1 of my friends has a '70's M700 ADL, NIB. The box says "stainless barrel". I understand that most early m700's in 7 mag had a Hart stainless barrel. How do I know if this rifle has a Hart barrel. I'm thinking abou buying it & putting it in a McMillian Sako Hunter profile stock.

Some early production rifles had blued stainless steel marked barrels along with attractive pressed
fleur de lis checkering plus aluminium butt plate.
Not sure who provided the barrels. Nice classic rifle to have and in 7mm Remi hard to best.

M700s are one of the most accurate factory rifles and one of the easiest to bed so why would you worry about who made the barrel?

I'll mix some questions ands some opinions in my response....

1. Other than bragging rights, why do you want to know which make of barrel it is? It is a friend's rifle (so far), so presumably you can shoot it before buying it. Why not ask the wuestion "How well does the rifle shoot with THIS barrel?" If it shoots really well, then presumably it shouldn't matter what make it is...it is a good one, whether through luck or because of good manufacturing skills.

If it doesn't shoot well, I'd reckon having a good name on it won't make it any better of a barrel in actual use.

2. I notice it is an ADL model, not a BDL. That means it does not have a floorplate which will open. To unload live rounds you will have to work them all through the action, and with a push feed such as the Model 700, that means you will have to completely slose the bolt on each fully chambered round to get the extractor to snap over it and drag it out.

Do you plan to put a 3-position safety on it, or restock it with full bottom metal including an easily openable floorplate?

If not, it would have to be an awfully attractive price to get me to buy it.

Working live rounds through an action is hazardous, especially if you have to fully chamber each round and close the bolt each time as part of the process. Not at all unmangeable, if one pays attention and knows what he is doing, but more hazardous, none the less. That's one reason the majority of those rifles I have ever seen were purchased in BDL styling. Their buyers apparently thought that through before they made their purchases and decided the extra money for the BDL was cheap for the added convenience and safety.

I bought my own very, very early 7m/m Mag Model 700 brand new in the BDL styling for precisely that reason.

When my fingers are cold and stiff right to the bone, and I'm dead tired after a late Fall or Winter's day of hunting, I don't want a rifle that takes extra care and some dexterity and feeling, to unload it. I know I won't always be that fresh and alert in the field.

AC,
Why do you unload your rifles? Do you unload them every night?

"Working live rounds through an action is hazardous, especially if you have to fully chamber each round and close the bolt each time as part of the process."

We're off topic but it is by no means necessary to fully chamber a round in any push feed rifle to remove it. Simply push the bolt forward enough to pop each cartridge free of the magazine, withdraw the bolt and point the muzzle up; each round will easily drop free.

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktailer:
AC,
Why do you unload your rifles? Do you unload them every night?

You bet I do!!!

No telling who may be handling any rifle in camp, even if just once, just for an instant. And I don't want whoever that might be to be fiddling with a loaded rifle, especially one they may not have checked to see that it is loaded. They may assume it isn't, and pull the trigger "just to check the crispness or weight of the pull".

I don't hunt more than once with people who have unattended loaded guns in camp at night, especially if there is any booze in camp. My choice.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim C. <><:
"Working live rounds through an action is hazardous, especially if you have to fully chamber each round and close the bolt each time as part of the process."

We're off topic but it is by no means necessary to fully chamber a round in any push feed rifle to remove it. Simply push the bolt forward enough to pop each cartridge free of the magazine, withdraw the bolt and point the muzzle up; each round will easily drop free.

Technically that is true.
But there are always the times that for whatever reason the bolt IS completely closed and the round being removed IS fully chambered during the unloading process.

A lot of people I have seen DO completely close the action, chambering the round coming from the magazine, and have their left hand (if they are right handed) holding the rifle so that it is partially covering the bottom of the magazine and wrapped up around the ejection port in such a manner that the round sort of "ejects" into that left hand when they open the bolt and slide it back. That is probably a habit they have developed to keep any rounds from falling in the dirt or mud or whatever, but regardless why, they do it. Perhaps they needn't and shouldn't , but the fact is, many still do it. Maybe they feel the round is better "controlled" during unloading that way.

To me doing that is unsafe, and I'd rather they had BDL type rifles where they can just open the bolt,, open the floorplate, and have eveything fall out onto whatever they are holding it over. And I feel even safer when the bolt doesn't have to fiddle with any of the rounds in the magazine, at all.

Another reason they may do it is because they usually have to roll the rifle a little hair to the right as they tip it up to get the round to fall completrely out of the opened action. Maybe they have once experienced it falling straight down into the action so that it didn't come clear out. I've seen that happen too and if they are working the action a little too quickly, the next thing you know they have two rounds pushed up and out (or almost out) of the magazine...the one that didn't fall clear, and the one the bolt pushed forward from the mag as they had tried to shove it forward again.

quote:

Perhaps they needn't and shouldn't , but the fact is, many still do it.

That doesn't make the rifle unsafe.....but the operator should be severely reprimanded....this is an unsafe operator!

I agree Vapodog. They should be. But I was looking at the rifle and the operator as one system. I was therefore saying I think it is safer to have a BDL in thre hands of folks whose safety habits I don't know (and a fair number of people I do know all too well). I still think that.

Wahl, Chicken Littles, I have had ADLs and I unloaded them exactly like AC described. The muzzle was pointed in a safe direction and my finger was no where near the trigger. So what's unsafe?? I'm not talking about some sort of nitpicky BS to try and justify your position but rather what is unsafe?
BTW, I also hunt with a hot chamber and the safety on. I always practice safe weapon handling. Might as well get the pot really boiling.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim C. <><:
"We're off topic but it is by no means necessary to fully chamber a round in any push feed rifle to remove it. Simply push the bolt forward enough to pop each cartridge free of the magazine, withdraw the bolt and point the muzzle up; each round will easily drop free.

