I used to hunt with a Remington 700BDL 30-06 and harvested more deer with that one particular rifle than all of the others that I have owned. I started using sierra game kings and was not impressed with there accuracy. I then went to Nosler 150gr ballistic tips I shot two deer only to have them go in and out of the deer with the same size hole. Afterwards I started using 150gr Sierra Match Kings I killed most of the deer with the 30-06 using these bullets.

I sold the 30-06 and bought a 7rem mag I took two deer with 130gr sierra Match Kings, but then learned from hunters on this site that they were made for paper and not reliable on deer.

I sold the 7mm Remington mag to a friend and bought a Remington 300 Win mag. I tried the 150gr Nosler Partitions but the accuracy was terrible 4" and up at 100 yrds. I then tried the 150gr ballistic tips and they shot great 5/8" and less at 100yrds. Last year I shot 2 deer on a dead run in the chest at 100yrds plus and harvested both. They did not drop dead they walked for about 50yrds laid down on there side and looked up at me. I walked to the first deer shot it in the side of the head at point blank range. The second deer I seen sitting up looking at me through the weeds I shot it between the eyes almost blew off the top of its head at 25ft. When I inspected the deer I found out that the ballistic tips blew chunks out of them while penetrating. I was not impressed with the fact that they did not drop but kept on moving.

At Doc’s recommendation I am going to try the 150gr Barnes triple shock bullets for accuracy since my first desire was to use the partitions but could not get desired accuracy. I do not want a bullet that blows up and wasting a lot of meat but rather one that punches a nice hole not stopped by the bones in a White tail deer and leaves a nice size exit wound and a good blood trail IMHO.

BTW I shot the 150gr BT with a max charge at aprox 3400fps out of my 300 win mag at a slower speed they may preform differently.

If I'm going to use a Nosler bullet, it'll be the Partition. I shot a good sized whitetail in the shoulder at ~100 yds. with a .270 Win 130 Nosler Ballistic Tip. The bullet went in the shoulder, hit the curved scapula and exited out the left side front of his chest. I never recovered the deer personally, but it was shot by another hunter later that afternoon. A Partition might not have deflected off the scapula like that... hard to say. I'm planning on taking a look at Accubonds in the future.

There's nothing wrong with a BT for deer/antelope sized game, or for what it's worth a Sierra bullet. In general they'll drop quicker with a broadside shot than with the partition. The rub comes when there is a severly angled shot through bone, etc. in which case a NP or North Fork, X bullet will work much better, with a broadside behind the shoulder shot, they may run 35-50 yards. That isn't a problem with a bullet, since I don'tlike to have a dozen different loads for each gun with varying POI I'll find a good partition load or North Fork etc. and use it on everything. I'd rather have a broadside shot with a slower expanding bullet than a through the bone shot with a fast expanding frangible bullet on larger game.

jstevens that is what I have been trying for years and I hope the Barnes Triple shock is the one for accuracy and knock-down. When I get the load I like I will practice with that load alone and use it on all of my Deer. I bought the 300 win mag with the hopes that it would be the last high power deer rifle I will have to buy. I know I am dreaming but it don't hurt to try.

Killed three big mature cow elk with a .340 Weatherby. First one at 75 yards with a 225 grain Barnes X-bullet just behind the shoulder. It traveled 50 yards and died - bullet existed a tiny hole on the off-side. Second with a 250 grain Sierra BT Game King at 250 yards placed a tad too far back behind the shoulder but through the liver. It stumbled 5 yards, fell and never got up. I had to finish it with a shot to the head from a handgun. The bullet was found just under the hide on the off-side mushroomed perfect and retaining around 85% of its weight. The lead core fell out of the jacket after I removed the bullet from the hide. Third with a 250 grain Nolser Partition at 300 yards through the rear leg bone just above the knee (broke it) through the body and out the shoulder. It got real sick and laid down 50 yards from the initial hit and was finished off after getting up. That bullet is still in a dirt bank somewhere. What does this tell me? Nothing really, except that I want a little more damage than the 225 grain Barnes-X offered so I went to the Sierra, and that I"m sure glad that second cow wasn't a bull or no bones were hit and that it was way out there when the bullet made its impact, and that the Nosler Partition is a pretty darn good bullet - not just based on my one time experience, but coupled with reams of testimony by other hunters who've had to drive one from one end to the other and watch it work.

