So I am looking through the latest remington catalog and see this nifty little .410/22 combo gun. Seems like it would be bout perfect for some of my hunting around here. Not sure if anyone has shot one, or used one yet but was hoping someone had some input on them. I am torn between the .410/22lr and the .410/22wmr. The LR would allow some better flexibilty, the 22wmr more useful on coyotes and such. I guess the .410 would be fine for hammering yotes though either way. Shots would be very close, nothing more than 50 yards is feasible where I'd be shooting it. Heck, I may even load the .410 barrel with some 3" brenneke slugs and use it for deer/blackies.

Any ideas guys?

NHbwana

Is a 410 slug enough for deer and bear? I really don't know; I've just always heard 20 ga slugs were too light for serious hunting, much less the 410?

About the gun. I have seen several of the single shots and they seem to shoot OK though rough and stiff at first.

FWIW, I had an EAA IZH-94 Russian combination gun in 12 over 6.5x55 and it was the 2nd worst firearm that I've ever owned. I doubt that the Remington imported Russian firearms are much, if any, better, so I'd suggest that you might be better off by looking for an older Savage 24.

Having shot a few coyotes with the 22 Magnum, I can report that it doesn't "hammer" them. While the 22 Magnum and 22 Magnum/.410 combination are good choices for survival weapons, I believe that they are suboptimal choices for "normal" hunting situations. If you are looking to shoot deer and bear, I'd suggest that you buy a CF rifle or a shotgun in 20, 16, or 12 gauge.

Jeff

A 22/410 is a nice little small game number but nothing I'd use on deer, let alone bear. The Russian guns have always been a little to a lot rough. Your money will be better spent on a used Savage 24.

PS Last I checked the Russian Federation was a cronie capitalist oligarchy not a communist state but old habits die hard...

Well I guess I should have been more clear. I know for a fact the .410 slug is enough for a deer or a black bear. Seen it done to many times to argue otherwise. Anyone who says a 20 ain't enough needs to learn how to shoot. Or at the least shouldn't be involved in any type of muzzleloader hunting. I really am not worried about the caliber's or there "hammering" ability. Guys wouldn't mind popping a coyote at 200 yards with a 22 hornet, but balk at a 22wmr at 50 yards or less? Blah. Get a centerfire? Got plenty of them. Well thanks for the advice..but it'd be illegal where I plan to use it.

Hearing they may not be the most well crafted thing on the planet isn't surprising. What about yours did you really hate 260remguy? Or why was it such a POS? I can't imagine the Rem name has changed much of anything other than the price.

Maybe not commies in name anymore..but we know where the heart lies. Whats that saying..you can take the russian out of communism, but you can't take the communism out of the russian?

NHbwana

quote:

Originally posted by NHbwana:
I know for a fact the .410 slug is enough for a deer or a black bear. Seen it done to many times to argue otherwise.

I guess I know a person or two who've popped a deer with the 410 slug, but I'll stand by my estimation that the traditional 88 gr .390 is no powerhouse. But I've never heard from anyone who had used it on bear. Any details you can share would be greatly appreciated. TIA

My fathers neighbor kid. Shot a 198lb blackie out of my Dad's tree stand. H&R or a Rossi, can't remember. 3" brenneke, basically broadside from I believe about 20 yards out. Hit it about text book. Ran about 35 yards into the woods and fell over dead. No fuss no muss. Wasn't a spectacular event as relayed to me. No dramatic flips, or what not. Just ran a bit and expired.

As far as it use on deer. I believe it's either CO, or MT the second large deer on record was taken by an 11 year old with a single round form his .410. I may have the details a bit shady as I am going form memory.
While I certainly agree its no powerhouse, shot placement trumps all IMHO. Keep the distances sane (like an eastern deep woods deer stand), know where to hit em. And you can more or less be sure of a of a good clean kill. I mean dead is dead, if by a .410 or a .375H&H.
Sorry if my previous post seemed a bit crass. I didn't mean to come off as crass or flippant. I do get a bit annoyed by some peoples need to denigrate most any round that doesn't have an H&H, a belt, or magnum in the call letters. Not pointing fingers, just a general observation. I've done a whole lot of killing with a 30-30. And seen a fair amount done with what most would call meager rounds. Shot placement is really they key to any hunt, and doing the hunting before the shooting makes for a much better day. I'm not saying the .410 is for everyone, you have to have patience in waiting for your shot. You'll have to practice to know where your shots going. Hell I'm not even advocating it for anyone else. I know in my hands I can use it effectively.
Just so you get an idea though. A .40 caliber muzzleloader with a ball round has about the same ballisitics. Now thats no powerhouse for sure, but alot of game has fallen to those rifles. The brenneke load seems to really be an improvement from all I have seen and read in accuracy and killing power.

NHbwana

A few people i know use the CF versions of the Baikal combo guns, either 223/12g or 308/12g.
Ther are a bit rough, but they seem to work well enough to put game in the freezer.
If it were me, I'd look for an older Savage 24.
JMHO, best of luck with your choice.

