Looking to add a 30-06 or 300WM back into my safe for a general whitetail rifle and other NA game that doesn't require a .375 class rifle. I've been looking at the Remington 700's in AWR and Mountain Rifle SS form. I'm finding them for right around $950-1000 depending on dealer. The other option I'm looking at is buying a base model ADL, and adding the BC stock ($271 from BC) and having the rifle coated (cerakote or gunkote or the like). Weight isn't a huge concern to me, but it looks like the ADL route will net me a slightly lighter rifle. Anyone else have any input on these two choices??

Speaking pragmatically, you will never get the money back that you sink into customizing a rifle. But you will get the satisfaction of knowing you have a one off like no others.

Build. You will get a rifle that fits you and has all of the features you want. Assuming you are going to use it for the next 10-15 years, or in my case 30 years, the cost or what you may someday get back out of it mean very little.

If you buy the Remington 700 you're going to need to get a trigger as well. Their new triggers aren't even worth keeping in the gun.

I would look at a different gun altogether. If lightweight is what you're looking for then you might want to look at Tikka. I have one in 7mmRM and it's a great gun. Accurate, lightweight,and has an adjustable trigger.

Faced with a similar quest I found a used 700 KS Mountain Rifle (at a very fair price). Had the metal Cerakoted and the Kevlar stock dipped and I now have a rifle that is virtually bomb proof, a tack driver with a trigger that is perfectly crisp and I have just over $1100 in the rig, excluding scope (Leupold 2.5-8x). If I had to bet my life on a rifle, it would be this one.

The two most accurate rifles I’ve owned are factory wood stocked ADL’s in 222 and 308. I won’t mention consistent group size, as most folks wouldn’t believe it. Both of these rifles were built in the early 80’s and bought used for next to nothing. Both were sold to friends enamered with their accuracy. I would give the restocked ADL a try. I’ve owned a couple rem 700 duds as well, but I was able to resell them for what I had in them. FWIW, an old friend has a thoroughly used synthetic stocked ADL in ‘06 from the mid 90’s that was given to him as a high school graduation present. It shoots clover leaf groups with factory 150 grain Rem cor-locks. He’s taken 30 plus Elk with that rifle and load with no problems. Given his experience with his bargain basement ‘06 and that supposedly wimpy factory load, I’m constantly asking myself why I like custom hunting rifle!

I refuse to carry a factory rifle into the woods. Anyone can do that.
Build up what you want on a custom basis.
Ok except double rifles; I do have some factory made ones.

buy a Bergara and put a decent scope on it.

you'll be wondering why you'd bother spending the money on the Remington your gonna do all that work to, to get it almost as good as the off the rack Spanish made rifle.

Gun smiths well tell you to do a full build.

Common sense price wise well tell you to find a good used factory rifle. I only have brought a couple of new firearms.

I have both and both can work well.

That said I have dozens of rifles only a couple do not have any work done to them. Mostly because I haven't got around to it and they work as is.

I say go with the semi custom build buy a used factory rifle do what you need.

Bedding and triggers are most common and can be done by yourself.

A different stock if you want I find most factory stocks work just fine after bedding. But that just me.

It is all about how much you want to spend.

I've done it both ways and it's six in one, half dozen the other. If the stock rifle shoots to your satisfaction...enjoy it. If not, fix it so it does or simply have one built the way you want it to begin with.

The XMark Pro trigger can be helped by purchasing a reduced power spring available online at Ernie the gunsmith's web site. I have three of them (sold a fourth) and they are just fine. I haven't had any problems with any of them. My 700s are chambered in 7mm-08, 30-06 and 338 Win Mag.

I've done both as well. Now I would only build one if I wanted something a little different, like my 6.5-06AI. The best rifles I have bought recently were "factory". Both were in 30-06 and lighter weight. One was a Colt Light Rifle and the other was a push feed Winchester Featherweight. Both shoot very well and I have had to do nothing to either.

Since I am a "tinkerer" I will most likely put a new stock made from my wood on the Winchester and, at most, Teflon coat (Black Ice) the Colt. I can buy and add the little touches to both rifles for less than a custom rifle, and I will be just as happy.

I’m on the fence. I’m lazily looking for a CZ 550 in 308 or 30-06 (non FS) for a good price. I missed two 308’s for $500/ea last week by just a day! I’d ideally like to find one of these and send it to AHR to have a twin to my 375 built out by Wayne.

