Here's a recoil table to help make a decision...

http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm

Having read all the posts on this subject, here are my thoughts. During the black powder days, hunters got close and placed their shots in as precise a manner as possible.
Prior to Marlin bringing out their model 1881 and Winchescher, their model 1886, rounds like the 45-60 and 45-75 shooting 300 gr. lead bullets were considered reasonable for elk out to at least 100 yards, give or take 25 yards.
I have done some playing around with a Winchester 94 Angle eject and iron sights in .45 Colt using the Lyman #457191 300 gr. cast bullet loaded to about 1,600 FPS. A very close duplicate of the 45-60 and 45-75 rounds. It shouldn't be too difficult to get the same speed with a 300 gr. bullet from a rifle in .44 magnum. Now, I would imagine that if one could get withing 100 yards, and placed one of those 300 gr. bullets in the boiler room, there'd be liver in the pan at camp that night. Recoil is a bit up there, but not too bad. Accuracy is only fair as the rifling twist is a bit too slow for 300 gr. bullets. Still, it'll shoot close enough for an elk's kill zone. I don't know what the twist rate is a a .44 cal. rifle, but it is something to look at.
With that said though, there's been a hell of a lot of elk taken with the old 30-30. I think that the .308 with a reasonably stout bullet would work just fine, and a .358 Win. with a 250 gr. bullet the cat's meow, but then I'm a big fan of .35 caliber rifles. Recoil from a .358 can be a bit stout with 250 gr. bullets loaded to full power though, so take that into consideration In a 7mm, I would be more inclined to go with the 7x57 and work up a good 160-175 gr. load than the 7-08. It's hard to use the heavier bullets in the 7-08 without them intruding into the powder space, where the 7x57 was designed to use 175 gr. bullets.
I have a right shoulder that was injured in a fall two years ago that hasn't healed up quite right. Keeps me from doing much shooting with my harder kicking rifles, although they still get taken out; just not shot as much as I would like. I had planned to work up a load for my 7x57 with the 160 gr. Nosler using W-760 powder. Supposedly, W-760 and H-414 are just different lots of the same powder. Anyway, I have worked up one load with the 140 gr. Nosler Ballistic tip that runs 2800, far above any book loads. I'm thinking that 2550 to 2600 with a 160 gr. Nosler PT is safely within reach in my rifle, and wouldn't traumatize that should much. Even staying within book maximums, that load would be a good killer and easy on the shoulder.
Everyone knows that loads for the 7x57 are deliberately kept low due to the weak 1893 and 1895 Mausers that are in such great supply. Sure didn't help what is one great cartridge.
Being a person of experimental nature, I will push the envelope in my rifles, but never do I recommend anyone do so. Anyone that does try this, does so at their own risk.
Paul B.

Hope I don't step on too many toes with this...but if I do I'll try to make 'em real flat!

The .44 wouldn't be my first choice for elk, in pistol or rifle, but the truth is that out of a rifle the .44 Mag loaded with 300 gr. bullets falls somewhere in the middle of performance listed for many of the 300 gr. loads for the 45-70. I see such loads ranging from 1300 to 1800 fps +/- depending on source and application. My .44 is accurate at the mid 1500 fps range and has produced a bit over 1600 fps within published data specs., this with 300 gr. paper patch loads. Pecos, you may have had a lemon with your 77/44, mine is trouble free. It's smallest group to date out of some 600+ rounds is .85" at 100 yards. The working load hover in the 1"-1.75" range for 3 shots, if I do my part off a rest, and it is repeatable. The bullet appears to have a BC in the .240 range. I gotta say, at this loading the recoil is...a) Hard to miss, b) Sharp, c) stout. Take your pick, it isn't a combo for the recoil shy. I do think it sacrilege to load this cartridge with bullets less or more than 300 grains, for pistol or rifle. Probably some of my opinion seeping through.


While recognizing that the 300 grain bullet from the 45-70 may not be the best choice for anything, it is a common loading both now and in the past. I've never heard anybody question the cartridges ability to kill an elk. Or a buffalo for that matter.

IF I were aproaching this problem I would not burden the shooter with a long list of don'ts, like don't shoot here, or there, or beyond this distance, etc. I'd find a moderate cartridge such at the 6.5x55 or maybe the 7x57, and mate it with a rifle of 7 lbs or a bit more, and be done with it. It should not be your mission to enable the "handicapped" in this regard. They can either handle an appropriate firearm or not. If not, perhaps they should chase prairie goats with a lightweight something or other, or maybe just prairie dogs with a .22 rf. Maybe next year they will graduate. JMO

Scott, my advice would be the same regardless of who the hunter is. The issue to me is not, "Will the 44 mag kill an elk?"

The issue is sending an "ify hunter" off armed with an "ify rifle." There are way too many accounts on these forums of guys hitting elk with mighty powerful rifles and still have hell bringing them down.

I picked up your question about killing them "humanely" and that's your common sense talking to you. You know yourself this isn't a very bright idea.

Whatever roll you are playing in this saga, use your influence to get this person a suitable rifle and teach them to shoot it right. Then you won't have to worry. Now or ever.

That's true is everything in life. Do it right the first time and then you won't have a mess to clean up afterwards.

Perceived recoil is a very subjective thing, but if a person is "recoil conscious", but wants to hunt elk, I think that person would be better served with a good 7mm-08, or .308 Win. The recoil from most rifles isn't stiff, and these two calibers are, in my opinion, much more versatile than a .44 Mag. carbine.



One of my hunting partners uses a Browning BLR in 7mm-08, for elk, and has killed several with it. My cousin has killed 22 bull elk with his old Win. Featherweight 70 .308 Win. I would bet that perceived recoil from a stiff hunting load in a .44 Mag. carbine would be at least as sharp as that from a 7mm-08.



I've not hunted elk with a .44 Mag. carbine, but have shot quite a few rounds through Marlins, and I think the recoil is about equal to my Rem. 700 BDL .308 Win.



Just my opinion. L.W.

I don't understand why anyone hunts deer or larger came with pistol calibers like the 357 and the 44. Unless you just like to hunt with pistols I don't see the need when there are tons of fine rifle calibers available. the 44 and the 357 just flat out don't deliver the energy plus they are inheritaly inaccurate cartridges compared to rifle rounds. If you have seen an elk up close they are truly massive and majestic animals, If I wounded a really nice bull I am certain it would bother me the rest of my life. These animals derserve to be humanly and cleanly killed get yourself a 308 and call it good.