The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Medium Bore Rifles .270 Winchester woods load?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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I would like to hear what you .270 Winchester guys have used/seen used in the .270 for up close, bad angle shots ( timber) on deer/hogs/elk? I am partial to Partitions/Woodleighs/Barnes X and/or heavy round nose (though they are hard to find anymore, i.e. Hawk makes a heavy) This rifle has factory 10" twist. All opinions welcome.  | ||
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As you mention “bad angle shots” on deer, hogs, elk....Barnes TSX 140 grain. Integrity for those “up close and personal” shots on big game, while offering a pretty high BC for longer shots that elk hunting often offers! That was my choice for my daughter’s rifle...which is used for deer, antelope, and elk. And while a water jug test, is “not” the end-all, professional, test median....at 30 yards, we “ruined” 7 jugs and had a very pretty, expanded, Barnes bullet that was 1 grain short of 140 grains. Heck....it may have started-out weighing only 139 grains! memtb You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel | |||
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memtb is on the right track. A monometal like the Barnes TTSX 140 grain would be unstoppable. | |||
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I hunt in east central Minnesota in brush and/or open spots. Rarely do we get a shot further than 100 yards. Most often less than 50 yards. My 270 does well with either 130 gr or 150 gr Nosler Partitions pushed by a semi-hot handload. Have never shot a deer twice with either. Have never recovered a bullet.... they go right thru. A load which shot well in my rifle is 54 gr IMR4350 in Remington cases, CCI 200 primers pushing the 130 gr Partition. Very consistent in my rifle. My experience with the Partitions is that quality control builds consistent bullets, plus the small bevel at the bullet base helps [IMHO ] seat the bullet in the neck with less force and less runout. I try to avoid chancey shots thru thick brush. | |||
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I never liked the 270 in our old hunting group since the conditions are similar to what RCflash described and I found the wounding resulted in lots of bloodshot meat. Powerlines and choppings are one thing but the round's ability is wasted in the woods along with lots of good venison. YMMV. | |||
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IIRC, correctly all the testing has shown there really is no such thing as a "woods" or "brush busting" load. In other woods, no bullet or velocity range demonstrated a better ability to continue it's path threw brush. There are however loads that penetrate better for poor angle shots and those can include mono-metals or heavy for caliber round nose at moderate velocities. Even then I believe the evidence is more a series of empirical observations than statistically significant. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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130gr Nosler Partition for deer 150gr Nosler Partition for elk Birmingham, Al | |||
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I got a 9 point buck shot through the Heart at 20 feet with a gaint exit wound from 270 Win and 140 grain accubond in the freezer that disagrees. As you said YMMV. Would I use it to reach the vitals of a big bull elk from the tailpipe, no. I would not do that as a first shot with anything. Sort of that, I find no difference in it and any 30/06. I would not use a 30/06 either for tailpipeing elk. | |||
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Thanks for sharing guys. Being a native Texan, I never liked the label "Texas Heart Shot". It seems to me it should be "Obammacare Heart Shot" or Washington DC Heart Shot"! I grew up in East, Texas and surprisingly, there was a time that the Model 742 6mm Remington was consider THE deer rifle! I only saw one guy with a .243 then, one with a .280, the rest were .308, 30-06, 7mm Mag, one guy used a 300 Mag! Lots of 30-30s and only one guy who used a .270. All of them worked swell, some with the wrong bullets bloodshot lots of meat. I only shot one deer in 20yrs there that my old 30-30 couldn't have. I did that with a 280/139 Hornady. First cousin to a .270, ha. Keep the stories coming friends! | |||
