What's the worst that could happen, if a 8x57 (.323) cartridge was unintentionally shot in a rifle chambered in 8x60S (.323)? Or, would the 8x57 even fit and fire?

I think it would be fun to chamber a barrel in 8x60S, but I dont' want to create an accident just waiting to happen, since I'll have a 8x57 too. I suppose the folks with 8mm-06 have the same issue.

KB

Nothing will going bad, you get a nice fireformed case and no good precision!

If you allow me: if you use a good-quality new RWS case, you might just experience what M.F. described. If you use a reformed "imperial" casing (.30-06 or whatever), or that had already been formed, fired and stretched before, reloaded in a die set too low... well...

Carcano

Humm.

Looks like Graff is supplying 8x60S brass, so there's no need to form cases from something else. Even if I did, I presume the 8x60 won't go in the 8x57 chamber, but my question was about the other way around.

Naturally, 8x57 brass is plentiful, so no need to form it either.

I'm not sure I understand the last comment.

KB

quote:

I'm not sure I understand the last comment.

You didn't.
I have added a comma and an "or" to make it clearer.

Carcano

quote:

Originally posted by carcano91:

quote:

I'm not sure I understand the last comment.

You didn't.
I have added a comma and an "or" to make it clearer.

Carcano

Much better, now I understand clearly.

Regards,
KB

1. An 8x57 in an 8x60 chamber might not fire at all unless the gun is tilted with the muzzle up to place the cartride at the rear of the chamber.

2. A situation of gross headspace is in play. The cartridge would be pushed forward by the firing pin blow, where it would grip the chamber due to internal pressure, then expand rearward until the head meets the bolt face. This would cause significant case stretching and possibly or probably (depending on the condition of the brass), a head separation.

That's a very logical and easy to understand explanation. Certainly a situation to avoid.

I have no practical experience with this issue, so it's hypothetical, and hopefully remains that way. Case head seperation could be a surprise at least and dangerous perhaps.

Sooo -- hypothetically --- the extractor on the 98 Mauser would prevent the case being pushed forward, thus most likely it would fire, and logically thus just fireform, rather than seperate at the head.

Am I off-base or on-track with this so far?

Thanks,
KB

Until recently, military calibers were prohibited in Belgium. After WWII, it was common practice to ream out the plentiful K98's to 8x60S, in order to make them legal for hunting. Reloaders used to fireform cases by shooting 8x57JS in them. Surplus brass cased ammo fireformed nicely but steel cases would tear from shoulder to neck. However, I never heard of anybody being hurt or of a rifle destroyed as a result of this modus operandi.

quote:

Am I off-base

Yes you are.

A 8x57 may indeed fireform to a (very short-necked) 8x60 due to the case being held by a strong extractor claw (in the same way as .308 Win cases can fireform to a straight case in a .30-06 chamber). However, this procedure may easily result in overstretched cases which may soon rupture at the stretching ring near the case bottom.

Carcano

Carcano,
My question was asked in the context of making a mistake of firing a 8x57 cartridge in a 8x60 chamber, assuming a guy had such ammo and the 8x60 rifle. It's not something I would do intentionally, and certainly not to form 8x57 brass for reloading 8x60 ammo.

I'm considering having a barrel chambered in 8x60S, just because it's interesting. But I'll be using RWS or Graf new 8x60S brass. Some day, if I ever retire, perhaps I'll spend some time hunting with my nephew. The thought occurred to me that he might get confused and make the mistake of shooting 8x57 ammo in it. Of course I would never make such a mistake. But you know how easily some are confused with metrics. 8mm is 8mm, is it not?
Regards
KB

This is interesting!
How much excess headspace occurs when a cartridge headspaces on an extractor claw? How much is the chamber pressure lowered by firing an 8x57 in an 8x60 chamber?

I knew an old hunter, who was always wondering about his 8x57IS cases after firing - very short neck and a shoulder moved on...
After his death, his son sold this very fine BRNO smallring-Mauser to MF! It was a 8x60S - the old man has killed hundreds of boars and roe deer and some red stags with his special "8x57"!

Or the old hillbilly who had always fired 8x57 IS ammo in his 98 Mauser; and upon his death it was found out that it had been (re-)chambered for the 9x57. The oldtimer's mantra had been: "up to 50 metres, the rifle's accuracy is still quite okay!"

Carcano

I have a friend who hasn't sighted in his rifle for over 20 years, and he still goes hunting every year. I suppose it's a good thing that moose provide a big target. He only has one rifle, and perhaps a half box of ammo that he bought 8 or 10 years ago.

Naturally, I learned long ago that this friend is not one with whom I can have a fun conversation with about guns, shooting, ballistics, or such. It just doesn't matter to him at all.

I have two Norwegen friends who while cleaning their rifles got the bolts mixed up, and went hunting with them that way, and they had a heck of a time figuring out why the rifles weren't feeding or ejecting properly. They both had Remington 721s - one chambered in 300 H&H and the other in 30-06. As I recall, the 30-06 would fire with the magnum bolt, but not eject, while the 300 with the 06 bolt wouldn't close. Those two old Norwegens spent many hours trying to figure that one out, and let it spoil at least one day's hunting time.

KB

I bought my 8x60 RWS brass from Natchez Supply, no worry there!

quote:

Originally posted by MCA man:
I bought my 8x60 RWS brass from Natchez Supply, no worry there!

Properly headstamped brass is no guarantee that you will not chamber wrong round.

I had a customer tell me he had a case rupture when firing a new .308 I built for him. He brought me the brass and in an instant I knew what he'd done.



Seems an unlikely case to confuse for a .308 but I've learned, anything is possible.