If I can’t find that, I’m kind of leaning towards buying a used 700 and restocking and coating it. I’ll look more into the trigger, as well.

I've got many of both. Far be it from me to tell someone not to build what he wants, but I will say that most of the builder's special needs aren't that special, and neither are the rifles themselves. If you've seen one 700 hunting rifle with a custom barrel, trigger and McMillan stock you've seen them all. Under it all it's still a 700 and does about the same thing. That's not an entirely bad thing,
but it's not that big of a deal either. I like to buy other people's builds for half of what they have in them.

If you are convinced that you both want and need a "pull out all the stops build" (And you might, for all I know) why start with a Remington at all? If you wanted the best formula 1 car you wouldn't start by bolting the best of everything on your lawnmower.

OR, you could get a semi custom from a place similar to HCR.
It will shoot accurately and you will be able to get some options .

I know it's not one of the choices you mentioned, but I would suggest looking at the Howa offerings. The new R700 examples I've seen are pretty junky. Crooked, sloppy, cheap, etc. The Howa is similar to the r700 but made a lot better in my opinion. They are usually pretty accurate, good machine work, reasonable price, smooth action, good trigger, and they will actually answer the phone and support their product. They take R700 bases, and you can even buy just the barreled action if you know that you want a custom stock.

$0.02

Take a Rem 700, blue-print it, install a new top-end barrel, add a stable stock and you'll have a sweet semi-custom which should shoot as well as anything out there....and it's not exactly what everyone else can buy off the rack.

Loads of other nice touches can be done to the bolt body, handle, metal finish and stock finish to make it just the way you want it.

It's fun, relatively cheap and they shoot wonderfully well!

Zeke

There is nothing wrong with a Tika or Sako for a hunting rifle. The current Model 70s are great. I wouldn't touch a current 700 if you gave it to me for free... YMMV

quote:

Originally posted by lockingblock:
There is nothing wrong with a Tika or Sako for a hunting rifle. The current Model 70s are great. I wouldn't touch a current 700 if you gave it to me for free... YMMV

How many Rems have you owned and what reasons do you have for making a post like that?

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:

quote:

Originally posted by lockingblock:
There is nothing wrong with a Tika or Sako for a hunting rifle. The current Model 70s are great. I wouldn't touch a current 700 if you gave it to me for free... YMMV

How many Rems have you owned and what reasons do you have for making a post like that?

I have owned and still do own several Remington 700 Rifles. A Remington 700 ADL was the first centerfire rifle I owned. It was wooden stocked and had open sights on it. Beautiful rifle that I wish I would've kept.
I have decided to stop buying them after I bought my last one.

My last experience was with a Rem 700 SPS varmint in 308. The scope mount holes in the receiver were stripped out and the trigger wouldn't adjust lower than 7lbs. Had to take it to Wild West Guns for Warranty repair.

Prior to that I bought a Rem 700 ADL with a bad barrel. The throat was so long you could seat a bullet to the point where only the boat tail section was in the neck and it still wouldn't touch the lands. There were tooling marks inside the barrel where the cutter had chattered. The barrel would foul horribly. I had a friend with a bore scope video it and sent the video to Remington and then had to send it in for their evaluation. A new barrel was installed. And they installed one of their piece of shit new triggers on it to where it wouldn't adjust below 5lbs. So once I got it back I had to install a new Timney trigger. They chamber was cut better but still a little generous.

Ever since Freedom Group took control of Big Green their quality has dropped considerably. Just as it has for any other company they have taken over.

I have bought CZ 527s and 550s as well as Tikka and for the money they are head and shoulders above what Remington is offering.
To get that quality one has to step up to the higher end rifles from Remington if you want a rifle like what they once produced.

If i'm going to spend $600-$1000 on a rifle Remington will not even be considered. If I were to buy a Remington I would have to drop another $150ish for a new Trigger because the one they send out now has been lawyered up and is worthless.

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:

quote:

Originally posted by lockingblock:
There is nothing wrong with a Tika or Sako for a hunting rifle. The current Model 70s are great. I wouldn't touch a current 700 if you gave it to me for free... YMMV

How many Rems have you owned and what reasons do you have for making a post like that?

I have 7, currently. The 700 action overall, is simply not optimal for most hard use applications. If you look at how and why it was designed, round stock is simpler to machine. It's lower cost, requires less work, and you can create a more precise mechanism with less work. Flat bottom actions, long extractors, safety mechanisms that hold the firing pin...they are not cheap and they have more pieces that require fitting.

