I have an AK Griz/Caribou hunt planned and I'm thinking about a new rifle. My one problem is I like a short fast handling rifle; one that is easy to handle inthe brush and is easy to get in and out of a saddle scabbard. I was thinking about a .338 WM for this and future AK/Candada/Africa hunts. I also like the idea of a .338-06...

My question is how much velocity fo you loose on a .338 WM if you have a shoreter (say 22 inch) barrel? Does anyone have one? What do you think of the idea?

I'm thinking it'd make a handy but powerful rifle that you could pick up ammo for easily if in a pinch. OTOH if the short barrel causes enough velocity loss I might as well get a .338-06 and save both powder and recoil.

Whaddaya think??

I get a avg of 150fps to 200fps more out of my WM compared to my 338-06. If one is planing shots out pass 250 I would go with the WM But if one is going to shoot closer no critter is going to beable to tell the differants.

Blast from 22".338win would bother me more than 60fps vel.loss.....
If you need to find factory ammo in a pinch .338/06 is not your best choice.

With the regions you mention, .30/06 & 375H&H still make the most pragmatic sense.

This used HCR.338win at Cabelas may interest,
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas...sp?hierarchyId=10473
to buy new would require you to supply the receiver + $3000....+ it loooks like it has Blackburn bottom metal which adds more to the new price.....dock the barrel 2" and those cosmetic scrathes are mostly gone.

I carried my 22" barreled 338 Win Mag to Alaska a few years ago on a bear hunt and it did fine.It started life as a 26"Boss gun M70 that I had cut and re-crowned.I think the shorter barrel is much easier to manage.

The .338 Winchester Magnum is exactly what I have used in the past for expeditions like yours. You can figure 30 fps/bbl in of velocity loss or gain down to 20 inches. However, I'd look close at the .375 Ruger or .416 Ruger now.

I never had a 338WM that liked a short barrel. 22inch worked okay with 24inch being better, but the cartridge never liked a 20inch barrel for me. Many have done well in the field with such a rifle, but when you actually clock the rifle, most I've seen ended up being a lot of powder and bang for little gain in velocity.

I really like the 375Ruger for horsepower from a short barrel '06 length cartridge, and now the newer 338RCM appears to have fallen close to the tree with a bunch of horsepower from a short barrel 308 length cartridge. I'd prefer either Ruger cartridges over a short barrel 338WM. I also don't think I'd opt for a 338WM with a barrel under 22" again.

Later

I believe it was Rifle Magazine that had a little article on the SAKO Mannlicher in 338 Win Mag, and the Handy Rifle in 375 H&H.

Both rifles had 20" barrels. They were suprized on how little fps loss there was. I have hunted with a coule of 20" 375 H&H's and I do not find them to be too loud.

I do not notice any loss of killing power.

22" is ok with a 338 Win. . A 20 " turns it into a not too fast ,kind of noisy 338/06 I,ve had 2 20 " 338,s and chronographed both . they both lost over 100 fps .. I don,t like to loose fps .....

A 22" barrel is pretty easy to deal with .. And tho I don,t remember ever seeing a box of 338/06 ammo for sale in any shop I,ve been in . The 338 Win mag is available pretty much everywhere ..... The 375 Ruger is pretty popular from what I have seen .. Ammo available all over the place even tho most places only have Hornady and sometimes your stuck with a bullet weight you may not like . . For me thats 300 gr bullets , so I make sure I always have the 270gr stuff . But in Alaska either bullet will do all you need .The 300 drops some beyond 300 yards.. But you don,t do much big game shooting @ beyond 300 yards ..

I purchased a 20" Dumolin mannlicher in 1964. I shot it out to 400yds on caribou and as close as 20 yds on deer. One black bear, 5 browns several caribou, oddly enough no moose but everything shot with it died - quickly. Never did chronograph the thing but it didn't seem to matter to the game. I'll not do anymore 400 yd shots with it but just stand closer.

