If a M70 says BACO Morgan Utah Does BACO stand for Browning Arms Co and does that mean it is Mfg in SC by FN?

Yes.

And they are nice. I'd not hesitate to buy another one.

Yes that is correct & despite the pre-64 hysteria, the current Model 70 is the best Model 70 ever. That is the truth.

quote:

Originally posted by Beau375:
Yes that is correct & despite the pre-64 hysteria, the current Model 70 is the best Model 70 ever. That is the truth.

Wouldn't that kind of depend on your definition of best?

quote:

Originally posted by olarmy:

quote:

Originally posted by Beau375:
Yes that is correct & despite the pre-64 hysteria, the current Model 70 is the best Model 70 ever. That is the truth.

Wouldn't that kind of depend on your definition of best?

I suppose but the new ones have excellent fit, finish and function. I certainly have no complaints. The action feels slicker right out of the box than my Pre 64, the trigger is easy to adjust. Prettier wood and much better stock design.
Given the choice, the only thing a Pre 64 has going for it is collector value and that may come into question going forward because the new guns are so nice. From a utility standpoint I would certainly choose a new one every time.

Agree and disagree

Agree the Pre 64 hype is meaningless as they were good rifles (for their day) but had to be hand fitted and assembled due to the inexact machine tools of the day. Many had stocks that were either clubs or beat the crap out of you if scoped.

The FN rifles are very nice but they really screwed up in dropping the classic M70 trigger which, outside of the 1903 Springfield, was the best rifleman's trigger ever built. The new trigger is needlessly complex and like all complicated triggers will pack up when exposed to salt air, fine dust or being dropped in a muddy creek. The original 98 had it right and the 1903 NM was a slight refinement. Why "hunters" can't handle a safe 3 pound trigger is beyond me, falls in the same category as those who believe they need 1/3 MOA groups to kill an Elk at 150 yards.

My "one of the last" New Haven M70 270 FW has the fit and finish as good as one could ask for. It will also shoot 3 shot bugholes using JOC's favorite 4831 load, CCI 250s and 150 gr Ballistic Silvertips (ex combined technology) with a simple foolproof trigger set to three pounds.

quote:

Originally posted by Beau375:
Yes that is correct & despite the pre-64 hysteria, the current Model 70 is the best Model 70 ever. That is the truth.

agreed

I am willing to pretty much buy new M70's and trade straight across for clean old models. Especially Super Grades...

Got to love 'em.

I have 4 of them. 3 FW stainless 7mm-08 and a 375 alaskan. The all shoot under an inch at 100 yards. Great rifle and they shoot great.

While the 'new' M-70's may function I have no interest in their sloppy manufacture and finish.

Much better guns have been made and are still out there.

Here is a picture of the stamping on a new M-70 barrel and the pressed in so called checkering.



Now here is a picture of how to do it right!

It seems that pictures will not post on my reply above.

Here are the links to the pictures.

http://24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...uy_this_#Post7861769

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/3...890/pix382082824.jpg

Good post Savage 99!

as you often say, '99, to each his own. The diamonds in the checkering on the new M70's are much sharper, and much more functional than on the pre64's. And they are NOT pressed in, they are cut..

quote:

Originally posted by Savage_99:
Here is a picture of the stamping on a new M-70 barrel and the pressed in so called checkering.

Have you actually handled a new M70 that has 'pressed-in' checkering?

Winchester website says the FW has cut checkering,
and its probably the same computer cut checkering that it had some 30+yrs ago, in its old pushfeed FW.

I can't recall handling one of those new M70's with so called checkering like that.

I have enough rifles and am not in the market for one like that.

Old PF or new M70 FW, its most likely the same computer cut checkering on all of them.
That is unless someone can verify that they have physically witnessed in person, a new M70 with 'pressed-in' checkering.

...and those barrel stampings look no no better or worse,
than the ones I had on my Factory PushFeed m70FW 7x57 and that I have seen on numerous other FWs over the yrs from the pushfeedFW onwards.

