A shop near me has this gun in stock and I figured this is the place to get information. I'd rather have a double rifle, but have always found the drillings very interesting. The guy at the shop thought that it was probably built in the 50's. I'm unsure if it is cased. Was setting on their rack nect several Merkel, LC Smith and a Parker shotguns.

Any ideas about this gun? Age, value, etc...?

All I really know is that it is 16gax16ga x 8x57. I know very little about drillings, but handled this one yesterday. It had 3 cocking indicators on top of the reciever. The rear rifle sight automatically popped up when you switched it into rifle mode by pushing down a button in the safety and pushing the safety off. Wish I could be more informative.

Thanks,

David Walker

quote:

Originally posted by x2mosg:
A shop near me has this gun in stock and I figured this is the place to get information. I'd rather have a double rifle, but have always found the drillings very interesting. The guy at the shop thought that it was probably built in the 50's. I'm unsure if it is cased. Was setting on their rack nect several Merkel, LC Smith and a Parker shotguns.

Any ideas about this gun? Age, value, etc...?

All I really know is that it is 16gax16ga x 8x57. I know very little about drillings, but handled this one yesterday. It had 3 cocking indicators on top of the reciever. The rear rifle sight automatically popped up when you switched it into rifle mode by pushing down a button in the safety and pushing the safety off. Wish I could be more informative.

Thanks,

David Walker

x2mosgI had a Krieghoff many yrs ago in the 60s, that was a field grade chambered for 16-16 x 30-06! It was a shooting machine, and wish I still had it. The one you posted here is a high up-grade piece, and look absolutely new. That drilling is worth evey penney of $4K, if every thing works propely!

Go to the combo, drilling forum, and ask Loves 2 Safari about this, as he is about a knowledgable on Drillings as anyone I know!

Super rifle, I am thinking your gun sales guy is about right. It's not a newer decocker rifle.

Nice stuff, and yep its worth $4000.

It is old enough to be one of the very best, and new enough to possibly be chambered in 8X57 JRS, which would make it VERY desirable. It probably has 2 3/4" (70mm) chambers, too.

I'd love to have this Kreighoff, and $4,000.00 is about right in this market. In better times it was worth 5-6K, IMO. If in 20ga...6K easy, and in 12ga probably about 4.5-5K in the market today.

It looks like a late 50's to mid 60's gun to me. That was why I felt it would have std 2 3/4" shotgun chambers and be an "S" bore.

Thanks a lot fellows. I really like this rifle. I'd like to have it and in better economic times It'd already be in the safe. Things as they are, it's gonna take some thought and creative financing if I buy it. I really appreciate the information. I know little about drillings, but they've always intrigued me.

luv2, where would a guy find the markings for the chambers and the rifle chambering? I assume that would be on the underside of the monobloc. Or maybe on the flats of the reciever where barrels bear?

The only issue I personally have with this gun is that the L.O.P. is a little short. Just by feel I'd say it's around 13.25" - 13.5" maybe a touch shorter. It could be just the difference in the drop of the stock that makes it feel shorter. I'm sure it'd kill the value to alter the length of pull, correct?

Thanks again,

David

quote:

Originally posted by x2mosg:
The only issue I personally have with this gun is that the L.O.P. is a little short. Just by feel I'd say it's around 13.25" - 13.5" maybe a touch shorter. It could be just the difference in the drop of the stock that makes it feel shorter. I'm sure it'd kill the value to alter the length of pull, correct?
Thanks again, David

The LOP is easily fixed by installing a good recoil pad. Pachmeyr now makes the decellorator in the classic red color, which would look very good on that drilling! As far as the combi-cocking system, I'm not aware of the drillings, even today, being fitted with that system. In fact, the action on the drilling is most likely a Anson Deeley clone made by either Simpson, or Merkel, back in the late fifties, or early sixties. That alone would negate the 16 ga chambers being the short shell, and the rifle bore is most likely a .323" bore size, rather than the earlier .318" bore.

PS: If you do not buy this drilling, let me know where it is, I'll buy it in a New York minute!

Will do Mac. Give me a few days to study on it, then I'll send you a PM about it.

David

David,

You can easily date the Drilling.

On the underside of the chamber area of the barrels you'll see the Ulm Proof Mark. Directly underneath this there will be either 3 or 4 numbers. This corresponds to the month & year of Proof. Of course the action could have been made earlier and not assembled or Proofed.

If Proofed between January - September there will be three digits, from October - December 4 digits. The first one or two digits are the month, the last two are the year.

Example, 1004 would be October 2004 or 792 would be July 1992.

If you can take a photo of the underside of the barrels I can tell you exactly but I imagine if you take a look it will jump right out at you.

