Kahles Scopes

10 January 2002, 13:57

GeorgeS

Kahles are not as bright as Zeiss, Swarovski, or Schmidt & Bender. They are about the same as the Leupold V-X III (to my eyes at least).

You should investigate the Zeiss Conquest line of scopes. They are available for as little as $369 for a 3x-9x.

George

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Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!

10 January 2002, 14:43

<Bill>

I have a Kahles 1.5-6 scope with a 30mm tube and super heavy duplex. I think it was designed for dangerous game hunting. Only thing I dislike about it is the relatively short eye relief.

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www.rifleshooter.com

Save a plant, shoot a deer!

10 January 2002, 16:22

HunterJim

Corey,

Swarovski owns the Kahles line, and you can think of it as their lower price version.

I used a 30mm Kahles 1.5-6X on a hunt in Zim last September, and it performed well. The only reason I have it is it came on the rifle. It has their #7 heavy plex reticle. Adjustments are "honest", in that they go where they are supposed to. The tube is aluminum, and I scratched it up on the hunt.

For cost-effectiveness, it is pretty hard to beat Leupold. They have good eye relief too.

jim dodd

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"if you are to busy to
hunt, you are too busy."

11 January 2002, 09:51

aHunter

One big advantage of Swarovski and Kahles scopes is that they are still available in steel.

IMHO Kahles are very reliable and durable, but I can only speak from experience for the fixed power scopes.

I have one that is nearing 40 years.

Good shooting! H

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10 January 2002, 22:12

HKman

I have a Kahles 4-12 x 56 with german No. 1 reticle on my Steyr SSG rifle. It was a sale offer, so I bought it and I did not regret the buy so far. The scope is reliable and accurate, I would recommend it to others.

11 January 2002, 01:57

Daydreamer

I own two Kahles, an old 7x56 and a new 1,5-6x42. Very good Austrian quality (OK im austrian too - got to be proud of them

The 7x56 is for hunting boars at night - you wouldn't belief how good you can see with it in the dark.

The eye-relief of the new line is 9cm/3,5" and the view of sight on 1,5 is 26 meters (!) at 100 meter, guess this is a real advantage for DG hunting and I use it for driven boar in Austria.

The new 1,1-4x24 has a view of sight of 36 meters (!!!) at 100 meters - I don't think there is any other scope on the market that offers that!?

The oculars on the new scopes have 43mm / 1.7" gives a good picture and is very fast for quick shots on moving targets.

I am very satisfied with it, service is also good, I visited the company here in Vienna to check a scope.

I will take a 1,1-4x24 for my future 450NE 3 1/4, 750$ here in Austria.

Franz

11 January 2002, 13:47

<JohnT>

IMHO the optics on a Kahles are not as good as a Vari X III Leupold & tests on light transmission show it is quite poor in this regard. This is contrary to popular belief.

Before you buy any expensive optics get John Barsness Book "Optics for the Hunter". Best $25 investment.

If you want to spend the big bucks get the Zeiss or Swarovski & you will not be disappointed. However if you want the best value get Leupold. Don't go half way, then you'll end up spending double to correct your first mistake.

The steel tube thing is a bit overrated. Aluminium is plenty strong & lightness is the way to go especially for heavy recoiling rigs.

Regards,
JohnT

12 January 2002, 03:37

1894

I had a kahles 6x42 on my Enfield which I shot thousands of rounds through and stalked with. It was completely reliable and I honestly couldn't tell any difference between it and my Zeiss or Swarovski 6x42s. The factory sent me replacement turret caps free of charge.

15 January 2002, 12:13

Greg R

I have 3 Kahles 3-9x42 scopes with TDS reticle. While I prefer the Swarovski and Zeiss scopes that I have on other guns, I like the Kahles because I can get the TDS reticle in a fairly compact and bright scope. I have been playing with the TDS reticle for about a year now and am very impressed with how fast and accurate it is for long range shooting. You'll like the Kahles, but it still isn't as bright as the Swarovski or other Euro scopes. I like them better than Leupolds, though. It seems to my eye like Leupolds give everything a yellow tint.