Given all that, I've got a bunch of ammo loaded with the 250 grain Nosler Partitions and will use them again, unless I can get the Barnes TSX in 210 grains to shoot in my rifle. Why change? Well the Barnes-X did work, and it's just not fun pulling the trigger on that ugly Weatherby loaded with 250 grain bullets anymore. If the Barnes TSX doesn't shoot I'll try the 210 grain Nolser Partition. Heck, I might begin with the Nolser.

I've shot pleny of game with the Nosler Partitions and they always killed what I shot at. The bullets that I did recover lost alot of their weight but the animal was still dead so why complain? I now shoot the Trophy Bonded Bear Claws and the bullets I have recovered "look" much better and have almost all their weight, but again, what difference does it make if the animal is dead?

quote:

Originally posted by Jonathan Tomlinson:
The good thing about all this bullet talk is that there are many bullets avaiable to talk about.

For all you guys in the U.S you live in the land of plenty, with top bullets abound, all that choice, we in the U.K get there eventually.

Seems Noslers of all the types have worked well for many years and will continue to do so, looks like the Accubond will continue the tradition, long may it do so.

Get out there a shoot some lead.

At last I am making headway with another excellent bullet from the U.S, the Barnes TSX, these are the first Barnes bullets for me that have showed any real accuracy promise, early stages yet but already sub 1 inch groups in the .270, roll on.

JT

I agree with JT. 225g Triple Shock X-Bullets in my .338 Win Mag.

First 3 shot group: two touching, one just below. Second group: the same.

Don't care about speed, this aint no long distance rig.
Nosler Partitions: pretty much the same.

If it ain't broke...

quote:

Originally posted by TXRandy:
I've shot pleny of game with the Nosler Partitions and they always killed what I shot at. The bullets that I did recover lost alot of their weight but the animal was still dead so why complain? I now shoot the Trophy Bonded Bear Claws and the bullets I have recovered "look" much better and have almost all their weight, but again, what difference does it make if the animal is dead?

There is ALL kinds of wounded, only ONE kind of dead...

What a recovered bullet looks like only matters in a catalog.

Then again, to recover a bullet the animal is presumably dead. Right?

Swede

I've only used the triple shocks in a .257 Weatherby, shoot sub 1-in. and worked well on a whitetail at long range last year. Normally I use a 7x57 w/ 160 NP on deer, but took the .257 while covering a long ditch and it worked well.

quote:

Originally posted by Doc:

quote:

Originally posted by MC:
Solid copper bullets do not transferr the energy like a partition.

LOL! Tell that to this guy...

Maybe he meant "SOLIDS?"

At a recent Rocky Mt. Elk Show, I asked several PH's from South Africa what bullet they recomended, all but one were totally aposed to using Nosler Partitions, stating front core seperation and lack of penetration. They had seen too many bullet failures with the partition. So since they probably have seen more game shot than most ..............I will assume that they know what they are talking about.

quote:

Originally posted by allen day:
The Accu Bond shows a lot of promise...
AD

That is what I thought, then I shot a few deer and Caribou with the 180gr. 30 cal. version and got terrible penetration (angling shots that barely made it to the vitals or in one case, failed to get to the vitals), not to mention, lower than advertised weight retention...
Below were a couple of Accubonds (what was left of them) after shooting 75-150 pound deer.




All of you can probably dig up my old threads on Accubond Fails on Deer or something to that effect.

Living near the Nosler factory, I simply ASKED them. The first fellow , maybe 10 years ago, told me NOT to use Partitions on deer sized game. Another shop worker told me last year to not use Partitions on high velocity rounds. On either of these use the Partition.