It also depends on which generation of 700 you are talking about as QC under freedom group is horrid. My oldest 700 was made in 1969. It is beautiful. My newest RR prefix 700 had virtually no primary extraction. The bolt handle dented on the camming surface as if it was made of soft pot metal. The firing pin spring had substantial drag on the interior of the bolt. Then...the extractor fell out as the pocket it sits in was not deep enough. It was a mess.

Now, it's been fully worked over, trued, bolt replaced with a PTG unit, new FP assembly, new trigger, Broughton barrel, and a McM stock. It's great...about $3k later.

In the end, why dump that money into a 700? Frankly, I wouldn't do it again.

If you want a round action rifle, there are a ton of great action makers that provide low cost, but very good 700 clones. Definace, Stiller, and so on. My MK 13 is on a Stiller and it is solid...not perfect as 700s and clones don't like to eject live rounds in big calibers, but that is a known issue.

YMMV...but I just don't see the value in working over a 700 when you could get a better base rifle for the same or less money. Factory guns...Tika, Sako, or a Model 70. Build? Stiller for round actions at low cost.

YMMV

quote:

Originally posted by lockingblock:

quote:

Originally posted by wasbeeman:

quote:

Originally posted by lockingblock:
There is nothing wrong with a Tika or Sako for a hunting rifle. The current Model 70s are great. I wouldn't touch a current 700 if you gave it to me for free... YMMV

How many Rems have you owned and what reasons do you have for making a post like that?

I have 7, currently. The 700 action overall, is simply not optimal for most hard use applications. If you look at how and why it was designed, round stock is simpler to machine. It's lower cost, requires less work, and you can create a more precise mechanism with less work. Flat bottom actions, long extractors, safety mechanisms that hold the firing pin...they are not cheap and they have more pieces that require fitting.

It also depends on which generation of 700 you are talking about as QC under freedom group is horrid. My oldest 700 was made in 1969. It is beautiful. My newest RR prefix 700 had virtually no primary extraction. The bolt handle dented on the camming surface as if it was made of soft pot metal. The firing pin spring had substantial drag on the interior of the bolt. Then...the extractor fell out as the pocket it sits in was not deep enough. It was a mess.

Now, it's been fully worked over, trued, bolt replaced with a PTG unit, new FP assembly, new trigger, Broughton barrel, and a McM stock. It's great...about $3k later.

In the end, why dump that money into a 700? Frankly, I wouldn't do it again.

If you want a round action rifle, there are a ton of great action makers that provide low cost, but very good 700 clones. Definace, Stiller, and so on. My MK 13 is on a Stiller and it is solid...not perfect as 700s and clones don't like to eject live rounds in big calibers, but that is a known issue.

YMMV...but I just don't see the value in working over a 700 when you could get a better base rifle for the same or less money. Factory guns...Tika, Sako, or a Model 70. Build? Stiller for round actions at low cost.

YMMV

+1 I have a Rem 700 BDL in 270 I bought in the 60s it has many head of big game including elk, bears, deer, javelina and the only thing I have ever had done to it is a trigger job by Norm Thompson. Back in the day I would hunt with it 50 to 100 days per year. My son now has it. It still shoots nickel sized groups at 100 yards.

I bought a new Rem XCR II in 375 H&H in 2011 and it wouldn't chamber Remington factory rounds. I had some work done on it (Sako extractor, bolt handle welded on, rechambered to 375 Weatherby, back to the original Remington 700 trigger so the bolt stays locked when on safe) and it's a great rifle now is as weather proof as it gets, and only weighs 7 1/4 lbs with a Leupold 2-7x Firedot scope on it. That being said, I would buy a new Model now 70 given the choice.

What drove my question was curiousity. I currently own 15 (I think) of them dating back to the 60's and the newest is 4 months old. I'd say over the years, I've owned 25+ of them. I've done the obligatory trigger work on them but I have never changed the triggers on any of them. I've never had a bolt handle fall off, nor a extractor that failed. I've never had one fire spontainiouly. Ever one of them with a bit of TLC and good load development would shoot into 1.25" or less. I daresay, I've not spent 3K all together on the work I've done on all of them.
No doubt, considering that Remington makes more rifles than all of the rest combined, you're gonna get a clinker sneak through QC every so often. And, of course, whoever gets it is gonna go online and use that example of one to condemn every Remington that has ever been made and all future manufactures. I guess I've been lucky
I am further curious, you say a round receiver could be more easily make into an accurate receiver as if that is a bad thing?

quote:

Originally posted by Lamar:
buy a Bergara and put a decent scope on it.

you'll be wondering why you'd bother spending the money on the Remington your gonna do all that work to, to get it almost as good as the off the rack Spanish made rifle.

