As some of you have heard, Montana�s Elk Management Plan is being updated, and Fish, Wildlife, & Parks are accepting public comment through 12/31/02. The details and comment form are available online at http://www.fwp.state.mt.us/wildthings/elkplan/default.asp, and I�d urge folks to comment.
I�ve studied the existing plan extensively, and talk about a success story�. Every management unit statewide is above objectives. The problem is; it just doesn�t snow anymore during the general season, & hasn�t for what, about five years now? Not to speak of, it hasn�t. So the elk hunting should be just outrageous. With low hunting success, and nearly non-existent winterkill, there�s more big bulls out there than perhaps at any time in modern history. I know, wolves are having an impact in some areas, but hey, even at Gardiner I know guys who find just a pile of big 6-point sheds every spring, and blaming solely the wolves for low hunting success is just a little too simplistic.
I was at a meeting last night with a couple of FWP biologists, & this mgmt plan comment came up. An idea I sort of only half-jokingly floated was re-opening the season for a week if and when it finally snows. Remarkably, it may be possible to put in place a mechanism for something along those lines to occur, and they�d like to see that happen.
I don�t completely understand all the agency intricacies, but right now it requires legislative approval for the FWP Commission to modify the seasons to the necessary degree. It may be achievable for policies to be put in place for that to occur by next season, though, & that would clearly be a good thing. So once again, speak up, folks.
This is a worthwhile issue even for non-residents to speak up on. With the current conditions; elk success has generally been low. Much as it pains me to admit, in spite of major effort I�ve still got an elk tag in my pocket, although thankfully my son nailed one, & also guided a buddy of his to a bull. I was holding out for Mr. Big, though, and in spite of getting into elk galore right at the end of the season, we never saw an elk bigger than the one my son nailed.
The outfitters who have been having consistently good success in recent years are getting to be a really short list, indeed. Fortunately, some of our clients collected decent bulls, & ahem, it behooves non-residents to utilize our knowledge of that situation in a major way. At any rate, any outfitter worthy of the name hates low success even more than you do, and they�d jump on extended opportunities in a heartbeat. It might be a bit of a free-for-all for scheduling, but if you�ve got the dinero tied up in a non-resident hunt and came up short, it might be worth running back up here toward the end of December, eh?

Bill I don't hunt elk as you know. It's not a burning desire, but if this passes I could really change my attitude especially if it fell during my Christmas break from teaching each year. You just might get a new "best friend".

I'd love to hunt elk but that non resident tag cost is steep. Pay for that tag and if you come up empty handed, ouch! In a way it angers me because a lot of elk live and are hunted on Federal land. That's land we all pay taxes on and I'd have to shell out a fortune to go hunt an animal there.

Guided hunts are getting out of sight expensive.

Same thing is happening all over, look at Alaska. You have to go live there if you want to hunt game within reason and not go broke.
I'll go comment on their site but feel because I am not a resident of Montana they won't care.

Apply for the non-sponsored version and it's less than $500, which isn't too bad. You can figure on going hunting in MT about every other year, although the recent preference point thing will skew that slightly.
Some of the outfitters that are having real good success are in the $3500 and a bit range, up to yes, as much as you'd like to spend. It is reassuring that the lower end of that range is producing some bulls comparable to the upper end, further evidence that randomness still exists.
Personally, I feel the free market system is functioning quite nicely, although clearly there's room to complain. If everyone would just vote straight libertarian, we'd be set, though.
Just joking, and man, you got to be careful about that anymore. For me, I am firmly on the "pissed at the Republicans, but afraid of the Democrats" platform.
Oh, and Ann; your response does matter. Believe me, they are keenly aware of the revenue generated by non-resident dollars. We appreciate it very much, and God love you all, well at least most of you anyway ;-)!

[ 12-05-2002, 07:54: Message edited by: Rimrock ]

The problem with voting libertarian is that it only gets democrats elected and that is a horrible thing to have happen.

Rimrock..I'd have to say that would be a great idea.. to have later seasons opened up to help manage the elk. However, personally, I'd strongly oppose that for the taking of mature bulls, at least locally in the areas I'm familiar with. Bad idea. Perhaps increasing the number of late season permits would be more acceptable, maybe a 2nd drawing for such a thing. But not giving all the folks with an elk tag in thier pocket free reign at big bulls in the easier reaches of the mountains to our south. That would suck dog pecker to put it mildly.

I sent an expanded version of this, plus the comments I sent to FWP to a bunch of folks, mainly other members of the Gallatin Wildlife Association & it's generated a lot of discussion. One noteworthy point that came up, is that it very well could be a bad idea to close the season for a while, let the elk keg up on the Wildlife Mgmt Areas, & then open it back up. Could be a slaughter, & those just aren't the sort of thing we want to promote. Although, after this past season a hopefully controlled amount of slaughtering might go over big with a lot of folks, you know. At any rate, it might be a better idea to just extend the season a week or two.
As far as a bunch of big bulls winding up in the back of pickups parked in front of the Rocking R, well, at least in a year like this, I don't see that happening. It's ten dollar day at Big Sky this Friday. I just checked the "ski" report. They have six inches of natural snow there, plus about eight shot out of their guns. Six inches of snow up at 10,000' in December? I don't think those bull elk are standing along the roads, starving and misery-wracked shells of their formerly healthy selves. Cripes, man, they're healthy, happy, and secure as clams somewhere out in the north deadfall.
So yeah, decisions like extending the season would hopefully be made in a wise fashion, and in spite of my general distaste for politicians, the folks I know in FWP don't fall into that category. Well, the Commission can tend to jump when the Governor says so, but I don't know if even they are taking Gramma Judy seriously anymore. Tim Mulligan is a level head, I know that.

Rimrock, this management plan is pretty darn interesting!

It's weird how little snow there is down in the Gallatin's... last week I was in light drizzle all day while it was snowing up in the Belts... go figure! The north end of the Bridger's have double the snow the canyon has.

Brad

BTW, I doubt the Rocking R has any clientel with pickup's anymore!

Yeah, there's at least some more snow in the north Bridgers, but I talked to a couple of buddies Monday night who spent the last days of the season hunting the Bridgers, and they sounded like they had little Calvin-esque black clouds hanging over their heads.
Seen the 90 day forecast? http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/predictions/90day/lead01/index.html
Montana is in a bulls-eye for continued drought. If you gotta have drought, winter is the best time to have it (unless you're in the ski or snowmobile business). My crystal ball is on the fritz again, but my bet is we're looking at more of the same for the foreseeable future. Been in a drought now since '81, with only a couple of exceptions.
It's really kind of hard to complain about in a way; we're already the only state with five full weeks of rifle season, and it appears we could stand another couple. You gotta like that.
And yes, the R Bar has gone Yuppie. My wife & I have been in there a time or two since, though, and you know, I don't really miss coming out smelling like an ashtray.
There's still the Eagles & Legion, thankfully. Not sure just what sort of response you'd get parking outside the Ale Works, or God forbid Boodles or somewhere with an elk in the back.
Anyway, the situation just doesn't come up much anymore, which is a situation I'd like to do my small part to rectify.

My "Crystal Ball" works just fine I'll send it to you so you can read it. I sure can't.

As stated earlier by Aspen Hill going home without an animal is a bitter pill to swallow. BUT! I think that high dollar tag makes you think twice before you pull the trigger on a young bull or buck. And that is a very good managment tool. So yea the price is high, and they for the most part sell them out every year, and if they dont then the price goes down the subsiquent year.
I did go home from the great state this year with an open tag. And I will go back next year.

Chuck T

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