I too was very disappointed. You can thank Winchester and Remington because when they came out with the 7mm short mags there were just too many 7mm's on the market. Ruger also stopped making them, as far as I know, in their bolt action. I noticed that omission earlier this year and called CZ. They found me a new CZ 550 7X57 in a warehouse that had not been sold yet.

It was a very good decision fo rCZ to stop making th e7x57. They are in the business to make money, so they must make what will sell. The 7x57 may have a following in Africa, but it sure does not anywhere else in the rest of the world. Just start looking at every store you enter that sells ammo. No many will have the round for sale. Know why? Very few shoot it.

Ironically, many high end custom guns are chambered fro the 7x57. I woul dlove to know how many rifles that cost over $5k are so chambered. I know the percentage of 7x57's goes up as the price oges up. Weird, but true.

I have just a little bit of expericene here. My main rifle for the past few yeras has been a 7x57 (yes, in an over $5k rifle) and it has traveled with me to 4 continenets. Any one who travels a lot to weird, out of the way places knows that at times you will arrive with nor rifle, or no amm, or soemtiems neither. It is just part of the game. Try finding some 7x57 just about anywhere and look at the blank stares when you ask fo rht ecaliber. Most folks have never heard of it. Here in the US, Europe, Asia, Oceana, anywhere. Just this year I had an ammo emergency in a well populated US location. I scarambled and found 2 boxes of the ammo- Both were different loads, but I had ammo. I was very glad to have it too. It is rare because people do not like the round

The 7x57 is not magic. It really has nothing going for it. The .280 or 7x64 is better in anyway you look at it. In factory loadings, the 7-08 is loaded to the same speeds with US ammo. Nastalgia is it's only true virtue. Again, my main rifle for th epast few years has been a custom 7x57 and my back up has been a commercial 7x57. I like the round, but I can also honestlly assess it and look at a firm's sound business decisions

I would love to see your pressure data on thos eloads. Are they published loads moving that fast with a 7x57? Even at these speeds, it still does nothing as well as a .280 or 7x64.

Marc,

Quote:

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No many will have the round for sale. Know why? Very few shoot it.

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I do know that Hornady brought out their Light Mag in this so ther must be some market or they wouldn't have bothered. I also agree to a point, no its not the most popular round or even close. I think most who own this round tend to reload though, as a group they're not real happy with the factory underloaded ammo and just roll their own. The popularity of the round is a niche so to speak. Meaning there are a fair amount that are still shot it, but not much ammo is being bought. I know my sporting goods store where I buy ammo still carries it, and in a couple of flavors at that. But guess what I haven't bought any in years, several hundred loaded rounds and a close to double that in empty brass means I am not purchasing ammo for this.

CZ's decision was finacally based I'm sure, and undoubtably it is valid. Gun owners nashed their teeth when the 358 Winchester disappeared also, but they weren't buying the rifles, hence no incentive for manufacturers to make them.

I don't consider the 7x57 gone for good though I bet it will be back, as a special 1 year run from time to time in limited quanities. In retrospect the whole 7mm market has compressed, nowdays its a 7mm-08 or a 7 Mag of some flavor that being chambered, not much else available.

THe 280 Rem and the 7x64 aren't in much better shape right now on this side of the pond at least very few guns still being chambered in either of these.

I didn't read all the posts, but I am a fan of all cartridges, especially those odd balls like the 6.5X55 and 7X57. They are nice "sensable rounds", that prove you don't need a short mag to take game. I'm already tired of the short mag craze, but it sells guns, so I won't complain too much.
The truth is that these types of cartridges are an odd length that doesn't fit well in a short action, is kind of short for a long action, and no maker is going to go for an intermediate action when so many other good short action calibers exist. Calibers such as 308, 260, 243, 7mm-08 in the short action and 25/06, 270, 280 and 30/06 in the long pretty much wipe out the odd length metric rounds. It's a shame, but a fact of life. The metrics don't do anything that a standard caliber won't do as well or better, so why would a company keep them in the lineup? I like Remington's idea of the Classic, a new caliber every year of odd ones that some would want, but aren't popular enough to keep in the lineup. Ruger is also to be commended for keeping some of these and the likes of the .257R alive. I only wonder how long they can keep doing it, when you think it's only a reamer, then maybe for quite a while, as long as, at least, some interest is alive.