I thought it was just common sense to do it this way? If you don't I think you need to rethink it.....you might also want to bump up your life insurance while your at it.

quote:

Originally posted by Finley:

quote:

Originally posted by Jim C. <><:
"We're off topic but it is by no means necessary to fully chamber a round in any push feed rifle to remove it. Simply push the bolt forward enough to pop each cartridge free of the magazine, withdraw the bolt and point the muzzle up; each round will easily drop free.

I thought it was just common sense to do it this way? If you don't I think you need to rethink it.....you might also want to bump up your life insurance while your at it.

It's the way i've always done it, since i bought my first
Rem 700 in 1971.

Why don't folks have common sense anymore????

BTW, i still have that 700 and it's STILL working perfectly...

DM

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktailer:
AC,
Why do you unload your rifles? Do you unload them every night?

You bet I do!!!

No telling who may be handling any rifle in camp, even if just once, just for an instant. And I don't want whoever that might be to be fiddling with a loaded rifle, especially one they may not have checked to see that it is loaded. They may assume it isn't, and pull the trigger "just to check the crispness or weight of the pull".

I don't hunt more than once with people who have unattended loaded guns in camp at night, especially if there is any booze in camp. My choice.

First off, anyone who hunts should have firearm safety down cold or they would be no where near my hunting area. Secondly, if some nutcase did "pull the trigger" as long as you didn't have a shell IN THE CHAMBER it would not matter if the mag was full or not.
And if it was me I still would not worry who made the barrel.

Aside from personal defense weapons, no loaded rifles in the house, camp, or truck.

I prefer the hinged floor plate. I do have rifles (600 Remington) that don't have it. You can unload them without closing the bolt--most of the time. I did have another guys Rem 700 fire when I started to open the bolt to see that it was unloaded. My finger was NOT on the trigger but the owner seemed to think it was and that I fired it--NOT the case.

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktailer:

First off, anyone who hunts should have firearm safety down cold or they would be no where near my hunting area. Secondly, if some nutcase did "pull the trigger" as long as you didn't have a shell IN THE CHAMBER it would not matter if the mag was full or not.
And if it was me I still would not worry who made the barrel.

And what is to prevent that same
nitwit trying the trigger from working the action first?

It is always safer to make sure the gun is unloaded once the day's hunting is done.

What people should do and what they should feel occuring can be irrelevant when it comes to loaded firearms or firearms with loaded magazines. It is what they actually do and sense that counts.

I was almost shot in a gunshop one time, in Phoenix, Arizona.

I was working there, selling firearms (mainly machineguns). One day, while waiting on a customer looking for a revolver with her small young daughter beside her, a friend of the shop owner walked in.

As he often did he immediately moseyed around the counter to my side of it. Behind me laying on the back counter was a Browning .32 Auto whch someone had brought and left with the shop owner to be given to a gunsmith for repairs. It was apparently lying there with an empty chamber, but with a loaded magazine about 1/3 of the way into it.

Apparently said "friend of owner" picked it up, tried the trigger, and found it uncocked. Because it was a model known to have a magazine safety, he slammed the magazine the rest of the way into it, cycled the slide to cock the trigger, pointed it at the glass display case next to my knee, and tried the trigger again.

KABOOM!! Shattered glass flew all over me and the customer, and her about 8 year old daughter.

You don't know how loud a .32 auto is until you have heard it go off in a gunshop right next to you!

Everyone was stunned for a moment until I grabbed him by the neck and tossed him back onto the "customer" side of the counter.

The lady customer grabbed her daughter, looked me straight in the eye as if I had fired the round, and said. "let's get out of here before one of these crazy idiots kills us.

Needless to say, no sale there. I just thank God he didn't actually hit anyone.

From then on, he was banned from the shop while I was working, by me. I also had a serious chat with the owner about leaving guns and loaded magazines for them in contact with each other on the back counter.

And the real joker is, it wasn't the first time he had done that!!

I found out from the owner's sister, that he had almost shot her too on a previous occasion.

A similar scenario, except the pistol on the back counter was a .22 semi-automatic. That time he had picked the pistol up, slammed the magazine home, cycled the slide, aimed at the back wall, and pulled the trigger. Smaller KABOOM!! The .22 round passed through the drywall, over the desk facing that dry wall in the next room, and through the back of the secretarial chair pulled up to the desk.

Until about 1 or 2 minutes earler, the owner's sister had been sitting in that chair, doing our accounts payable and receiveable.

If she hadn't just gotten up and gone to the bathroom, it would have dead-centereed her at about arm-pit height.

From personal experience, I do NOT like unattended guns laying around with ammo in them or their magazines.

You guys may not see that as a danger. I do.


So, with rifles, even in hunting camp, I recommend a system (including the operator) which provides for easy and safe unloading.

And I think that a M700 ADL can be safely operated if the operator half of the system is running correctly. BUT, I think it can be done even more safely with a M700 BDL and a competent operator. Less chance for error = more safety is my view of it. YMMV.

After that kind of experience I don't blame you and that's why I don't own any ADLs.

quote:

Technically that is true.

It's TRUE, period. I've seen BDL owners work ammo from the magazine through the chamber to empty the rifle. Only meaning we can't fix stupid.

I rarely 'empty' a rifle in camp but I do in vehicles.

I open the action in camp or anywhere else I'm around others rather than actively hunting. NO safety is trustworthy, IMHO, and few other people can see if my safety is on anyway. But no one feels threatened around a firearm with an open action; totally safe but readily useable in a second if need arises. (I was well trained as a young GI.)