I've posted the details of my dislike for the EAA IZH-94 that I had, so if you do a search you'll find my comments. Of course, my sample size of 1 isn't large enough to be a statistically valid reflection of the IZH-94 universe, but once was enough for me!

You can hunt anything you want with any firearm/cartridge combination that you want, if it meets the F&G requirements, but in my opinion the .410 shotgun slug is a suboptimal solution for anything larger than 60 lbs. about 99.9999% of the time. However, as with many things, YMMV.

The deer and turkey hunting kit that I keep in NH consists of a Remington 7 in 260, a Savage 24F in 223/20, and a Rossi 515 in 22 Magnum. The survival kit that I keep at my place in CO includes a Marlin 982S in 22 Magnum and a Rossi 515 in 22 Magnum.

Jeff

One of the biggest brown bears shot, was killed by an native woman that the bear ran into the loft of here cabin. There happened to be a single shot 22lr up there, and she shot the bear at point blank range into the eye... The bullet happen to make it to the brain and killed it...

Now, i've done a lot of brown bear hunting, and anytime you want to go take one with a 22, i'll go along with a vid cam and U-tube it for your widow... lol

In my opinion, just because something "can" be done, doesn't mean it "should" be done...

DM

Don't confuse a black bear with a brown. Kind of like comparing a Roe deer to an elk. I get your point though. And it is valid. I'm not going to say it's an ideal. But if your in the woods, and can get your shot, and it's legal. Who am I to say you shouldn't?

NHbwana

I have a 7x57 over a 12 ga Biakal IZH-94 which is the same as a Remington Spartan. The gun is stiff and not the greatest trigger but it is accurate and lethal on coyotes. I paid just over $300.00 for mine and it is my first choice for coyote hunting. My AR is my second.

Just because something is legal doesn't always make it "right". It was legal to own human slaves in the U.S. until 1863, but being legal never made it "right".

Jeff

And just because you have an opinion doesn't make it more "right" than anyone else's. Save the political hyperbole for something it may be more relevant towards. Somehow comparing slavery to the .410 being used on a black bear seems a bit absurd to me. Call me crazy.

NHbwana

A .410 is a bit light for 90% of the shooting I do, including squirrel hunting because it lacks range, so I don't see myself purchasing one of these combination guns. However, if you've got your heart set on one, go for it. You don't need anyone's permission to buy a new gun. Yet.

quote:

Originally posted by Tex21:
A .410 is a bit light for 90% of the shooting I do, including squirrel hunting because it lacks range, so I don't see myself purchasing one of these combination guns. However, if you've got your heart set on one, go for it. You don't need anyone's permission to buy a new gun. Yet.

Guess it depends who wins the next election. Uggh..

Nhbwana

quote:

Originally posted by NHbwana:
Don't confuse a black bear with a brown. Kind of like comparing a Roe deer to an elk. I get your point though. And it is valid. I'm not going to say it's an ideal. But if your in the woods, and can get your shot, and it's legal. Who am I to say you shouldn't?

NHbwana

Considering that i have hunted and harvested several of "both" there's NO confusion on my part what so ever...

I do NOT consider the .410 to be an adequate blk bear gun, and i personally would have no problem passing up a shot at one if that's what i was carrying. But, i realize some folks will take any shot they get...

DM

quote:

Originally posted by DM:

quote:

Originally posted by NHbwana:
Don't confuse a black bear with a brown. Kind of like comparing a Roe deer to an elk. I get your point though. And it is valid. I'm not going to say it's an ideal. But if your in the woods, and can get your shot, and it's legal. Who am I to say you shouldn't?

NHbwana

Considering that i have hunted and harvested several of "both" there's NO confusion on my part what so ever...

I do NOT consider the .410 to be an adequate blk bear gun, and i personally would have no problem passing up a shot at one if that's what i was carrying. But, i realize some folks will take any shot they get...

DM

Fair enough point. I don't mind you lumping me in with that crowd when I specifically said you need to take "your shot". Granted you know nothing about me or my hunting style, what game I have taken and the shots I took, or passed up. It's far better to assume something about me. It is your right. It seems a bit presumptive to pigeon hole someone into a nice easy label based on their opinion..you know after seeing what the round can do, if it differs with your own. Who am I to judge.
Nor do I mind that you don't agree based on your experience. Heck I tend to find that more compelling.
I do appreciate you not comparing it to the holocaust, pol pot, or the Chinese death march.

NHbwana

NHbwana

You asked to input and you got input. You can make a choice about what information you will accept and which you will reject. If you want to put me on ignore, that would be fine with me.

Jeff

No need for ignore. Input is fine, what you said wasn't input. It was insulting,insensitive and uninformed. Save the self righteous act for the kids.

NHbwana

NHbwana,

It should serve your purpose. I've never used that particular model, but it should work well for the $. As far as a tossup between the .22lr or the .22wmr, I'd stick with the lr. JMHO Very versatile guns, and I'm still searching for a reasonable Savage 24 in .22/.410

gd

What is "the Chinese death march"?

Jeff

The 75 paces from the buffet line to the shitter.