My standard load is 50.5 gr H414 with a 160 Nosler in a long throated Ruger. This will go 2817 fps in a 22 in. barrel. 53.5 gr with a 140 gr will go 3000. I just ordered a pressure trace system and the 160 Nosler load is the first one I'll check with it. I'll post the results as soon as I get it done. In the last year or so it's killed, warthog, kudu, gemsbuck, 3 whitetails, and probably more. There really can't be any difference between it and a 7x64-.280 or a .30-06 in everyday use. The pressure on my load may be a bit high, although I've used it in 100 degree temps. with no problems. I'll find out and post my results.

50.5 gr of 414 with a 160 grain bullet? That's ONLY 11% over the maximum load from the latest Nosler manual. As a 7x57 user who chronographs a lot, I feel quite safe in saying you will not get 2800+ fps with a 160 grain bullet without going WAAAAAAY over pressure. Ditto for your 140 at 3k+. FOlks play with fire every day and I don't care what you do to yourself. Just don't hurt any one around you

I have a poll I want every one on this thread to answer. Here is the question:

I am asking every single person who posted here whining about the 7x57 not being more popular and CZ dropping it, how many of you ever bought a CZ rifle in 7x57? This is aserious poll. I would like all to keep posting on this thread.

Marc,



Fair question, I didn't buy one but not having it in the distribution network killed it and I bought a 6.5x55 instead. And even it is was available right now I wouldn't be purchasing one for the next year or so, as I have other projects in the works. A custom 7x57 is one of my current projects.

Marc

I may be surprised by the results when I check the pressure, that's why I'm doing it. This rifle is very long throated, which allows a bunch more powder capacity. As a matter of fact, in previous rifles, an old favorite load was 51. gr. IMR 4350 with a 140 Nosler that went 2900 in an old M70 chronographs 2750 in this rifle. I wouldn't want to use the H414 load in my old Model 70. Realistically I expect to see pressure in the 55000 range, as the load has proven to have good case life, and all the normal appearances in my current rifle. That's why I've ordered the strain gauges, so I'll know. Without it we're all guessing.

Schromf:

that brings up another very good question. i would like to know how many on thi sthread have CUSTOM 7x57's. As I stated earlier, this is a very popular cartridge for higher end custom rifles. I know several GUild memebers and they frequently build 7x57's.

I have a full custom blued steel/English walnut job, and an old BRNO 21H

Total 7x57's
1-custom G33/40
1- South American original
1-BRNO custom in the works

Marc Stokeld,



This year I purchased what I believe to be the last available new CZ 550 American availabe in 7x57. So add me into your survey.



I had to track it down on the internet and have it shipped to me. Maybe my claim is a bold one, and perhaps there are others out there yet unsold, but, if so, and you find one, buy it!



I absolutely love that rifle and caliber! Capable, pleasant to shoot, accurate, etc., etc.



Yesterday I used it to dropped a deer in its tracks. One shot to the vitals and it literally did not even take one step. This caliber seems like such a perfect fit for eastern US whitetail deer that I'm beginning to wonder why anyone uses anything else for them.



I have it zeroed for 300 yards using 140 grain bullets. Unconventional? Perhaps, but it seems to work for me. This has the effect of "flattening" out the trajectory so I don't need the extra recoil of a harder kicking caliber to shoot as far as I'm comfortable shoting.

Wismon:

I officially grant you the right to bitch about CZ dropping the 7mm Mauser from their line.