I thought highly enough of the quality of the new Model 70's that I have placed an order for an Extreme Weather Stainless in 264 WinMag. Being a South Carolinian, it also felt good supporting the local economy.

Where are they being made now? I thought I read they were being built in Portugal and then I saw a Winchester commercial on the other day saying they were made in the U.S.? Have they moved production, yet- or even better yet, did they decide to keep production in the U.S.?

quote:

Originally posted by JustinL01:
Where are they being made now? I thought I read they were being built in Portugal and then I saw a Winchester commercial on the other day saying they were made in the U.S.? Have they moved production, yet- or even better yet, did they decide to keep production in the U.S.?

They moved to South Carolina some time back, same reason so many companies have in recent years...non union labour.

quote:

Originally posted by Savage_99:
I can't recall handling one of those new M70's with so called checkering like that.

I have enough rifles and am not in the market for one like that.

have you ever TOUCHED one??? Or just seen pictures?

I'm glad Browning/Winchester started producing them in the US again once the agreement with the labor union in Connecticut expired.

I had three of the late Connecticut guns have to go back for work. One had receiver threads/barrel crooked and scope mounting holes so off that they gave me a new rifle. Barrels are all great from that era though.

Pre-64's are beautiful, largely because a human fitted them. A man who'd worked in the factory in the pre-64 era had a beautiful post where he described his first weeks of using hand files to file a round bar square within (I think).003, and then round again. This was before they could work on a gun. I tried to find it, but couldn't.

But I think the new ones are functionally better and more accurate. And Browning/Winchester maintains a higher level of finish and hasn't gone to all matte black oxide finishes and plastic or plywood stocks.

I do prefer the simplicity, reliability, and accessibility of the old style triggers better.

quote:

Originally posted by skl1:
Pre-64's are beautiful, largely because a human fitted them.

Pre64s are hit and miss in the quality/ and finish department.
Thats why high level custom rifle builders have to carefully pick and choose which P64 receiver they select for a build.

quote:

Pre-64's are beautiful, largely because a human fitted them.

Pre64s are very much hit and miss in the quality and finish department.
Thats why high level custom rifle builders have to carefully pick and choose which p64 action they select for a rifle build.

``high level custom rifle builders`` yeah right keep on dreaming(I dont buy that anymore). It only takes a sharp gunsmith(and no one needs to have heard of him) to do things right.

Yep Portugal is the new goto Winchester plant

As far I know the new Model 70's are still coming out of the Columbia, SC factory.

I bought my son one for graduation and it's fit and finish were quite nice. On par with my "super grade". The action is every bit as smooth if not smoother, and the trigger feels good right out of the box. With todays metalurgy and cnc machines I bet the new 70 is more consistantly produced than ever before.

Just the way it is these days.......Winchester will get none of my money

Yes....Portugal

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/...php/topics/7439788/1

I value my old New Haven made m70 300wm actions more than ever now.All one needs is a good action and a decent stock.A nice Krieger barrel with the original Win barrel profile will make it into a fine rifle.

My 20 year old ADL is looking better every day

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
My 20 year old ADL is looking better every day

But Ted,
Doesn't ADL stand for Accidental Discharge Liability?
Just kidding! I have several myself.

Here is how it was done right.



Another point, those pre-64's were not "hit or miss". They are and were some of the finest factory made guns and made right.

quote:

Originally posted by Savage_99:
Another point, those pre-64's were not "hit or miss". They are and were some of the finest factory made guns and made right.

IF you have never seen a rough/poor/variable quality Pre64 from the factory, then your experience with pre64 seems rather limited.

I am having trouble posting pictures to this site.

I have no problems with other sites.

Makes me loose interest.

no pictures required...just answer the question: do you really think that the checkering on the new M70's is pressed??

I'll answer. No. I have a new Featherweight, the checkering is cut and the wood is nice.

and says made in USA.

Here is that picture of the pressed in 'checkering' and sloppy stamping on the BACO M70's barrel.