt with whatever method works best for the task at hand. I go hunting with the full intention of completing a task...kill a moose (any legal moose), kill a 150 class whitetail, kill all the does on a given farm, kill a 7ft Black bear and now the task is a 170 class whitetail. Last year I went to Alberta and passed on a 150+ class whitetail at just over 300 yards, standing/feeding in a cut...I came home without a deer (the moose weren't so luck) but that particular hunt is still in session for me...I'm still after that 170+ class whitetail. I'll head back up this fall or next but I'm still on the hunt for the larger whitetail. I didn't end my "task" last year...I didn't say the hunt is over and I enjoyed the walk...I'm still going to get that whitetail. What I'm saying I guess is that I don't go hunting for a period of time, I hunt to a particular task/goal.

Do I still hunt long range? Sure I use whatever tools and methods I have at my disposal to accomplish a give tast or set of tasks. If I need to shoot long range I will, If I need to sit in a tree stand I will, if I need to stalk that'll be okay too. These are all tools to be used.

What I'm rather curious about is when I read post by folks that have strong ethical concerns (and in some cases these folks wish to inflict those ethics onto others) what formed that trait and has that hunter lived in a singular region for the majority if not their entire lifetime. How do these thing develop and why are they such a durable trait if folks move around in our mobile society.

Rambled enough... thanks for taking the time to read this if you in fact did so.

Interesting post David. You are correct, I believe, hunting ethics are regional (and cultural, I might add) and circumstantial. I think that's why it's hard to draw a line in the sand as it were. I guess I believe that as long as it's humane and legal, I don't have a problem with any of it. - Dan

I agree that hunting methods tend to be regional. Certain methods acceptable in one area are illegal or downright scorned in others. Running deer with dogs comes to mind.

Here in Montana roadhunting or hunting from a vehicle is accepted and widespread. The large groups of "hunters" who endlessly idle along backroads or hunting areas absolutely amaze me.
Very few hunters here walk any distances. Many will regale you with stories of hiking into an area, but most of it is fiction. Few people will walk.

I'm blessed with access to a tremendous Ranch with a very good population of deer and elk. It's going to be opened this season for the first time in many years to locals for hunting. One of the access rules is "walk in ONLY" NO vehicles allowed. Vehicles will be allowed to retreive game but the game managment guy or a ranch employees will probably assist or at least supervise.

It's going to be interesting how the road hunters are going to deal with having to actually walk.

David, as far as your long range hunting. I'm of the opinion that if the situation is acceptable, you have the proper gear and can pull it off, have at it. I practice quite a lot and "paper" my rifles out to the max range I feel comfortable at; 400 yds. I MUCH prefer my rangefinder to read two hundred something versus three hundred anything, but seeing a 3 doesn't scare me if the situation if right. I've CLEANLY killed (without losing a single animal) many elk and deer between 250 and 400 yds.

My situation IS unique though; open ground with little chance of losing sight of an animal for many yards. I have a five week season so if a situation isn't quite right I can pass and wait for another day. I'm fortunate to have good equipment capable of very accurate placement out to 400 yds.

Good thread.

FN in MT

Yes, FM,I concur with you about road-hunting in Montana.

When I was in Dillon 3&4 years ago hunting for deer & elk, I went with several locals who thought nothing of driving 100 or 150 miles a day (often at high speeds on icy and snowy roads) in search of a herd of elk. When the "ants" were spotted on a hillside or in a valley a mile away they would try to drive right onto the herd. Whatever . . .

I'm not trying to sound holier than thou as I also, on occasion, road-hunt here in northern Calif. - the only difference being the distance here being 1/10th of that in Montana.

As I've built up points I should get drawn for Dillon again next year. I sure enjoyed meeting the nince people there. But next time I won't take my deet to Ennis to be butchered as that highly recommended business managed to "loose" my great buck.

Now, if I can only figure out how to keep my feet from freezing, I'll be alright when I go on my hikes there.

Great to hear you've got access to a good ranch. Mine out of Dillon was sold to some Frenchmen who won't allow hunting any longer. Perhaps after the elk take up refuge there and eat up all the vegetation destined for cattle, the new owners will have a change of heart.

Herb D

Herb D - Wiggle your toes. Constantly. It works for me.

As an Iowa hunter, restricted to slugs or blackpowder rifles, we're stuck with short-range hunting. The idea of a 300+ yard shot blows my mind, as a result.

Our deer know this, on the whole, and will huddle together in a pack, in the middle of a 1 square mile section. The urge to lob slugs into the herd is strong, and must be resisted.

But, in the military, I learned how to make 4000+ yard shots with tank guns, and a 1000 yard shot with rifle or .50 cal machineguns are a yawner, so provided the shooter is up to it....

Herb D,

Keep applying. The Dillon area is a good one. They are finally getting a little rain down there today. LOTS of fires this past year. Its smoky as hell here in central MT as I type this. Then again the burned sections make for nice, new elk habitat in a year or so.

Did you lose just the meat? Or the horns too??

FN in MT

I don't know how much I have read on this and other forums about the ethics of short vs long range hunting. Some of it has seemed to make sense to me and some was just plain silly. While it has been interesting, NO ONE is going to state the terms or conditions under which I pull the trigger other than the wildlife agency in whose jurisdiction I am hunting. I often hunt with a handgun and take my animals right off the muzzle but I have also used rifles to take game at ranges I have heard many condemn as unethical. I'm not looking to anyone for support for any shot I have ever taken. I made the shot and I alone will answer for the consequences. I am calling for a little more toleration for diverse approaches. YOUR way,whatever it is, is almost certainly not the only way and may not even be the best way. We are all in it together guys and if it is not illegal or dangerous try to keep an open mind.

120MM

I'll try wiggling the toes - if possible and it the feet don't hurt too much. Buying more expensive boots didn't help. I know that quitting smoking probably would!

Frank N

I kept the horns but the butcher lost all the meat and couldn't explain how that could have happened. I didn't push it further for fear he might send me a road-kill. That was my first and only mulie! Perhaps I'll get that wall-hanger in Colorado this year.