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The .270 WCF is something I have a little experience in. And, like RC (see above), much of that has been in the deep northwoods of NW Wisconsin & northcentral Minnesota. I think the term "woods load" is actually quite useful, if not taken to mean "brush buster". When I think of a good "woods load", I think of a bullet that will open rapidly, give full penetration, and probably won't be aimed further than 200 yards (and 50 -70 yds 80% of the time). Just for giggles, here's the bullets I've killed whitetail & moose with: 130gr. NBT & 130gr. Comb. Tech BT 130gr. Corelokt 130gr. Win. PP 130gr. Swift Scirroco; sweet ride, but only a 2" bullet for me. 140gr. Ultra Corelokt (Texas Heart Shot at 25 yards; stem to stern penetration DRT; chest was a washing machine of blood; surprised there was no mess; was aiming for the base of the neck when the deer's hind end came up  )140gr. Fed. Trophy Bonded (not tipped); shot my bigget deer; 30 yards double lung; great expansion. Also an average doe @ 175 yards, shot too high in lungs, but still great expansion). 140gr. Accubond. I've shot a lot of deer with this bullet, up close & (relativly) far away. It's been fantastic. 150gr. Grandslam 150gr. Partition (didn't kill as quickly as I'd have liked, but not the best shot I've made, either.) 150gr. A-Frame (moose - wow! bone-crusher & good expansion & penetration; 245 yards) 150gr. LRAB 150gr. Win PP (ok, it was a 10" jackpine; centerpunched & left a quarter size exit!  )The one bullet I've not used, that should be the Hammer of Thor inside 200 yards is the 150gr. RN Corelokt. Shoots great in my rifle, too...just haven't used it yet. But no matter what caliber you shoot...or how far, there are just so many good bullets...it's actually pretty hard to make a bad choice. friar Our liberties we prize, and our rights we will maintain. | |||
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At 100 yards I used the 140 grain Accubond on a little over 210 pound Fallow buck. The shot was still in timber shooting uphill. The bulletin entered mid lung and exited but did not spine him. He dropped as if he had been spines with blood gushing out both wounds. You could not get near him wo being covered in blood. 100 pound doe 27 yards through center of both shoulder blades. Exit and pinned to the ground. 100ish pound boar 40 something yards 140 Accubond shot where the hip joint meets the spine. The off side flank unzipped and bullet exited the throat. His twin brother 140 grain taken through spine and exited dead on arrival. 115 poundish doe at 115 yards direct range finder beteeen the eyes. Could not have drawn it better with a ruler. Obviously, exit. You guessed it 140 grain accubond. Finally, the nine pointer detailed above. | |||
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North Fork / TBBC (140) / Rhino (170gr shoot ok for bush range in my 1 in 10) /A Frame / Woodleigh / bonded designs / Barnes Original in 180gr if you can find them / Partition160gr or 150gr. If you like slow them down a bit in the 150gr or lighter. | |||
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Seems like the partition 160 gr. semi-spitzer would fit the bill. DRSS(We Band of Bubba's Div.) N.R.A (Life) T.S.R.A (Life) D.S.C. | |||
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My bowhunting buddy who I met in college only owns one centerfire rifle. It's a Rem 700 ADL .270 given to him for X-mas when he was in the 8th grade. The only load he has ever shot in it is the Remington Core-Lok't 150gr. round nose factory load. Just because I was interested I had him shoot through my chrony. The speed of that load is 2650 fps from his 22" barrel. Back when he shot big game with that rifle I never saw that bullet fail to exit on deer, bear, elk. That load was Remington's answer to complaints that the .270 bloodshot too much deer meat. I think it's been in the ammo line since the '30's or '40's. The only thing he uses it for now is to shoot coyotes, same load! | |||
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The 160 gr. Nosler partition works great on elk and deer in a .270, load it to 2600 to 2800 FPS.for hunting in the thick stuff. The Nosler expands well on contact and still penetrates, that's the real beaut of the partitions IMO...Speer at one time had a 170 gr RN, that would penetrate like the dickens and expand to the size of a nickel, but doubt you could find any unless you got lucky at a gun show..I found a couple of boxes at a Gun show..Remingtons 150 gr. Corlokt was a good close range round for deer, but I doubt they still make it.. Ive been using the Accubonds lately and they just may be the best bullet Ive ever used. I used them in the 250-3000, 30-06, 338 Win on elk, and the 130 gr. or 140 gr. in the 270 on deer??..but not in the heavy weights in the .270..you might see what they have to offer.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Thanks guys. Has anyone tried/used the Woodleigh 150 PP in the .270? I am thinking of thumping a really big hog up in the woods of MO with a friend, hopefully this spring. | |||