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Greg Rodriguez
Mombasa Trading Company
www.mbogo.net
(281) 494-4151

17 January 2002, 06:59

<monz>

Iï¿½ve been looking at a Kahles Helia 3-10x50 for a time and finally bought it this morning. Mostly cause the price will raise about 35% next week here in Sweden.I think that the Kahles is way better than the Leupold. Europeans are the only ones that can make good optics.
No, honestly... The german and austrian scopemakers have longer tradition and experience of making scopes good for night hunting.
I would place the Leupold in the same category as Bushnell and Weaver. The optics are not better than that.
Kahles together with Zeiss, Schmidt&Bender and Szarowski is the NO1.league. They leave all the others behind.
Iï¿½ve only heard americans who preferr a Leupold instead of a german/austrian scope, strange...
For my 9,3x62 Wild boar rifle I have a Zeiss 3-12x56 and you cant beat that optic quality...

17 January 2002, 09:10

Fritz Kraut

quote:
Originally posted by monz:
For my 9,3x62 Wild boar rifle I have a Zeiss 3-12x56 and you cant beat that optic quality...

You canï¿½t beat that price either...

Honestly,

Fritz

[This message has been edited by Fritz Kraut (edited 01-17-2002).]

18 January 2002, 06:53

<monz>

Fritz!
7000 aint that expensive for a brand new Zeiss. I wanted to buy a Helia cause I like em, but came across this one and got it cheap.

19 January 2002, 18:05

KuduKing

I've found the 30mm Kahles to be much brighter than any Leupold. They are heavy in the steel model though.

I don't care for the European optics, even though they are somewhat brighter than the American scopes. They are bulkier, heavier and lacking in eye relief, and often lacking in English adjustments. We don't hunt at night in the USA so paying THREE times the price for a bulky silly Euro scope makes no sense for me.

19 January 2002, 19:48

Buell98

KuduKing-

It is true that some of the top models of the European brands cost 3 times more then say a VariX3, but Leupold has that LPS that rivals the price of the more exspensive models of say Zeiss. I would easily pay 300 more to get a much more quality peice of equipment. When I look through a Leupold the actual "circle" seems much smaller then that of a comparable Zeiss I looked at the same time. Also, Leupold reticles tend to look red in some angles, whereas the Zeiss' reticle remained dark black the entire time. Just something to think about.

I don't get why some people pay several thousand for a rifle, but wont splurge a few hundred more for a much better scope....

I will never buy a Leupold. I just don't like their looks nor do I like their scopes. That big GOLD ring pisses me off...

22 January 2002, 07:20

<monz>

BUELL, I agree 100%. Iï¿½ve owned a Leupold 3-9x40. The only good thing about that scope was the German NO1. reticle which I had to order specificly. Since we hunt a lot at night here in Sweden You must have a good (european) scope. Leupold is S**t.
A Leupold aint lighter than the european light metal models.
AND you have to bring a dam**d coin or something to adjust it at the range, brilliant idea....not.
Spend some more $ and get a good scope that will last a lifetime and more...

22 January 2002, 13:29

<AWB>

I have a 1.5-6 by 42 on a .300 Win Mag. I use it for Boar and Deer. I can only say that the scope is superb with the light gathering qualities being first rate.

22 January 2002, 22:15

Fritz Kraut

quote:
Originally posted by monz:
Fritz!
7000 aint that expensive for a brand new Zeiss. I wanted to buy a Helia cause I like em, but came across this one and got it cheap.

Hmmm... Do you mean 7000 Swed. crowns ($700) is that a rather good price. But I think that about 10000-12500($1000-1250) crowns would be a more realistic price. Itï¿½s a superior scope, but itï¿½s an awful lot of money.