2FF!

Jeff

What part of my reply was "insulting, insensitive, and uninformed"?

Upon reflection, I realized that I was wrong about the date that U.S. slaves were legally freed. The last U.S. slaves were freed by the final ratification of the 13th Amendment to the Constitution in 12/1865. I was thinking that the Emancipation Proclamation on 01/01/1863 freed U.S. slaves, but the EP only freed slaves in those geographic areas of the C.S.A. that had been liberated by the U.S. Army.

Jeff

Except for point-blank behind the ear, a 410/22 RF isn't up to anything bigger than small game. I used a 410 slug for halibut and don't have much good to say about it.

Get/use something appropriate for deer and bears, and use the little BBF for its intended purpose...POACHING!

I also have a Biakal IZH-94 in 7x57R and 12 ga its puts the first 3 of 7x57 into one inch at a 100 shoots 12 ga slugs to the same pt of aim out ot 35 yards. The 12 ga barrel has a very tight choke. Its kind of heavy and stiff. It works I am not a great fan of combo guns. but it works.

I belive we in the US are not great fans of drillings and combo guns is we have very little need for them and we can own as many guns of differant kinds as we want no need to try and fit it all into one.

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:
I belive we in the US are not great fans of drillings and combo guns is we have very little need for them and we can own as many guns of differant kinds as we want no need to try and fit it all into one.

LOL - and I suppose that you can fit them all into the truck when you go hunting! The difficulty comes when you try and use more than one at the same time!

Over in Europe it is more common to hunt on foot - could have something to do with the popularity of these animals.

Rgds Ian

I guess you haven't seen our trucks.

Most of us don't hunt from them but we do usually have several hundred pounds of weapons and ammunition at the ready.

quote:

I belive we in the US are not great fans of drillings and combo guns is we have very little need for them and we can own as many guns of differant kinds as we want no need to try and fit it all into one.

I have a lot of use for them when I hike to the tops of our high and rugged mountains. I like to come off the hill with a deer and some blue grouse and chuckar...wild chuckar, not the pen-raised cup cakes at shooting preserves.

As a kid of 12 I came back once with a 5X5 Muley, 8 chuckar, and 15 valley quail...all with the same drilling.

I use a few drillings and combos.













FOUR DEILLINGS AND A SAUER PRE-WAR CAPE GUN/SXS SHOTGUN 2-BARREL SET...12/8x57JR AND 12/12.

Luv2safari....

Why did you have to do that????? Post all those wonderful pics?
The rest of my day will be spent in a glazed-eyed daze

As to their usefullness - I have never used one in the field but do not see how it can't be useful in the US???

I have hunted in Canada and was hiding in some bushes with a .280 in my hands looking for deer while geese were flying 30 yrds overhead and in season...the very next weekend on the same farm we drove out with shotguns to set up decoys and spotted 6 WT in the adjacent field - no rifles in hand!

I would love a drilling or combo and feel they are truly all round hunting guns.

L2S

Man, you have my sympathy.

Sad that after years of plenty, I see that you are down to your last few Drillings.

Damn this economic slump and the effects of the global credit crunch. Never fear, your brothers are here for you whenever there is a need for support and reassurance!

Rgds Ian

This all I managed to keep...

Prostate cancer ate up my gun safe pretty badly. I had to sell off my best ones and my double rifles to pay doctors and hospitals to keep me looking down the sights of the ones I managed to hold onto. It took 48 years to accumulate them and several weeks to watch most of them go away.

No regrets, however...I owned them, hunted them, and used them as assets when I needed them.

AND...I have started to accumulate some new "friends" in the safe.

I have found Combo Guns, Drillings, and Double Rifle Drillings to be some of the best hunting guns avialable any where.

My Wife, my 10 year old Nephew, and I have used them in NA and Zimbabwe with excellent results.

ANYWHERE fur and feathered game is in season at the same time these guns are A Number One.

I always love good porno. Great spread luv2. Packy

With respect......Why show pictures of your costly guns? This is a degenerating world; ANYONE looking at your pics might decide to rob you.....and anyone could find where you live.
It's a good feeling to be proud of your "stuff". I am proud of mine. But, I won't advertise the existence of my toys on a public forum as this one is. To me, there is no point to that.
Again, .....respectfully,
Alex

Conifer

Respectfully - please tell me where I live, by PM for security purposes of course!

I agree about the possibility of being targeted as a gun owner - however, the likelyhood ranks right up there with meeting Elvis - provided you don't post your contact details as well!

IMHO

Rgds Ian

Nope.....unwilling to make the effort to find you. I have nothing to prove. I offered an opinion ...if it's worthless, ignore it.

Many thanks - will consider my options!

Rgds Ian

some company made a reproduction of the U S Air Force survivalgun. it has a 22 Hornet over a 410. there is space in the buttstock to hold about 4 shotshells and 6 or so 22 hornet.

they also made this in 22 lr and 410.

it folds in half for easy transport and in't very expensive - maybe $300 ?

you can probably get a 22 or 22 mag insert barrel for your 410 for under $50