Marc

I would love to be able to say I owned a custom 7x57mm, but I do not. I am a small town daily newspaper reporter for the past 30 years and as such, have had to rob Peter to pay Paul all of my adult life. When you are in this position, you make do, as I have done for years. Like I said when I started this post, I own a CZ 550 in 7x57mm. Before that I owned a Ruger Mark II in the same caliber and before that, a Ruger Model 77 in the same caliber. The first Ruger was stolen, the second was used as a trade-in for the CZ. I would like to say I own a custom rifle, but can't. It does not mean that I do not want one, so I did the next best thing. I learned to glassbed from a fellow who used to post on this site and others by the name of Jack Belk. Via telephone and the internet, I glassbeded several rifles. When I got this CZ 550 American, I glassbedded the action area and the first two inches of barrel. Did a darn fine job of it I might add. Next, I took the elephant snot CZ uses for a finish off the stock and found a beautiful chunk of Turkish Walnut hiding under there. I refinished the stock with so many repitions of GB Lindspeed Oil (apply, let dry, apply, let dry, use 0000 steel wool to take it back down to wood is one repitition) the wood simply would not take any more oil. I then got some Talley Rings and a Leupold scope in 4x12 power, had a gunsmith polish off the black from the bolt handle to the bright nickel color it is under the black stuff, then had him jewell the bolt both in a small heringbone pattern. In the world of custom rifles it ain't custom, but it is as close to one as this poor ole boy could come without breaking the non-exitant bank. It is a darn fine looking rifle, shoots my handloads like a dream and is something I'm damn proud of, even if it isn't a custom job. As to my original observation, I realize it was a business decision to drop the caliber from CZ's lineup, but guess what, I'm still disappointed in CZ for doing it. Maybe it will boost sales of another 7mm by dumping the 7x57mm. Who knows! Have a tolerable day. Tom Purdom

Despite alot of 7x57 mourners floating around ; I'm afraid the bottom line is it will do nothing a .270 , 7mm/08, or 30/06 won't do ..........notsalgia aside , that is the reality of the situation........

You're right! Of course, the 7mm/08 the .270, the .280, the .308, and a few more won't do anything a .30/'06 won't do either, but we still buy them. For hunting anything from deer up to moose, there's really NO REAL NEED for anything but a .30/'06 loaded with the right bullet.....

out of curiosity, what psi would you consider "reasonable"?

sdgunslinger,

Don't stop there. Nostalgia aside, there's nothing a 30-06 can do that can't also be acomplished with a poisioned bait pile.

I'm a big fan of the 30-06. But for medium-sized game the 7x57 will kill the animal just as dead with less recoil. That IS something. (And if you say you can download an '06, well, again, don't stop there. You can download a .460 Weatherby too. Therefore, by that argument anyone who doesn't shoot a .460 Weatherby is just engaging in a game of nostalgia.)

Marc,

Far be it from me to complain about CZ's business decision. I'm a dyed-in-the-wool capitalist. My complaint is directed towards the rifle buying public and their infatuation with the annual silly new cartridge offered up by the firearm manufactures. And as I've posted elsewhere, no, the rifle-buying public does not need to acommodate my tastes, but neither do I have to like their choices.

I'd disagree with those sentiments , Wisman .



Fact is , the 30/06 can be loaded down to 7x57 levels using medium burn rate powders like 4064 and no one will ever be able to tell the difference in recoil or game killing ability . And either rifle is a little more mainstream than doing your hunting with a poisoned bait pile (grin) Then there is also the fact that an 06 need not be any heavier or more bulky than a similar 7x57 .



I'd also disagree a .460 could be loaded down to do the same work, too big a case , too big a bore......

I like the 7x57, but in North America it must be handloaded to bring out its potential. I wish winchester still made the featherweight in 7x57. It was the right length action for this cartridge, and I've searched for one for a long time.

I also think the 7mm-08 is better. You can get decent ammo and it fits in a true short action. Reloading manuals show that you can get 2500 fps with a 175 grain Nosler partition without exceeding 2.8" col.

When you think about it that way, I'm suprised the 7mm-08 isn't more popular.

I disagree with your sentiments, sdgunslinger.



If you're against hunting with poisoned bait piles (or forest fires, for that matter) I suspect you're one of those nostalgia buffs.



The fact remains that unless you live a subsistence existance in a very remote area, hunting is not cost effective - it is a hobby or a sport. On a strictly cost/benefit basis, any of us with the means to log onto the internet would get more meat for ourselves by dedicating the time we spend hunting to our jobs, to say nothing of the cost of the equipment, travel, lodging, etc. Studies have been done to prove this, but no study is really needed; just tally up in your mind what you spent on hunting each year and think how much meat that would buy.



What's my point? Just this: for us hunting is all about nostalgia. In fact, I would argue that that's all it's about.