Fritz

23 January 2002, 11:01

<monz>

Yes Fritz thats right itï¿½s 7000 Swedish crowns.
Tror du att jag skulle tycka sjutusen dollar var billigt

23 January 2002, 11:17

<LiMe>

mï¿½ste dï¿½ ta och frï¿½ga var monz kï¿½pte sin zeiss =D det billiaste ja hittat hittils ï¿½r pï¿½ kjells vapen fï¿½r 7700... tycker faktiskt inte det ï¿½r sï¿½ dyrt med tanke pï¿½ att de zeiss som sitter pï¿½ pappas bï¿½ssor ï¿½r kanonfina! kan knappt vï¿½nta tills den dan han trillar av pinn... ; ) (skï¿½mtar) kolla bara pï¿½ vad zeissen kostar i USa sï¿½ inser man att 7000 ï¿½r ett riktigt bra pris... fï¿½rdrar att ta pris dividerat pï¿½ antal ï¿½r det hï¿½ller nï¿½r ja kï¿½per prylar =D

the reazon to why i am writing in Swedish is that i donï¿½t want all the americans to come and buy all our cheep ziess scopes.. =D

24 January 2002, 05:12

<monz>

LiMe! I bought it at Vapencentralen in Malmï¿½.
The list price is 7700 but i got it cheaper since it was the last one they had in stock.
They do sell Zeiss scopes for netto price
(inkï¿½p+moms=kundens pris)
I love that scope and wont change. The only thing about it is that its heavy, 770 grams.
Add that to the 3,5 kilos that my Carl Gustaf weighs+200grams for a clip with four 9,3x62`s and one in the chamber.

24 January 2002, 08:34

<LiMe>

yes i know, it is a little bit more expensive than other scopes, but i think that it is well placed money... my father has scopes with 56 and 42 mm linces and i think that they are so much clearer than the leupold scope wich are on ours sako Wixen 222r. will put zeiss or schmidt&bender scopes on the rifles that i will buy in the future...

25 January 2002, 15:16

KuduKing

All you Euro hunters should definitely buy Euro scopes. Since you sit in blinds and blast animals at night at known ranges, they are perfect scopes for you. The fact that they are overly bulky and heavy and dont allow a good cheek weld is of no consequence for your style of hunting.

In the USA, we generally get off of our butts and walk trails and climb mountains and so we appreciate lightweight scopes that allow us to get a quick sight picture due to low mounting. We shoot with our heads down here, which is why most of your Euro rifles with dropping combs don't fit Americans, and sell like crap here.

The Leupold LPS is complete joke here in USA. It was designed to give Leupold a huge bulky heavy scope to sell in Europe to you folks. No one with any real hunting experience in the USA uses that turkey.

I don't doubt the optical "superiority" of the Kahles, Swarovski, Zeiss, etc over Leupold VX series. It's just that it isn't necessary, as the Leupold works fine in the USA, and anywhere else that people hunt sunrise to sunset. And the tradeoff in weight, bulk and eye relief of the Euro scopes is frankly ridiculous for the American hunter.

25 January 2002, 16:25

<Caveman>

[QUOTE]Originally posted by LiMe:
[B]mï¿½ste dï¿½ ta och frï¿½ga var monz kï¿½pte sin zeiss =D det billiaste ja hittat hittils ï¿½r pï¿½ kjells vapen fï¿½r 7700... tycker faktiskt inte det ï¿½r sï¿½ dyrt med tanke pï¿½ att de zeiss som sitter pï¿½ pappas bï¿½ssor ï¿½r kanonfina! kan knappt vï¿½nta tills den dan han trillar av pinn... ; ) (skï¿½mtar) kolla bara pï¿½ vad zeissen kostar i USa sï¿½ inser man att 7000 ï¿½r ett riktigt bra pris... fï¿½rdrar att ta pris dividerat pï¿½ antal ï¿½r det hï¿½ller nï¿½r ja kï¿½per prylar =D

YEAH...I AGREE, THATS WHAT WE ARE ALL SAYING DOWN HERE IN SOUTH TEXAS FOR SURE!!!!!!!!!

26 January 2002, 00:41

<LiMe>

so corey... did you understand anything of what i wrote?

the thing I mean is that here in sweden we can buy leupolds V-x 2 for like 500 bucks, and te zeiss for like 700. quite a easy thing for me to chose scope...

26 January 2002, 02:33

Pete E

KuduKing,

I know you guys live in Gods Country, but where you hunt, don't you have like shadows and overcast days?? Do you hunt during the short days of winter???

How long does it take to become an expireneced deer hunter in the US??? In most States it must take a long time with their short firearm seasons and small bag limits per season.....

Pete

26 January 2002, 22:44

<monz>

KuduKing!