I try to get to the Nosler plant and Nosler's "Shooter's Pro Shop" once a year, at least. I will say, as much as I respect the Nosler family and their product line, that not all of their employees are experienced hunters.......

AD

Because I am such an inquisitive fellow, I always ask potential outfitters about bullets and calibers. Here are what a few have said to me:

Outfitter in Montana said:

"I like a soft bullet for elk and deer. A Hornady Interloct is all you'll ever need, so long as you choose the right caliber for the task. I don't like a partition on deer, it's just too good of a bullet. We've watched them blow right through deer at over 200 yards and even though we've had good hits, the tracking was longer than I like."

Outfitter in NM:

"I don't care what we're after, bring a tough bullet and put it in the shoulder if at all possible. We really like the partitions, they work every time, anything stronger than that is gravy, but the partitions are cheaper. Most of all, we just want you to know your rifle and please practice before you come."

Idaho guide:

"If you load your own and know what your load will do, bring it. I just want you to be comfortable with your firearm. But I have to tell you, I like the hunters that bring a tough bullet like a partition. The key is to load them to the manufacturers recommendations. Partitions are at their peek performance at 2400-2600fps. Be sure to break the shoulder too." Some of the properties we hunt have deep ravines and I'd prefer you put them down."

It never ends.

Doc, you're right it NEVER ends, and I guess that's part of the fun !

AD

Interesting shortrange, I've only spoken to maybe a dozen diff. exp. african PHs & most LIKE the partition for plainsgame. FWIW, I have only ever recovered one NP, form all kinds of diff. angles so?

quote:

Originally posted by short range:
At a recent Rocky Mt. Elk Show, I asked several PH's from South Africa what bullet they recomended, all but one were totally aposed to using Nosler Partitions, stating front core seperation and lack of penetration. They had seen too many bullet failures with the partition. So since they probably have seen more game shot than most ..............I will assume that they know what they are talking about.

Is it me or does it seem like you have to be a PH in Africa to be any kind of "authority" on bullet performance?

I'm rather indifferent to this statement but I must admit that I have always been puzzled why most hunters think that the PH in Africa are the highest authority on bullet performance. I hold anyone in high regards so long as they have some experience to share. I can promise you one thing I sure know what the hell I'm talking about too, as do all of us, at least I hope. If I ever have a bad experience with any bullet, believe me, I'll tell the world, even if it is my beloved TSX (or partition).

Africa is in my future but right now there's just too many game animals here in North America that are doing a fine job of satisfying my hunting desires.

quote:

Originally posted by Doc:

quote:

Originally posted by short range:
At a recent Rocky Mt. Elk Show, I asked several PH's from South Africa what bullet they recomended, all but one were totally aposed to using Nosler Partitions, stating front core seperation and lack of penetration. They had seen too many bullet failures with the partition. So since they probably have seen more game shot than most ..............I will assume that they know what they are talking about.

Is it me or does it seem like you have to be a PH in Africa to be any kind of "authority" on bullet performance?

I'm rather indifferent to this statement but I must admit that I have always been puzzled why most hunters think that the PH in Africa are the highest authority on bullet performance. I hold anyone in high regards so long as they have some experience to share. I can promise you one thing I sure know what the hell I'm talking about too, as do all of us, at least I hope. If I ever have a bad experience with any bullet, believe me, I'll tell the world, even if it is my beloved TSX (or partition).

Africa is in my future but right now there's just too many game animals here in North America that are doing a fine job of satisfying my hunting desires.

Yep. It's NOT just you.
Opinion is opinion. If you lend too much credibility to any single persons opinion, they become an "expert."

Experts often disagree…

Doc, I agree with you, I really like Barnes Triple-Shock X-Bullets.

Well I hope you all don't mind me weighin in.

I have shot Noslers in just about every weight from 22 cal. up through the 180gr .308's. This might not be much to some or a ton to others. It has learned me one or two things about them through the years.