The Rifle Button operated rear sight is still in operation since there are no mounts already on the Drilling. This can be positive since sometimes the Claw or Pivot Mounts require adjusting the scope and /or LOP for each shooter's eye relief. I mention this because the rear sight is operated by a rod/wire in the rib that many Gunsmiths fail to re-connect when they mount/solder solid mounts to the barrels instead of hollowing out the portion of the mount that affords this small rod (actually a wire) to operate the sight.

Have fun with your consideration.

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by x2mosg:




PS: If you do not buy this drilling, let me know where it is, I'll buy it in a New York minute!

POACHER...

(...AND, I HAD TO COME BACK AND SLOBBER ALL OVER THE PICTURES AGAIN... )

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by x2mosg:
The only issue I personally have with this gun is that the L.O.P. is a little short. Just by feel I'd say it's around 13.25" - 13.5" maybe a touch shorter. It could be just the difference in the drop of the stock that makes it feel shorter. I'm sure it'd kill the value to alter the length of pull, correct?
Thanks again, David

The LOP is easily fixed by installing a good recoil pad. Pachmeyr now makes the decellorator in the classic red color, which would look very good on that drilling! As far as the combi-cocking system, I'm not aware of the drillings, even today, being fitted with that system. In fact, the action on the drilling is most likely a Anson Deeley clone made by either Simpson, or Merkel, back in the late fifties, or early sixties. That alone would negate the 16 ga chambers being the short shell, and the rifle bore is most likely a .323" bore size, rather than the earlier .318" bore.

PS: If you do not buy this drilling, let me know where it is, I'll buy it in a New York minute!

Combi-cocker?

Hmm modern Krieghoff, Blaser D99, and I think Heym.

quote:

Originally posted by D99:
Combi-cocker?

Hmm modern Krieghoff, Blaser D99, and I think Heym.

That Heym does not have a combi-cocking system! It is a treditional system, and a very good one as well!!

x2mosg
I will have to beg to differ a bit on the dating. Style points at an erlier date than suggested. The picture of the bottom of the action is not 100% but doesn't it say Sempert and Krieghoff? The triggers are pretty far back from the action which indicates a Blitz system, not an A&D.
I've owned a few krieghoffs from the fifties and sixties and they had a more modern look to them.
Go back and have a look on all the markings. I'm not 100% sure you will find the dating code but that would in itself be sort of a dating.

Its a stunning gun and I would have no reservations about buying it if it were in a shop close to me.

Cheers
K9_75

Damnit, ya'll are making this thing hard to resist. And I do not need to spend $4000 right now. Damnit!!!

David

David,

Don't get stressed.

Tell whoever's trying to sell it we're in a Buyer's Market, I mean we're in the middle of a recession and all.....

I saw a "Sale" tag attached to the triggerguard, must tell you something?

Gerry, I like the way you think. Might get 'em talked down a bit. This thing's got me stressed a bit. I love double guns, though I only own one over/under, I love the feel of the classics. The 16ga. is one of my favorite almost forgotten rounds. The 8x57 I have no experience with.

While we're talking about this gun, what is the lever on the bottom of the receiver? I figured it might be the rifle barrel selector, but the safety handles that. Maybe a barrel selector? Maybe an extractor/ejector switch?

Thanks,

David

quote:

The 16ga. is one of my favorite almost forgotten rounds. The 8x57 I have no experience with.

Nice Drilling...

My Krieghoff Semper drilling is champered 16-16-8x57jrs, and i've harvested everything from big moose and blk. bear on down without any problems at all. I would not have a problem hunting anything in Alaska and the lower 48 with my drilling except the "big" bears. I hunted and harvested brown bears for many years, and i consider the 8x57 just a bit light for them.

DM

To all my really good AR Friends,

Shit! I live in The Fatherland. I can probably drive within 80 Km's (50 miles) of my abode and locate 25 used (desireable) Drillings priced under €2100,- (or $3000.00) including a reasonable scope.

Attempt to bargan this Bitch down, period.....

Anyone know what the switch on the bottom of the receiver is for? Hope I'm not stupidly overlooking something obvious.

David

If it is a Blitz system (which it should be) then it is most likely a lever for removing the triggerplate. All parts of the locks are placed on the plate in a Blitz action and can, in this case, easliy be removed for service and cleaning.
//K9_75

Thank you K9. Would have never guessed that. That seems as it would be a great feature for maintainance and service.

David

So x2mosg did you buy it? Whould be a nice Christmas present. Very nice Drilling, with a very nice engraving. I will show these Pics to a Krieghoff specialist an tell you what type it is.