Ten years ago the European scopes where bulky and heavy. Today they are light and smooth. Kahles Compact series, Zeiss V series, S&B new series and Swarowskis New Habicht... All of them above are as smooth and light as a similar Leupold.
The only advantage that Leupold had (weight) does not exist any more.
OK, there is the price but you get what you pay for...

27 January 2002, 12:12

dan belisle

Pete E, in some of the southern states the limit is two deer per day, and the season runs for a couple months. Lots of chances to hone your skills. As to the scope questions, yes some of the European scopes are better optically. But are they worth the cost differance? It depends where and how you hunt. Most North American hunting allows shots twenty minutes to one half hour before sunrise and after sunset. If you want the best "dark" performance, pay the money and carry the weight. But for most of our hunting, it really isn't a requirement. FWIW - Dan

27 January 2002, 12:39

Pete E

Dan,

I can't argue about Leupold being good value for money...especially in the States..i would say a used 6x42 M8 leupold as to be a great value scope for deer hunting..
What i don't understand is when an American says they don't need good light gather capabilites from a scope...kinda like saying an average accrurate rifle will do...

Pete

27 January 2002, 13:09

Busa Dave

May risk some flack here but my VMV 3-12 when hunting Hogs, which we do here year round (including night) and there is no bag limit is without a doubt the best pc of glass that I have looked thru! Now I own or have owned most of the upper end makes over the years S&B, Swarovski, Zeiss, Kahles, Leupold, and Nikon. Kahales is right up there with the best of them but it is not quite at the VMV Line level or the Swarovski PH Line. Why do I say this you might ask well this some of you may find interesting.

Last summer I finally saved enough to get the ultimate long-range pig rifle (at least in my opinion) the AAI AWM in 338 Lapua. The S&B Scope I really did not want because of the 34mm tube so I went down to SWFA for those of you know of them. David and I discussed several scopes and then put all of them on the table (Zeiss, Swar, 30mm S&B, Night Force, LPS, Kahles. David then opened the back door to the building and I spent the next 20 minutes comparing sharpness, clarity, color, and eye relief at different magnifications while sitting in the air conditioning. It is telling that some scopes pick up the heat as it is reflected and how some scopes pick up the detail of the bark on a limb of a tree that is shaded by the leaves better than others. It is very eye opening to have all of these products in front of you and compare them in real world conditions. The only one of the bunch that I would not buy is the Night Force as it was clearly not in the same league as the others but remember I was looking for a scope that would pull duty at night as well and with what I had read about the NF decided to give it a look see. Hope this helps and the bottom line is this---the rifle I use for quite a bit of my short range hunting here in Texas and Colorado is a 30-06 with a 2.2 x 9 Kahles that I have had for about 10 years and was the first Euro glass I had purchased!

DWM

28 January 2002, 04:02

<Guy Kish>

Does anyone have any idea what the price of a used Kahles 8x56 scope is? My friend has one in excellent condition.

28 January 2002, 22:20

<Husky>

Guy Kish,
You could buy an used Schmidt & Bender 8x56 at www.torsbohandels.com for ~USD 350 or an used helia 2,2 - 9x42 Light for ~USD 450.

/Husky

29 January 2002, 06:07

1894

quote:
Originally posted by KuduKing:
.
In the USA, we generally get off of our butts (snip) and sell like crap here.

My aren't we anal. I was surprised you didn't mention the glaring (pun) advantage a Loopold has. It is the worlds no1 scope for ass shooting. More asses are shot using Loopolds than any other brand of scope! It's pretty good for shooting off mouth too....

29 January 2002, 16:26

<Jagermeister>

I think anyone complaining about the weight of a Schmidt and Bender needs to get off their ass and deal with it and stop bitching about a few ounces difference. The tough American hunters should be able to handle it, no?

PS...Leupold sucks

29 January 2002, 17:03

<Guy Kish>

I live in the US. So I don't think it is practical. Although I did do some business with the Swedish goverment at one time.

quote:
Originally posted by Husky:
Guy Kish,
You could buy an used Schmidt & Bender 8x56 at www.torsbohandels.com for ~USD 350 or an used helia 2,2 - 9x42 Light for ~USD 450.
/Husky