If your shooting them at small critters, that your presumably ont going to eat then crank up the rpms and let them roll. However if your shooting for table fare, then you need to keep in mind the end velocity of your intended targets. This means that for the BT's they need to be in the 2400 - 2800 fps impact range, for best overall performance. The partitions can be upped by a couple hundered feet or so. This is what I have found more often than not. Now either of them will still work dcent down to around 1900 fps impact velocity. I have tried this on more than one occaision in several different calibers. Both on clay banks as well as game and hogs. Thats the thing when you shoot single shot pistols. You are caught up trying to learn which bullets will work the best at your limited range of velocity.

More often than not folks get tooo caught up in trying to bust the spped records with their loads and the bullets aren't really made for it. Even the Barnes line has it's limitations, in certian calibers and velocities. Yes they will go through just about anything from one end to another but so will a lot of other bullets if used at different velocities. I have had Barnes blow off all four petals and not exit from a 120ish pound whitetail. I have also had them not go straight from impact to exit. Was it all dead yes. Did any of it run, yes. Were the shots bad, angled, glancing,... no. Just a LOT of ammo dumped into a LOT of critters over the years.

Does any of this make me an expert of anything, nope. It does however say that no matter what you call it, there ain't one brand, type, weight, or caliber of bullet that will be perfect for all situations or critters.

And yes I like Barnes also, as well as Nosler, Hornady, Sierra, and several other brands. Just depends on what I am after and what I am shooting at the time.

Ballistic Tips have been refined and revised as to jacket construction many times since their introduction. The hunting bullets coming out today are much tougher than the early ones.
If you had a really bad experience 15 years ago then you were shooting a much different bullet than the one for sale today.

Second, like most lead core bullets they perform more consistenly when you go "heavy for caliber". If Nosler made any mistake at all, it was/is producing a 120 gr 7MM or 180 gr .338 and their like. They may have an application but it encourages nimrods to load a 7STW to get the velocity and then go for big game.

If you use them with some common sense they can hardly be beat for killing power on medium game.

The person who STRONGLY recommended against using Bllistic Tips for deer sized game was the head of the Custom Shop at Nosler. He also took all phone orders. The next person who recommended against using them loaded over a certain velocity was also the person who ran the Custom shop at that time. They ought to know.

To answer a couple of questions:

To see photos, right click and select show picture.

Yes, the 180gr. Accubonds were shot at about 3000+ fps.

Impacts(from my shot and those of my two buddies)on deer occurred, from memory, between 60 yards and 125 yards. All shots barely penetrating more than 10-12 inches.

While I will never use them again for hunting, they were extremely accurate.

Did it ever occur to you that maybe Nosler makes more money on Partitions than on Ballistic Tips? If the head of the custom shop really said that he's trolling for dollars or if not that, needs to be fired for contradicting the interest of the company.

I don't care who he works for, he's plain ignorant if he believes that.

Edited to add that it is probably a misquote. If you know the gentleman's name I'l call right now and see if he backs up that statement.

I just spoke with someone in the Pro shop at Nosler. Apparently there is no custom shop, at least that is what I was told.

I believe the guys name is John. Regardless, he stated that he would like to know who made the comments about the Btips posted above.

The problem, he stated, with the Btips is the velocities which the reloaders are pushing them. The short mags, and ultra mags, etc. will be pushing these bullets beyond there envelope for which they were designed.

I told him that my 150 Btips from my 270 were averaging 2700fps. He said that is a great velocity for that bullet. Maybe that is why I've had such good success with them. I've never worried about the velocities being pushed to the cartridge's potential.

Regarding the partition, he denied any plans of bonding the front core of the partition. He said that the partition is designed to shed it's front core.

Regarding Nosler's new custom brass, he said that there is an American company making it to Nosler's specs, it is thicker and heavier. Nosler's shop trims to length, deburs, and chamfers the mouth. So far, sales are such that they are always on backorder.