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+1 I use the 150g Partition for all big game out of my 270 and I used to do a lot of successful elk hunting in the black timber. Shots are close, fast and exciting. Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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Im a big fan of Woodleigh bullets, never met a Woodleigh bullet I didn't like... Bottom line is for what you intend to use the .270 for I would just use any round nose soft cup and core bullet with lots of lead showing and load them down to 2500 FPS, they will get you what your looking for...Remington did that at one time with the 150 gr. and 180 gr. in the 06..That was back in the day when hunters were more concerned about meat damage than they are today, so much the shame. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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John Wooters did an article on the 270 back in the '80s i think where he stated the 150gr. round nose by Hornady or Sierra was a "sleeper" (his word) in the deep woods. | |||
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Sellior & Bellot make a .270 win 150sp load. It says it only goes 2650fps. It has a big soft lead round nose. I will try some later and just see how they shoot. May be a sleeper round itself, for the woods? | |||
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When I was a young man my 270 woods load was a 130 gr. Sierra Prohunter pushed as fast as H4831 could make it go. Talk about instant drops! Few exited and meat damage was impressive. After three or four deer I went back to my 30-30 for a season or two then tried the 270 again with the 150 grain Hornady RN and 42.0 grains of IMR 3031 to get 2600 fps I think. Worked just fine but I liked the easier handling Marlin better and used it more. I even went through a period where I used a 12 gauge and buckshot with good results too. | |||
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My youngest son got his first elk with my 40 year old BDL in 270 and 130g PSP CoreLokt's. 170g CoreLokts are still are goto bullet in our 30-30. Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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I would (and have ) used the 150 gr winchester power point. It expands reliably and holds together well. I loaded some for a hunting buddy at about 2700fps (he has a 270 remington pump). He shot whitetail buck at 85 yards. The bullet expanded beautifully and penetrated about 20 inches. It weighed 141 gr out of the original 150 gr. which I thought was exeptional. | |||
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When I moved to Utah in 1990, I would always ask 'the older gents" what they used for deer/elk ( seems no one had a dedicated rifle to one or the other, everyone hunted for meat first, trophy second) 30-06/270 were about even and the Mod 99 300 Savage was third. this is out of about 50 guys ( and a handful of their wives) the 35 Remington seemed to outnumber the 30-30/32 special, always a Marlin. The 30-06 bullet weights were either 150/180 and it seemed the 150 in the .270 far outnumbered the 130. Again, these were a lot of WW@ and Korean Vets, and many of their rifles were just sporterized Enfields/Springfields. The .270s were about even in bolt guns (both Mod 70 & 700s) and Remington pumps. Lots of pumps in both '06 & 270. I think a lot had to do with being easy to use in a saddle scabbard of course. I spoke to very few handloaders, and when I did, they loaded mostly the '06/180 and 150/270, but in Noslers. Over the years, the hunters became fewer, and you began to see a lot of magnum users, of course. 7mm to 300 mags mostly with a smattering of 338WMs. The saddle guns became Marlin 45-70s. The 30-06/270 still reign, but the 308 replaced the 300 Savage. Now I see many many more handloaders and experimenters using flat shooters in 6mm, 6.5, and rightly so. Its easy to market the great bullets/powders we have now. this is a very small example from a very unscientific "observation, dome strictly for my personal enjoyment. I have asked hunters/shooters these questions since I was a young boy and of course, an avid reader. But you learn some things by others experiences. I appreciate anyone who shares. | |||
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Dense forest or long shot shots out to ~400 yards, give-or-take according to ability, it's the same bullet for Rocky Mountain mule deer:130 grain GameKings or BallisticTips. From experience of others: expensive bullets do not compensate for poorly placed shots. For elk, my recommendation is the 150 grain Partition. My guess is the 130 grain Partition will kill 'em just as dead. It's what bullets destroy that matters, not caliber of bullet. It's that old hunter's saying: a .243 Win in the boiler room is a whole lot better than an '06 in the guts. | |||
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memtb- PM sent | |||
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Jim, You’ve got mail! memtbYou should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel | |||