+1

Well it seems to me if you like Remington 700's than that's what you should have regardless of what anyone else thinks.

I guess if it was me I would try to find a pre 1983 one that still locks the bolt and is made better, then customize it to your hearts content. There is a ton of parts available out there to make it into whatever you desire.

quote:

Originally posted by Cougarz:
Well it seems to me if you like Remington 700's than that's what you should have regardless of what anyone else thinks.

I guess if it was me I would try to find a pre 1983 one that still locks the bolt and is made better, then customize it to your hearts content. There is a ton of parts available out there to make it into whatever you desire.

Agreed, while Mausers are my favorite bolt action rifles I have a 700 270 Win that over a period of several years has been modified several times. It now has a 26" #3 Shilen ss barrel and a McMillen stock. I know that I would never get what I have invested in it were I to sell it, I don't care. There are more important things than nickels and dimes.

Actually the newer receivers are much better. They are CNC machined. A few are out there that have the bolt handle improperly placed and do not have enough primary extraction. That can easily be fixed at a very reasonable price by the right person. I think all of mine have PT&G 3 pos safeties.
I bought one of PT&G's "specials" that had a new Remington reworked receiver, a crappy new Remington trigger, and PT&G's new 1 piece bolt with the M16 extractor. It also has the small diameter firing pin tip.
It was $380.+shipping.
Now if you would Like I have a new unfired Montana receiver with trigger and bottom metal and a new Shilen match barrel chambered in 300 Win. Mag and unfired for $1000. + actual shipping.

My two favorite rifles are the 60s vintage Rem 700 270 I gave my son and my CZ 550 (reworked by Wayne at AHR) in 500 Jeffery. Both are great rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
Actually the newer receivers are much better. They are CNC machined. A few are out there that have the bolt handle improperly placed and do not have enough primary extraction. That can easily be fixed at a very reasonable price by the right person. I think all of mine have PT&G 3 pos safeties.
I bought one of PT&G's "specials" that had a new Remington reworked receiver, a crappy new Remington trigger, and PT&G's new 1 piece bolt with the M16 extractor. It also has the small diameter firing pin tip.
It was $380.+shipping.
Now if you would Like I have a new unfired Montana receiver with trigger and bottom metal and a new Shilen match barrel chambered in 300 Win. Mag and unfired for $1000. + actual shipping.

I'd like to find that deal at $380, I'd be a lot more enthusiastic about building on a Remington again if I could. When I check the site it seems to be double that; and that is a decent deal compared buying an action and getting the bolt fitted to it. It's decent against buying and fitting the one piece bolt to an action you already have.

The list price doesn't look so hot compared to say a Defiance, and neither does the action.

Just my opinion of course.

You might want to go to their home page.
http://pacifictoolandgauge.com...mington-trigger.html

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
You might want to go to their home page.
http://pacifictoolandgauge.com...mington-trigger.html

It's sort of in the wrong country for me.

quote:

Originally posted by Dogleg:

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
You might want to go to their home page.
http://pacifictoolandgauge.com...mington-trigger.html

It's sort of in the wrong country for me.

Hey feller, you said you would jump on a deal like that and said it wasn't on their website.
Maybe you need to move.

Sale price in a foreign country doesn't help me much, but that isn't the entire point.Short action doesn't help either.

More to the point of price comparing is scrolling around that same page and comparing everything that isn't a blow-out price on a short action Rem against the Stillers on the same page.

I do like the low US prices, but not enough to move. Hunting is too good here.

Move to Alaska.

www.inrutrifles.com
By Mark Dejoung and Mark Lembke.
These guys offer a sweet blueprinted Rem. 700 for around 3k with a K&P cut rifled barrel, Jewel trigger, 20 moa rail for around 3k.
From what I've seen the K&P barrels shoot very well.
Well worth consideration.

Ended up going the CZ550 route. Going to order a B&C stock and eventually get it off to Wayne at AHR for an upgrade and gunkote.

Need some help with scope rings/bases. See my dilemma with them here: http://forums.accuratereloadin...261052632#6261052632