I may have to try some since it is definitely not Remington brass.

i have said it before and will say it again ...the nosler partition has one major fault the back core slips out when you hit tough bone , and that is some thing not to be ignored
Saeed has shot noslers a fair bit and told me the same thing ...he stopped useing them as he found the back cores often slipped out
regards daniel

Doc, you are using the NBT within it's designed vel. envelope. The guys who have problems are pushing them way too fast & then taking 75yd shots. I would try 150grNBT in my .280 if he 160gr NP & NAB didn't shoot so well.

Hey Fred, I found some very old loading notes deep in my storage box that showed a few velocities.

I never had a chronograph years ago but one old guy at the range did have one and we checked a few from my .270. The scribbled note reads:

130 NBT, Ruger 270 factory, IMR4350, 2930

140 NBT, IMR4350, 2814

150 NBT, IMR4350, 2709

Using IMR4831 resulted in about 15 fps faster in all 3.

My brother had a featherweight Ruger with a 20 inch barrel.

His velocities were all about 60fps slower than mine, except for the 150. There were about equal.

Way back when, in my earliest days of reloading, I never knew the importance of a chronograph. I knew all the guys that taught me used them but that was one tidbit that they didn't explain very well. I thought they did it just for curiosity.

I would guess that this probably explains to a large degree my success with the bullet. I was always about group size. I never cared about speed. I would just practice with the load out to 250 yards or so, and learn where the bullet hit, much like the majority of hunters who know nothing about reloading.

Worked for me.

I don't want to be a smart A$$, but how does one know that they shed their rear core unless one finds it in a dead animal? If that's the case didn't the bullet ultimately work? It seems to me that the nosler is a great 'compromise' bullet where deer-elk or in my case deer-hogs might be encountered on the same hunt. How big bone, how fast and what bullets came appart were the bullets going when they rear came apart? Also, how many instances are we talking about. I'm intrested because I'm considering changing from a cup and core in my 7x57 and 30-06. capt david

quote:

Originally posted by captdavid:
I don't want to be a smart A$$,
but how does one know that they shed their rear core unless one finds it in a dead animal?
If that's the case didn't the bullet ultimately work?
It seems to me that the nosler is a great 'compromise' bullet where deer-elk or in my case deer-hogs might be encountered on the same hunt. How big bone, how fast and what bullets came appart were the bullets going when they rear came apart? Also, how many instances are we talking about. I'm intrested because I'm considering changing from a cup and core in my 7x57 and 30-06. capt david

Captdavid I believe you are on to something there.
ALL the bullets I have recovered came from dead animals.

quote:

Originally posted by Flippy:
There is ALL kinds of wounded, only ONE kind of dead...

What a recovered bullet looks like only matters in a catalog.

Then again, to recover a bullet the animal is presumably dead. Right?

I have used Nosler partitions almost exclusively for over 30 years, 160 gr in my 7mm Rem mag and 130 and 150 gr in my 270 Win. I have taken more than 50 big game animals with them including elk, moose, bear, kudu, zebra, wildebeest, red stag, etc. I have not had even one case of the rear core separating. While it may be possible for it to happen on rare ocassion, my experiance would indicate it is highly unusual and not something to worry about. (I think all bullets may encounter a freak set of circumstances that can cause a failure on rare occasion)

In probably 60% or more of the bullets I have recovered, the front half is wiped off; but they are designed that way. As long as I continue to see these type of results Nosler partitions will be my "go to" bullet.

I am a 47 year old hunter of some experience.I have killed more than my share and been in on at least that much again. Not to blow my own horn, just to give some small degree of qualification to speak. Nosler Partitions to me are the standard of comparison.They are reliable and rapid killers of all well hit game. Ballistic tips are a softer bullet and work well on deer. Nothing larger please

with the nosler partition im only conveying the experiences i have had ...i was useing the 180 gn nosler in my 06 at a velocity of 2810 fps ,and that is a pretty moderate velocity for the partition ,the back core slipped out weather the range was 30m or 150 m it made no diffrence when heavey bone was hit ...ie spine ....the animals in question were wild brumbies and with all due respect when you start shooting large numbers of animals in a short period of time you actually start seeing things in a diffrent light.... here in australia there are no bag limits so what some people may shoot in a life time as far as numbers go i can shoot that in a week or sometimes even less and belive me when you start choping up animals and following bullet paths you learn a awful lot real quick
daniel

quote:

Originally posted by M 98:
...the back core slipped out...
daniel

Daniel, do you mean the lead core insert separated from the metal cup (jacket),
or the front of the bullet came off?