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Bob Hagel quote above is so stupid it defies comprehension! Back to the subject being discussed here. Any mono metal 130-140 grain bullet will do the job! | |||
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Blunt tip = less deflection?  Life itself is a gift. Live it up if you can. | |||
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ThankYou Saeed! You must be getting a little senile, as you’ve stated this before! We have our opinions of the quote. I like it, you don’t.....let it rest! memtb You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel | |||
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I just like to remind normal people of how stupid that statement is  | |||
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Hi Jim. I've been using a 270 since the late 90's. Fiddled around with bullet weights from 100gr to 150gr. It didn't take long for me to settle on 140gr for everything from Antelope to Moose. My rifle is a Husqvarna with a 10 twist. I use Hornady 140gr BTSP for the huge deer we have here in Sask and 140gr Winchester Failsafe for the big stuff. I stand hunt in the forest fringe so shots can be 50yds all the way out to 500yds across a logging clear cut. Never lost an animal. Hope this helps. | |||
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It does help lagerboy. I liked that old Winchester 140 Failsafe factory load too. Its a shame they stopped making them. I felt they were better for the thicker skinned/heavier muscled critters, but they were sure accurate. | |||
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I use a 150 Hornaday spire point in 760. kills things fine. | |||
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There was a magazine article long ago where the author tested a number of cartridges with bullets of various weights. He shot them through a box with an aray of dowels in it to mimick shooting through brush and had a target on the other side. The results were surprising in that the lighter bullets per caliber seemed to stay on course better than the heavier bullets. His theory was that it was that way because the lighter bullets were more uver-stabilized. But it seems that was only true when the lighter bullets were non-varmint bullets and did not blow up. It seems like the best bullet was a lighter bullet in the ,338 Winchester. Some heavy bullets in what were thought of as brush busting calibers did not do very well. This is not my opinion but someone else's test results. | |||
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I remember an article from many years ago......counter to everything we were told many years ago! memtb You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel | |||
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I have been a fan of the 270 for a long time. I knew a fellow at work a few years back who's dad used a 270. He was complaining about excessive meat damage from his 130 gr loads. He was going to try 140 gr bullets to see if they would minimize the damage. When talking to him about this his dad never shot a deer over 150 yards away. I told him to just slow the bullets down, Instead of 3100 fps load to 2800 or so would work just fine. Or try 150 gr, they would work well because they would be about that speed. The 130's at max speed work well at longer ranges because the velocity is slower. At max speed and up close they work more like a varmint bullet, they tend to blow up. I don't know just how his experiments turned out. He left to work somewhere else. The 140's may have helped because the velocity would be a bit less. I have found that generally close range doesn't need a fast light bullet, A slower heavier bullet kills cleanly with out so much meat damage. Leo The only way to know if you can do a thing is to do it. | |||
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This is the true wrong direction of what a proper brush cartridge should be required to do. A good "brush" cartridge is not about getting good penetration of "brush" but needs to be able to penetrate the animal from any reasonable angle. Successful brush hunting is mostly about not shooting brush before the bullet hits the animal! And in the thick stuff the animal is not often perfectly broadside. Heavy slower bullets penetrate better generally than light fast ones monometals not being added into the equation. | |||
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Odd I have found this quote from Hagel to be true without question! | |||
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Thank You Palidun! Perhaps you and I are the only ones that like the quote! memtb You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel | |||
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