St

Nice Drilling. But I'd guess it's a little older than some here are supposing. I had a similar one that I bought from a retired Army Colonel, who had accepted it in surrender from a German officer during the war. I never dated it exactly. As a gunsmith, I've slugged a lot of 8mm bores & find a lot of S bores even back into the 1930's (that weren't marked). Some of the later small bores were marked "nicht fur S" (not for .323 bullet) I sure wish I had that one back (. I shot a lot of game, large & small with it. Great on a trip to AK where you run into all kinds of game. Or here in FL where I live & hunt.
As for double rifles (or double rifle drillings), I much prefer basic drillings, as an all around gun. DR's are romantic and interesting, but single shot rifles are normally all you need (and all I use) for non-dangerous game. Yet, to me, a single shot shotgun is about worthless (except flintlocks ;o). I use my 4 drillings for hunting, most of the time, and enjoy them immensely. With one exception, I've come to regret every one I've ever sold
Go for it. You'll be glad you did.. Better than having the cash sitting in a 2% CD someplace... See how easy it is to justify a "new" drilling

Ok David,i showed the pictures to one of the biggest experts on Krieghoff weapons (over 50 years of working at Krieghoff) and he got rather exited.

This is a real collector piece, its a pre war Krieghoff Model Waldschuetz with a so called "Patent system". K9 is completely right thats a Blitz system which is removeable together with the Triggerplate. Krieghoff built it only before war. We think the Drilling is from the 1930`s
Therefore the rifle caliber is most pobably 8x57IR wich means the .318 bore. But I dont think this is a major problem, the caliber is still manufactured in Germany and there are also all reloading components available.
From the pictures this Drilling was never really used and Drillings from this time in this condition are very rare pieces.
Ok,... David or Mac buy it.

Stephan

Damnit, you people are killing me. I want this gun so bad it hurts. I'm just trying to figure out how to finance it. If the economy were in a little better condition right now, it'd be a done deal. As it is, I'm sweating it. Maybe I could make a trade with them. Only problem with that is I promised myself I'd not sell or trade another gun. But, I got a couple that could be easily replaced. Something to think about.

Anybody wanna buy a Wby Vangurad Sub-MOA in 300 Roy? How bout a beat up Browning Citori that's just been rebuilt? Anybody got a need for a Browning Gold light 10? I kinda hate to part with any of 'em, but might have to. Decisions, decisions!

David

David,

Think of the drilling as TWO guns...makes sense, and helps rationalize buying one. I know from experience about 35-40 times over, regarding that for over a 50 year period. (Got my 1st at age 11) Rationalizing become easier and easier; they're "investments"...say that over and over.


stephan338's post makes it even more interesting, IMO. One from that era in this gun's condition is an exceptional buy for the price.

Bad news. I checked the webpage this morning. It's not listed anymore. I'll call the store tomorrow to make for certain. It was there yesterday morning, but gone today. Maybe someone got a really great Christmas gift. Sorry guys. Should've passed it along to one of you. Would've much rather seen it go to one of ya'll.

Will let you know if it's still there, but doubt it.

David

quote:

Originally posted by stephan338:
Ok David,i showed the pictures to one of the biggest experts on Krieghoff weapons (over 50 years of working at Krieghoff) and he got rather exited.

This is a real collector piece, its a pre war Krieghoff Model Waldschuetz with a so called "Patent system". K9 is completely right thats a Blitz system which is removeable together with the Triggerplate. Krieghoff built it only before war. We think the Drilling is from the 1930`s
Therefore the rifle caliber is most pobably 8x57IR wich means the .318 bore. But I dont think this is a major problem, the caliber is still manufactured in Germany and there are also all reloading components available.
From the pictures this Drilling was never really used and Drillings from this time in this condition are very rare pieces.
Ok,... David or Mac buy it.

Stephan

I had the idea that the Waldschutz was a lower end (forest protection) drilling, but did a little reading and saw there were 2 with that name. The pre-war Waldschutz was a high end drilling as this one obviously is. The later one came out in '53. BTW: one of the best references & entertaining works on drillings is the Klupps book "The Drilling".(recently available in English) I think Barnes & Noble has them @ 40 bucks. Be sure to wear a bib when perusing the pages... to keep the drool off your book

quote:

Originally posted by brayhaven:

I had the idea that the Waldschutz was a lower end (forest protection) drilling, but did a little reading and saw there were 2 with that name. The pre-war Waldschutz was a high end drilling as this one obviously is. The later one came out in '53.

You are right, the Waldschuetz was the first Drilling Krieghoff produced again after war and after rebuilding the Factory at Ulm. In 53 the forest department ordered 500 Waldschuetz as duty weapon for the forest wardens, but it was low end only concerning things like engraving and wood.

quote:

Originally posted by brayhaven:
BTW: one of the best references & entertaining works on drillings is the Klupps book "The Drilling".(recently available in English) I think Barnes & Noble has them @ 40 bucks. Be sure to wear a bib when perusing the pages... to keep the drool off your book

Thanks for the lead on the book. Just ordered it.

You'll get a kick out of the computer translations in the book.

It has some good information and wonderful photos, but you'll need to translate the translation at times.

The Klupps book X2. It is great and you WILL need a bibb. Packy