How many times did this occur out of how many kills?

I don't understand the nature of the failure.

the back core slipped out ,the noslers were fine on frontal shoulder shots side on shots but you hit hard bone like the spine and you had a partition without its back core
this time around l recovered two from the sixteen brumbies i shot that had the rear core come out,.....you have a talk with Saeed and he will tell you what results he had with nosler partitions....also several of my friends have recovered there noslers with the rear cores missing
daniel

quote:

Originally posted by M 98:
the back core slipped out ,the noslers were fine on frontal shoulder shots side on shots but you hit hard bone like the spine and you had a partition without its back core
this time around l recovered two from the sixteen brumbies i shot that had the rear core come out,.....you have a talk with Saeed and he will tell you what results he had with nosler partitions....also several of my friends have recovered there noslers with the rear cores missing
daniel

I would like to have more statistics to look at.
2 out of 16 is 13%. I don't know if that's good or not.

I would have been against Nosler a year ago. I never gto the results on paper I was looking for as far as accuracy went.

I feel if I can not hit what I aim at what is the point. Stuck with Sierra and Swift for all of my shooting with great success. I have recently converted to the Accubonds which shoot better than I thought possible for a "hunting" bullet. Looking forward to letting loose on deer or elk this year if drawn. Still looking for the downside and compromise of the Accubonds even with 50-60% retention.

Seems that many of you are for Noslers and some are against, each has their own particular favourite and as ever correct bullet selection and placement are the main criterion applied, if it works for you then thats just fine.

Of those of you that have that have used Accubonds in the field, how do you find they compare in both accuracy and equally importantly, in terminal performance to Ballistic Tips?

JT

M 98!

I find your experience quite interesting. I have recovered very few Nosler partitions and have never seen one that I did recover with the back core missing. But then I haven't hit many in the spine. Did the partitions break the spine? If they did I really wouldn't care if the back core did come out, as an animal wth a broken spine is a dead animal. Spines are tough going for any bullet. By the way exactly what is a brumbie? And how much do they weigh?

465H&H

465
a brumbie is a wild horse and they weight what ever a horse weighs 600-700 lbs ....the brumbies went down like lightening had struck them ...i dont think the issue here is weather the bullet killed them ,i think its the way the bullet performed and loosing the back core is not what inspires confidence
onother poster here on AR...LORENZO ...posted a picture of a 416 NP losing its core i think it was a water buffulo
i think to many people are so obssesd with nosler partitions that they find it hard to accept that they do fail ...i still use them and will continue to use them as i think they offer the best compromise of a bullet that holds together at short range but also expands at LONG range on light game ...if you have a bit of a read around its starting to become evident that the tsx are a lot more accurate than the older barnes x but they still have NOT solved there problem with there bullets expanding ....how ever i some times wonder weather for the barnes x to really work propley
they need to be used on game which have thick tough hides and create enough resistance for the proj to actually expand
i know i got wonderful results useing the 200 gn TSX from my 06 last year , i shot four scrub bulls 3 out of the four dropped in there tracks bellet penetratin was UN BELIVABLE and the exit wounds were large....
regards daniel

Varmint weights on "big" game work--shot lots of hogs with my .22-250 and 55 gr BTs. Last trip I killed two with one shot. 55 gr BTs at 3580 fps. Both hogs were hit in the head, and both had penetrating wounds. The closer one lost the top of his skull, the second one just had a through and through hole. Both dropped in their tracks. I also use them in my 7Mag on hogs and whitetails. Have not had a failure in probably 50 animals taken, and have not had to track any of them more than 25-30 yards.