SlowHand, for those interested in getting the "full potential" of a 7x57 by wringing all the energy out of it they possibly can, I say they've missed the point. They should just buy a .280 (or .270 or 7mm Mag) and be done with it. The 7x57 is all about having a very lethal round that is very pleasant to shoot. Why turbocharge it?

Been trying to find a CZ in 7x57 just for the hell (nostaglia) of it, but I guess that is your point, and my .280 does everything any of the 7mm's will do.


P.S. Nowadays, it costs more to get a deer processed than the meat is worth!

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Alf:

DOn't know why you say it is an maerican thing to want the extra velocity. The 7x64 was invented in Europe about 25 years after the 7x57. The 64 can be found in a lot mor eplaces around the world than the 57-EXCEPT in the US. We do have the .280, which is practiaclly the same as the 64. Even in Outer Mongolia, you can find rifles and ammo in 7x64, but you are totally SOL if you want even one round of 7x57. I am serious and speaking from experience about the Outer Mongolia thing. I guess the Mongolians are speed freaks too (actually, they are only concerned with how large your shell is-bigger is definitley better. Most have no concept of fps, they just like long cartridges). They, like every one outside of Africa, are wrong, but thank god you are here to show us the light. Ok, that was over the line, but I am getting the feeling you are trying to say that at least a little.

Remeber, my main hunting rilfe since '99 has been a 7x57. I have depended on it for hunts with a lot of money on the line. But I don''t have some romantic view about hte cartridge and say it is some how superior. THe 7x64 makes more sense.

Jstevens:

Why don't you pick 5 rounds at random out of your test batch and send to :

Cartridge Pressure Testing
Tom Armbrust-815-385-0037,
Ballistic Research, McHenry, IL

THe cost is $5 per shell to test. For $25 you can have a professional lab test the pressure and you can then compare this to your home unit. It iwll be a good calibration tool as well.

I have an MS in Mechanical Engineering and have done more testing of this genre then almost anyone on this board. Not pressure testing ammo, but the principles are the same that I used in research projects and paid studies. I can assure you that while there are pressure differences in each gun, to say that it is a great difference is misleading. There was not qualification as to these differences, which would lead folks to think that there is a wide variation in pressures meaning loads can be greatly increased. THis is simply not true if the chamber is cut anywhere near SAMMI specs. I am also a custom gun maker and have made one or two chips come out of barrels with a chamber reamer before.The differences are pretty minor. And your velocity is going to be very close. It may require a little more or less powder to get to the safe pressure in a particular rifle. But when the pressure is met, the velocity is going to be very close to every other rifle running at that same pressure. Simple physics. THere is no such thing as fast barrels or whatever. For equal pressure, the velocities are equal.

The best article I have probably ever seen on pressure was by John Barsness in either Rifle or Handloader about 6 months ago.

Jstevens-don't know if you have checked in since I asked the other day, but I would like to know what feel are acceptable pressures in this rifle

Marc, I have no idea what Jstevens might consider acceptable pressures in ANY cartridge, but if used in a rifle like the Ruger No.1 or M77, etc., there is no reason on earth why the 7X57mm cannot be loaded to the same pressure levels as any other similar cartridge, such as the 6mm Rem., which is exactly the same piece of brass..... in other words, SAAMI 6mm Rem. maximums are perfectly O.K. in a 7 X 57mm, or in a .257 Roberts, or a 6.5 X 57mm ......

Marc

On their website, calibers such as .25-06 and .270's are shown at 64000 psi, .30-06, I think 60000. I know this makes a lot of sense since the others are made from the '06 case. 60000 psi is like 50000 cup I believe is a rough conversion.

.

Hey Alf,

We finally agree on something. The 7x57 is what it is and so is the 9.3x62. Impossible to make them into something they are not.

BTW, I found a new CZ 7x57 FS the other day. It will give me something to play with. Now if I can only find those solids for it I could take it ele hunting!

quote:

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Originally posted by Will:
Hey Alf, BTW, I found a new CZ 7x57 FS the other day.

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Great find!

I really don't care if CZ stops selling the 7X57, nor do I care if there is some ground swell of folks who take it to heart. I truly enjoy hunting with mine (I have 3) and do not need to justify it to anyone. It will do what I ask of it and it is a joy to shoot. I also enjoy shooting it's offspring the .257 Roberts for the same reasons.