Pard has a factory Sako in .338. Came with a 19" factory bbl. IIRC it's the Forester model. It killed stuff pretty good here in Far North.

I personally wouldn't do one shorter than 22". My personal .338 is 24".

My first custom rifle and the rifle I used the most in 22 years in AK was a 22" barrel 338 WM. I got 2740 fps with 250 NP's, 2820 fps with 225 SAF's and 2910 fps with the 210 NP's. This pretty much covered everything from sheep to brown bears and did a great job on a couple of safaris. Great caliber and a 22" barrel is plenty.

Mark

So it sounds like a 22"-23" barrel would be the best lenght to maximize velocity and minimize muzzle blast while preserving quick handling and good balance.

i have had a few 338wm rifles...
factory 24" tubes, and all my custom builds where a 23" tube...
if you prefer a 22" bbl, go for it...for hunting balistics, difference will be unseen imo.

for me..23" is THEE sweetspot on a 338wm

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
My first custom rifle and the rifle I used the most in 22 years in AK was a 22" barrel 338 WM. I got 2740 fps with 250 NP's, 2820 fps with 225 SAF's and 2910 fps with the 210 NP's. This pretty much covered everything from sheep to brown bears and did a great job on a couple of safaris. Great caliber and a 22" barrel is plenty.

Mark

.

What was your load to give you 2740 fps with a 250 grain Nosler from a 22" barrel ............
I,ve had and used 9 different 338 Win Mags . I was never able to get that velocity .....

I have had 12 different .338WM rifles and loaded for and shot several others. The best loads I have are RE-22-76-77 grs.-250NP with either FED. 215M or CCI 250 primers in FED. or WIN. brass, these give 2800 fps-mv. out of my four P-64 Mod. 70 Alaskan's 25" tubes. They group under a m.o.a.

Almost as fast is H-4350-70 grs. and these are MAX. safe loads, IMO, although I have never found a .338 that will not safely handle them. HTH.

I have a BAR 338 that has a factory length 20" barrel and I had my model 70 338 cut to 21". Both are accurate and good to handle, especially in the thick stuff. For my uses, the longer barrels are just awkward. I still have my old Ruger 77 with a 24" barrel. Great rifle but more barrel than the caliber needs. The model 70 was born with a 26" barrel which may have been fine in open country but not the areas that I was hunting. The loss of velocity for the 338 is very small down to about a 21" barrel.

Going by Sako's testing with their Battue and Hunter rifles, there is a good chunk of velocity lost in just 3" of barrel. Even if you use the conservative rule of thumb being 1% velocity per i inch barrel, your still looking at a good little chunk going from 24 inches to 20 inches. At 20 inches, you'll still have an extremely effective rifle, but in reality, you'd be buring a bunch of powder with magnum recoil while ending up closer to having a 338-06. Other cartridges may be better performers with short barrels, but for me, 338WM is best served out of a 24inch tube with 22" being on the short end

Best

Just my 0.2 cents, have you considered the .358 Norma Mag. From what I understand it gets 2850 fps with 250's from a 22 or 23 inch barrel. Seems to have an excellent reputation in Alaska as well.

quote:

Originally posted by Dewey:
I have had 12 different .338WM rifles and loaded for and shot several others. The best loads I have are RE-22-76-77 grs.-250NP with either FED. 215M or CCI 250 primers in FED. or WIN. brass, these give 2800 fps-mv. out of my four P-64 Mod. 70 Alaskan's 25" tubes. They group under a m.o.a.

Almost as fast is H-4350-70 grs. and these are MAX. safe loads, IMO, although I have never found a .338 that will not safely handle them. HTH.

..

When I was loading for the 338 I was never able to find any RL22 when I was in town buying powder ..... The loading manuals vary alot for max velocities with the Win mag .... When I discovered I could get 2800 fps with my 9.3x64 B with 250 gr TSX from a 21" barrel with safe pressures , I lost interest in alot of other calibers ......Now I,m revisiting some of them due to brass scarcity ....